Ultrasone PRO900 - Page 56

Quote:

Originally Posted by tisb0b 

I didn't post this review on head-fi but when I owned the Pro900's and AD900's I did write this review comparing the two, the bottom half is mainly the relevant area: http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1363862 

 

Bottom line I think I found the Pro900's to be a clear step up from the AD900's.  
 

@Sferic: Thanks for the impressions

Thanks tisb0b!

Interesting how you describe the differences between the drums also. I was going to say I found the drum fills to be quite, well.. boring on the AD900s, and the separation between each drum just isn't very good. It also seems like the PRO 900s might fix my kick problem.. huzzah! Without that extra kick I just seem to find metal/rock through the AD900s just a little boring.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sferic 

Got my 900's about 2 weeks ago and I'm really happy with them. My preferred phones are my Grado PS1000's, but needed a closed set for when the household is "busy".

 

First got the HFI580's. Then got Pro750's.

 

After burn in, did a Kees'ish mod. Dynamat Extreme (with electrical tape covering the foil) in the circles and a small crescent on the metal plate. This really tightens up the bass. I also put a tiny amount of acoustic fiberfill to kill any standing waves & bring out the treble a hair. I'm pushing 50, and still I started with what I thought was just a little bit and on both cans opened them up twice to remove more of the fiberfill until they sounded right. If you are young and have great sensitivity to highs you might not need any fiberfill, but I firmly believe the Dynamat really improves the bass tightness - plastic is just not rigid enough as a housing material for good bass.

 

So, the 580's are AWESOME for techno/electronica. But switch to thick textured classical or subtle vocals, and they become a bit muddy. So I'd switch to the 750's depending on type of music.

 

Then I got the LDMKiii and rolled some tubes, and let's just say that machine is a miracle. My LC CuteBeyond with upgraded op amps (Burr Brown) and Supplier power source are in a drawer now. (DAC is Apogee Duet, needed inputs as well as outputs).

 

The HFI580's sounded better than ever with the tube amp, but the 750's became kind of hard to listen to.

 

Have to say the 900's are best of both worlds. Both highs & lows beat the 750's by a long shot. I was pretty skeptical because other than color, they look exactly alike. I wondered if the only difference was some resistor or capacitor or another messing with the freq response, but no, these are truly different.

 

I'd still give the 580's a slight edge on bass, there's just no substitute for those 50mm drivers. But the 900's come close enough where I don't have to switch at all anymore. The 750's have, sadly, become dust collectors. The HFI580's earn their keep as the best bass phones. And honestly, the treble is pretty damn great. Plus, they are easy to drive from any portable. (Pro series need more amplification). But the 900's are an incredible set of all round audiophile phones.

 

Not sure why so many folks think Ultrasones aren't good with tube amps. If the source is good, and you have the right model, they convey the soundstage & warmth really well. Having the PS1000's as a reference has been really helpful. The Pro 900's can't put you in a room with the musicians like they can, but it doesn't feel like going from a Mercedes into a 1992 Geo. They are comfortable, warm, and very involving with plenty of detail and some great thumping bass.

 

 

I just got my 900s yesterday. I really wanted to love them, but seems like it's not happening soon ... 

Tried Kee's mod, and variations of it,  while the bass did seem more controlled, the highs became really harsh. I'm also thinking that something in this price range shouldn't need so much modding. (after so many rounds of opening and closing, I think I'm close to stripping one of the screw heads)

I've got a few days if I want to return them, but I've read in more than a few places that these things need at least 150-200hrs of burn in before they'll sound good, which is about 6-8 days of 24/7 playback. 

Anyone with any thoughts? Should I wait for the burn in and if I still dislike them, sell them at a slight loss in the used market? Or just cut my losses now and return them for the full price?

Can someone describe how proper burn-in will affect/improve the sound?

Thanks! 

I need to say this again - I REALLY want to love these babies ..... 

Jeremy

Return them. Even after Kees mod they still have hints of being analytical. But make sure you have the detachable cable completely screwed in, sometimes it takes some force, but don't overdo it.

OK, now I've got about 40hrs of continuous burn in on the 900s ... as a Live Sound Engineer, I can think of the following analogy for the sound - 

It's like doing sound check in an empty 2000 seater auditorium, where the subwoofers seem to be slightly too powerful and the low-end resonates in the building. Now, when the auditorium is full of people (absorbing sound), the mix seems to become perfect, because the resonant bass and harsh treble are naturally attenuated.

With ~40hrs of burn in, it gives me the feeling that about 500 people just walked into the auditorium and tightened up the sound just that little bit. The bass is still strong, but slightly more controlled and the highs seem to already start getting acceptable.

