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Denon AH-D7000 - Page 375

post #5611 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phos View Post

The reason for the custom wood cups is to increase the volume of air behind the driver, don't think I'd call that kool aid, at least without seeing measurements or having heard them.

Well, the drivers are standard direct radiating and the cups are semi-open, so I personally don't think the depth and density of the cups are a significant influence. Consider how different the D2000 and D7000 cups are and yet how very similar the two headphones sound.

That's my logic at least.
post #5612 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmfish View Post

 

Level 1 Mod (damping and earpads). I personally do not imbibe in cable or wood kool aid. wink.gif


Ok thanks will wait for your impressions especially comparing them when stock pads are used cause Tyll doesn't like angled pads(at least when used instead of stock pads and no damping mod applied)

post #5613 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmfish View Post


Well, the drivers are standard direct radiating and the cups are semi-open, so I personally don't think the depth and density of the cups are a significant influence. Consider how different the D2000 and D7000 cups are and yet how very similar the two headphones sound.
That's my logic at least.

My personal experience is that the wood of the cup actually affect the sound. I had a set of Cocobolo and a set of Amboyna Burl for a D2000. The Amboyna is a lot heavier and dense wood compared to Cocobolo. The sound was different of the same D2000 with the different cups. The Ambonya was faster and tighter bass while the Cocobolo was more relax and warmer sound.

post #5614 of 7185

How much of an improvement is it turning it into a balanced headphone?


Edited by szanella - 9/1/12 at 1:31pm
post #5615 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by szanella View Post

How much of an improvement is it turning it into a balanced headphone?

In the case do the Denon (D2000 and D7000) is a slight improvement. The headphones that I noticed the major improvement are the HDXXX and T1 so far. Efficient or easy to drive headphones benefit less IMO.

post #5616 of 7185
I suppose it's possible that the heavier wood is actually dampening resonances in the headphone structure itself. But low freq wavelengths are so long that I doubt if one wood attenuates the waves any better than another.

I've never seen an LA modded Denon in person, let alone two at the same time, so it's unlikely I'll ever get the chance to compare different wood cups side-by-side like you have.

Now, balanced cables I have compared side-by-side. There is no difference to my ears and no science that I know of to explain why a balanced connection would sound different, let alone better.

Your experience is different though, and I respect that. biggrin.gif

For me, the largest difference in sound from one pair of Denons to another remains the fit of the earpad against my head and the tightness of the seal. This alone is the only thing that dramatically changes the sound to my ears (so far).

I am excited to get my D7000's back from Mark and of course I'll post my impressions of the changes/improvements that I hear.
Edited by palmfish - 9/1/12 at 4:33pm
post #5617 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman59 View Post

In the case do the Denon (D2000 and D7000) is a slight improvement. The headphones that I noticed the major improvement are the HDXXX and T1 so far. Efficient or easy to drive headphones benefit less IMO.

 
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmfish View Post

I suppose it's possible that the heavier wood is actually dampening resonances in the headphone structure itself. But low freq wavelengths are so long that I doubt if one wood attenuates the waves any better than another.
I've never seen an LA modded Denon in person, let alone two at the same time, so it's unlikely I'll ever get the chance to compare different wood cups side-by-side like you have.
Now, balanced cables I have compared side-by-side. There is no difference to my ears and no science that I know of to explain why a balanced connection would sound different, let alone better.
Your experience is different though, and I respect that. biggrin.gif
For me, the largest difference in sound from one pair of Denons to another remains the fit of the earpad against my head and the tightness of the seal. This alone is the only thing that dramatically changes the sound to my ears (so far).
I am excited to get my D7000's back from Mark and of course I'll post my impressions of the changes/improvements that I hear.

 

 

Thanks a lot!

 

Both my DAC and Amp are balanced, so I was considering turning my D7000 into balanced.

What caught my attention was the considerable difference in bass response that the graphs show at headphone.com, when comparing both balanced and unbalanced.

 

well, I guess if tere is a positive difference, its worth doing it.

though I completely agree that fit and earpad definately have a larger impact on the sound.

the biggest example is using j$ denon pads on my Ultrasone Pro 900 - its an insane improvement!

 

cheers!

 

stefano

post #5618 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmfish View Post

I suppose it's possible that the heavier wood is actually dampening resonances in the headphone structure itself. But low freq wavelengths are so long that I doubt if one wood attenuates the waves any better than another.
I've never seen an LA modded Denon in person, let alone two at the same time, so it's unlikely I'll ever get the chance to compare different wood cups side-by-side like you have.
Now, balanced cables I have compared side-by-side. There is no difference to my ears and no science that I know of to explain why a balanced connection would sound different, let alone better.
Your experience is different though, and I respect that. biggrin.gif
For me, the largest difference in sound from one pair of Denons to another remains the fit of the earpad against my head and the tightness of the seal. This alone is the only thing that dramatically changes the sound to my ears (so far).
I am excited to get my D7000's back from Mark and of course I'll post my impressions of the changes/improvements that I hear.

