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Where is Singlepower? Where is Mikhail? - Page 92

post #1366 of 1953
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icarium View Post
Fundamentally the question is if you think if Mikhail blatantly lies to his customers that is okay or you don't believe Mikhail has lied at all and his customers are trying to jam him up due to long wait periods and mob mentality.

If you believe in #1... then I hope you recognize that will forever be the minority opinion and stop wasting your time trying to defend it.

If you believe in #2 then that is incredibly insulting and simply not the situation. I was a staunch Mikhail/Singlepower defender and it is absolutely not the 5-6 months I had to wait that angers me.
It seems to me there is a third alternative. And that is to say the following:

1. Mikhail has done something seriously wrong (e.g., he lied to certain customers), there need to be consequences, and people who have been victimized (who are rightly pissed off and emotional about this, as anyone would be) need to be made whole or have their issues remedied in some way.

2. The fact that he has done what he has done does not mean that he ripped off everyone who has ever dealt with him (or that his conduct is similar to murder), that all his amps were poorly built, that they all sounded like krap and always have, that anyone who thinks or thought otherwise was duped, and/or that none of his amps have any value whatsoever.

3. The fact that some of his amps sound great or that he treated some people very well or provided good customer service does not mean that he didn't treat other people very poorly, didn't rip some people off or lie, didn't provide some very poor quality products in an attempt to cover himself, and that people who have been victimized should not be compensated or have restitution made to them.

Why are so many people on this thread trying to put people in such polar opposite camps? I don't get it.
post #1367 of 1953
We're not trying to send him to jail. Just saying that if he's going to rip off people in this community, he shouldn't be able to come to community events with impunity.
post #1368 of 1953
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icarium View Post
Shrug... could give it a shot by finding examples of people who have killed themselves or been killed for sums far less than thousands of dollars.

Anyway it's a pretty spurious argument, so let's end it at that. I don't think that was that dude's main point anyways. If you have been burned like those of us who have been burned then maybe you'd have some weight to your arguments.

How about you get scammed for a couple thousand and we'll see how well you deal with it. If you go through what I've been through and want to martyr yourself for the sake of Mikhail then go ahead. The rest of us do not want to do that.

i don't know what you think Mikhail has done or his motivations, but you can either go back and read in detail my posts with many many emails and see the inconsistencies and lies that he has fed me for many, many months, or trust me that it is so.

Fundamentally the question is if you think if Mikhail blatantly lies to his customers that is okay or you don't believe Mikhail has lied at all and his customers are trying to jam him up due to long wait periods and mob mentality.

If you believe in #1... then I hope you recognize that will forever be the minority opinion and stop wasting your time trying to defend it.

If you believe in #2 then that is incredibly insulting and simply not the situation. I was a staunch Mikhail/Singlepower defender and it is absolutely not the 5-6 months I had to wait that angers me.

Maybe you should spend a little bit more time explaining your stance rather than trying to snipe at things others are saying.

I've never defended Mikhail's actions; only my opinion that the majority of his customer base is probably satisfied with the products they're received. And I'm not denying your, nor anyone else whose invested large sums of money for a product not received, lied to, etcetera should be angry as hell. I'm sure I would be, as well.

I'm in disagreement on two things. One, the comparison of his actions to those of others whose actions resulted in "death" and "lost testicles" and those sorts of things, and idea that because he, Singlepower, has had bad dealings with some of its customers necessarily makes him "scum".
post #1369 of 1953
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilS View Post
It seems to me there is a third alternative. And that is to say the following:

1. Mikhail has done something seriously wrong (e.g., he lied to certain customers), there need to be consequences, and people who have been victimized (who are rightly pissed off and emotional about this, as anyone would be) need to be made whole or have their issues remedied in some way.

2. The fact that he has done what he has done does not mean that he ripped off everyone who has ever dealt with him (or that his conduct is similar to murder), that all his amps were poorly built, that they all sounded like krap and always have, that anyone who thinks or thought otherwise was duped, and/or that none of his amps have any value whatsoever.

3. The fact that some of his amps sound great or that he treated some people very well or provided good customer service does not mean that he didn't treat other people very poorly, didn't rip some people off or lie, didn't provide some very poor quality products in an attempt to cover himself, and that people who have been victimized should not be compensated or have restitution made to them.