Crossing my fingers now that with another ~100hours of burn in, the bass will tighten up even more. Then it should almost be perfect - the bass will no doubt still be heavy, but hopefully with less "blooming".

I also realized the mastering of the source material plays a very important role (more important than some other headphones) for these cans, especially in the lower regions. It's obvious whether the bass is properly controlled or not - very tell tale - I can now start to pick out which studio's material will sound good (or bad) through these headphones. I think I might just keep these cans, if only as a reference for mixing/mastering in the studio. 

Will report back again after 100hours burn in.

Jeremy

surely the ultrasone "titanium driver" will always sound analyitical,, but with some simple mod it can sound musical too,, if you found after the kees mod its still too analytical,, you can put some self adhesive felt in the inside or outside of the metal buffer board,, it can dramatically reduce the analitical and metalic feel without sacrificing much detail,, the amount of the adhesive felt can be tune until you find it enough for your taste.. 

you can also add some blu tack in the back of the driver to make the driver less resonanced for better controlled bass..

@jermng

thx for the impression looking forward to further impression..

Quote:

Originally Posted by santsant 

surely the ultrasone "titanium driver" will always sound analyitical,, but with some simple mod it can sound musical too,, if you found after the kees mod its still too analytical,, you can put some self adhesive felt in the inside or outside of the metal buffer board,, it can dramatically reduce the analitical and metalic feel without sacrificing much detail,, the amount of the adhesive felt can be tune until you find it enough for your taste.. 

 

you can also add some blu tack in the back of the driver to make the driver less resonanced for better controlled bass..

 

@jermng

 

thx for the impression looking forward to further impression..

Thanks for the tip! The highs are OK for me now. 

I'm more concerned about the bass. It's the first time I'm hearing about the blutack and though it does sound interesting, I'm apprehensive of opening the cans again - at the rate I'm going, I'm pretty sure I'll strip one or more of the screw heads soon. 

Do you have more info/links to the blutack method? 

I'll probably try it after more burn-in time.

actually the adhesive felt also reducing some quantity of the bass,, but if you find the treble sufficient,, you can do the blu tac mod..

sorry i cant give you some pic but,, if you open the buffer board you can see that in the back of the driver,, ultrasone use black round hard plastick to place the driver..  as you can see from the pic below (i find it from google)

all you have to do is add the blu tack to cover the black plastick surface,, but just make sure you dont cover any hole and dont use too much blu tack or covering it too much,,  just add it sufficiently until you find it sturdy enough too make the driver not resonancing..

and for the screw,, im also finding it strip too easy.. you must use the right screwless to open it and open it gently,, dont force it if youre not so sure the screwless fit,, it will only break the screw head.. actually i found some screw spare in hardware store in my town,, but i dont know if you can find it..

Quote:

Originally Posted by santsant 

actually the adhesive felt also reducing some quantity of the bass,, but if you find the treble sufficient,, you can do the blu tac mod..

 

sorry i cant give you some pic but,, if you open the buffer board you can see that in the back of the driver,, ultrasone use black round hard plastick to place the driver..  as you can see from the pic below (i find it from google)

 

 

 

all you have to do is add the blu tack to cover the black plastick surface,, but just make sure you dont cover any hole and dont use too much blu tack or covering it too much,,  just add it sufficiently until you find it sturdy enough too make the driver not resonancing..

 

and for the screw,, im also finding it strip too easy.. you must use the right screwless to open it and open it gently,, dont force it if youre not so sure the screwless fit,, it will only break the screw head.. actually i found some screw spare in hardware store in my town,, but i dont know if you can find it..

Thanks so much! I will try that first thing in the morning!

Just to further clarify, you mean to put it ON the black plastic around the holes right? Also, how much is recommended? Just a sliver? Or coat the entire plastic with a thin layer?

I was just wondering, would it affect the bass if I put the blu tac on the ear cups itself? That would logically deaden the resonation of the cups, but will it affect the highs as well?

Normally, I would just try it out, but I'm asking so much now cos I don't want to have to open the cans too many unnecessary times ... 

Thank you so much!