I totally agree that fit will influence the sound. A good seal is critical for a good sound.

 

The theory behind the balanced headphone configuration is that the driver is receiving double the power than in single ended. In balance you have power in the positive signal and also the negative. The negative is the inverted positive signal. So the driver is working more in a pull-push configuration and being more under control.

 

That is why a balanced headphone amplifier has 4 amplification sections. One positive and one negative per channel.

post #5619 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman59 View Post

I totally agree that fit will influence the sound. A good seal is critical for a good sound.

 

The theory behind the balanced headphone configuration is that the driver is receiving double the power than in single ended. In balance you have power in the positive signal and also the negative. The negative is the inverted positive signal. So the driver is working more in a pull-push configuration and being more under control.

 

That is why a balanced headphone amplifier has 4 amplification sections. One positive and one negative per channel.

I've never been terribly convinced by the push pull explanation, but on the other hand the signal between the + and - channels on a balanced amp are going to be the same, but the noise will not, so it effectively increases signal to noise.  

post #5620 of 7185

I believe the power required to power a 50mm headphone driver (especially one as sensitive as the Denon) and the noise levels of pretty much any headphone amplifier are so low that both effects, if they exist, are completely inaudible.

post #5621 of 7185

So just now I thought i'd try a temporary Markl Mod to my D5K's. I linded the left wooden cup with 2oz of blu-tac adhesive puddy, almost like clay. 

 

After putting it back together which can be tedious, I started up some bass-heavy music to see if any absorbing was going on. I could tell by knocking on the cups on my head there was less of a hollow sound on the damped one, but dammed if I could tell the difference with the soundstage and bass heavy music. Even the vibration didn't see to be stopped any.

Maybe I was expecting something too dramatic? I could have done more tests but it seemed obvious I had gained nothing here so I took them back out.


Edited by RushNerd - 9/2/12 at 12:35pm
post #5622 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by RushNerd View Post

So just now I thought i'd try a temporary Markl Mod to my D5K's. I linded the left wooden cup with 2oz of blu-tac adhesive puddy, almost like clay. 

 

After putting it back together which can be tedious, I started up some bass-heavy music to see if any absorbing was going on. I could tell by knocking on the cups on my head there was less of a hollow sound on the damped one, but dammed if I could tell the difference with the soundstage and bass heavy music. Even the vibration didn't see to be stopped any.

Maybe I was expecting something too dramatic? I could have done more tests but it seemed obvious I had gained nothing here so I took them back out.

 

Now try something a lot simpler. Put your music back on and stick your fingers between the rear of the pad behind your ear and your head and pull the headphones gradually away - not in front, just the back.

post #5623 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmfish View Post

 

Now try something a lot simpler. Put your music back on and stick your fingers between the rear of the pad behind your ear and your head and pull the headphones gradually away - not in front, just the back.

Ya i've tried that a bunch, I never thought much of it aside from breaking the seal I see where it would give a more open headphone sound but it's gonna kill the low end.

post #5624 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by RushNerd View Post

So just now I thought i'd try a temporary Markl Mod to my D5K's. I linded the left wooden cup with 2oz of blu-tac adhesive puddy, almost like clay. 

 

After putting it back together which can be tedious, I started up some bass-heavy music to see if any absorbing was going on. I could tell by knocking on the cups on my head there was less of a hollow sound on the damped one, but dammed if I could tell the difference with the soundstage and bass heavy music. Even the vibration didn't see to be stopped any.

Maybe I was expecting something too dramatic? I could have done more tests but it seemed obvious I had gained nothing here so I took them back out.

 

Does Locktite have the same properties as Dynamat? A lot of the bass reduction itself comes from removing resonances on all the pieces of the assembly rather than just the cups.

post #5625 of 7185
Quote:
Originally Posted by RushNerd View Post

So just now I thought i'd try a temporary Markl Mod to my D5K's. I linded the left wooden cup with 2oz of blu-tac adhesive puddy, almost like clay. 

 

After putting it back together which can be tedious, I started up some bass-heavy music to see if any absorbing was going on. I could tell by knocking on the cups on my head there was less of a hollow sound on the damped one, but dammed if I could tell the difference with the soundstage and bass heavy music. Even the vibration didn't see to be stopped any.

Maybe I was expecting something too dramatic? I could have done more tests but it seemed obvious I had gained nothing here so I took them back out.

 

Heck yeah, warhammer themed cans! :)

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