J

just a thin layer of blu tak around the hole to the side around the black plastic driver,, and dont stick it to close to the driver hole or i think it will mess up the air flow around the hole..

here is a picture i found from google,, wasnt mine,, but maybe it will give you a picture about the mod.. i dont know what he uses to cover the driver though,, he didnt cover the side of the driver (which i find necessary) and he stick it too close to the driver hole..

http://www.audiophile-id.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=8322.0;attach=6972;image

covering the cup with blu tak might work,, but if you plan to put felt or cotton on top of it,, it will make the damper too thick and i'm afraid it will reduce the  soundstage. if its work for you go on. ill stick with covering the cup only with a very thin layer of felt..  maybe you can put the blu tac in some surface of the cup that arent covered by the cotton/felt damper..

and youre welcome.. 

forget taking the plate on and off! just make up a matrix of felt squares about 5mm in width. start placing them all over the plate....and over half+ of the sound holes joined togehter! yes! cover a good proportion of the sound holes! (dont fiddle with the diaphragm things) adjust and replace pads as necessary. stick on jeans first so felt not too tacky.

it'll be just like filling your theatre with people.

i had the massively forward treble toned down so much that i had to re-open one of my felt pad covered holes for my sensitive ears. Perfection!

this is all very similar to physically tuning mesh covered ribbon tweeters on loudspeakers. you can go from zero-max using the felt on the mesh as both a barrier and a deadener. unbelievable results can be achieved.

just stop removing that plate! it is literally a 15 second job to reposition the padlets. i use the thicker felt...maybe 3-4mm thick.

the sky is the limit with this. try to remember which way you put your pads on, and repeat it each time so they are molding to your head.

i burn all of my phones in extremely hard. if they cant handle it they go into the bin.

i'm a fussy prick, and these are now my go to phones. before i fiddled with them i would have turfed them.

forget the rubbish frequency stats for headphones: they are the only phones that can capture and get 'close' to the growling deep bass of my standmount two way Aurum Cantus V3M loudspeakers with 6.5 inch drivers (in a well set up room)....yep, it does show what weak garbage bass the majority of this entire forum has now normalised. and its the easiest instant A-B in the audio world LOL.

imo if your phones cant match a 6inch stand mount for depth and drive, then bin it. you've been had.

Thank you all!  

So I went out and bought a pack of blutack and some adhesive felt, all ready to experiment with the various mod methods .... 

Keep in mind the Pro 900s have been playing almost 24/7 since Sat, which give them about 80hours of burn in time now. 

Picked them up and put them on, boy was I surprised!!

The bass is so much more controlled now than before!! In fact, I'm honestly trying to remember if I had left any felt or cotton inside, but I'm convinced the phones are really in their totally unmodded state. Bass is still powerful, but just very much more controlled - less resonance.

The treble has also tamed itself quite nicely.

It seems they have gone from headphones I could "live with" to headphones I am starting to like ... and hopefully eventually fall in love with.  

Thanks to all for your very helpful suggestions along this journey of breaking in these cans!

I couldn't be happier at the moment. I thought the Pro900 sounded very good unamped but the D12 has shot these headphones into the stratosphere in terms of sound quality. It's hard to believe for me. I should get the screwdriver for the mod in a few days but the D12 is doing an excellent job at handling the Pro 900's bass. If they end up sounding even better after the mod, these will be my first-choice cans for a very long time!

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoveAndHonor 

I couldn't be happier at the moment. I thought the Pro900 sounded very good unamped but the D12 has shot these headphones into the stratosphere in terms of sound quality. ...

It has been asked many times on here regarding the best amp to pair with these amazing headphones but there does not seem to be a clear winner.

I would like to budget up to $200 for a very portable amp that would keep most of the sound that the HP naturally has.  I have not even done the Kees mod but I love them still.  Did you do any research before giong with the D12?

What I am afraid of, is getting an amp (and assuming it makes it sound so much better) and getting spoiled by that and need/want to carry the amp with me all the time.  And if I don't carry the amp with me, I will become 'disappointed' with the unamped sound.  An analogy would be loving chicken wings but then adding spices to it.  Then going back to unspiced chicken wings.  Might be kind of blah.  OK, not the best analogy but I think you get what I am trying to say.  Another analogy is the HP upgrade-itus.  Once you upgrade, you rarely ever want to go back to the previous HPs, unless it was for a different sound signature/mood.

Did any of you have this same fear?  Oh, and what is a good amp that meets what I am looking for?  Thanks!
 

I suggest maybe looking at a good portable headphone amplifier if you're worried about that. A good one will be able to amp the PRO 900 sufficiently and you can carry them around as much of them are only half the size of an ipod.

Anyone able to tell me how the PRO 900s fair with rock/metal, specifically stuff like Underoath/August Burns Red etc? I like my AD900s, but I love to hear a punchy, thumping kick drum in my music and the AD900s don't provide that at all, thinking the PRO 900 might be my next headphones. I'd get the Grado RS1s but I think the PRO 900 might be a bit more of an all rounder for my computer gaming/ambient/acoustic music. Would be running the PRO 900 from my RSA Predator.