Why are so many people on this thread trying to put people in such polar opposite camps? I don't get it.
I'm not entirely sure what you are trying to say in #3.. but I was talking very specifically about what belief AudioDwebe holds. I don't think AudioDwebe enspouses #3.

If he does he should say something. If he had constrained his views to the fact that he has issue with Mikhail attending the DannyB that'd be one thing...
post #1370 of 1953
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icarium View Post
I'm not entirely sure what you are trying to say in #3.. but I was talking very specifically about what belief AudioDwebe holds. I don't think AudioDwebe enspouses #3.
I wasn't really addressing my comments to what AudioDwebe said, or to even entirely to what you said (despite my quoting you). I was just using the most recent discussion to point out that it seems that everybody on this thread is identified as either a "Mikhail hater" or a "Mikhail defender." And I think that people's respective viewpoints are more complicated than that, and that the issue is to some extent or in certain respects a little more complicated that we make it seem.
post #1371 of 1953
Wow, only on this forum could someone like Mikhail be defended.

Here if you screw up, cheat people of money, practice bad business, only ONCE, you're gone. You don't get a second chance. You're done. People have taken others to court for far less than 17,000 dollars worth of garbage that Icarium has bought and had to deal with. All it takes is one court case, one bad business here to get a bad reputation and you don't recover, if you do, its a hard road back.

I am so happy I don't live where you live PhilS, glad where I am people are held accountable for their actions.

Yes no one is perfect or "God," but cheating someone of 10s of thousands of dollars and lying for months at a time are not what someone does due to being absent minded, forgetful and small mistakes that us all humans make.

What Mikhail has done were deliberate. You don't put wallwarts in a 15,000 dollar Amp power source by mistake, or among the many small mistakes us humans make. That was intentional, he thought about it, and decided to do so. He thought about lying about shipping, he thought about telling someone 90% of the work is done, but fail to deliver until two months later.

My father recently had his house renovated, when the contractor didn't get plumbing done as he had promised to be scheduled, my father made sure there were consequences. Meaning the contractor lost money, and the contractor, GUESS WHAT!?!? Here is the real world, people know there are consequences, and he admitted to his inability to follow through on the agreement and agreed that he should not charge as was decided because he wasn't able to hold up his end of the deal. And the plumbing job was done well, in the end, contractor and my father both got what they wanted, with the understanding this is business, you do what you say you will, you get paid for the job you agree to do. And my father has recommended the contractor to other associates of his, because of this, the Contractor gained more business through my father. Just as a good customer, my father made sure the contractor and everyone else who worked on the renovation were paid on time. Contractor received a bonus for such a pleasant experience my father had, his issues were addressed promptly and business like.

But with Mikhail he hasn't admitted to wrong doing. Believe in some threads, he even accused the customer of screwing up. He makes up more lies to cover up the lies he already made. There is a huge difference between Mikhail and anyone else I know personally running a successful business, that and everyone I know personally pride themselves in good customer relations, unlike Mikhail who seems to pride in screening his customer's phone calls and then disconnecting phone lines if customer does manage to get in contact with him.
post #1372 of 1953
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sherwood View Post
You and half of the sorority alums in the world
Well, I wasn't in a fraternity, and I sure as hell wasn't in a sorority (I think the goatee disqualified me).
post #1373 of 1953
mbd2884,
I dont see how you get that saying alot of people are happy with there amps, and the fact that until recently the big majority of SP amps where very reliable = defending Mikhails recent actions. I've been on both ends, and the two have nothing to do with each other. Both dealings with Mikhail are true.
post #1374 of 1953
Quote:
Originally Posted by grawk View Post
We're not trying to send him to jail. Just saying that if he's going to rip off people in this community, he shouldn't be able to come to community events with impunity.
Frankly, if he is guilty of some of the stuff he's accused of, I don't see why a couple of months in the pokey is out of line. If businessmen in this country were held to the same standards as the rest of us (you steal, you go to jail), maybe stuff like this wouldn't happen.
post #1375 of 1953
Yep I agree what you said Hankins is true.

I also believe his actions should not be tolerated because a few had good dealings. I believe his deceitful actions are not lessened by that others had good dealings. He should suffer the consequences for the people he screwed over. I am baffled how some think because they had good dealings that Mikhail deserves to be defended. It doesn't matter if a few had good dealings when it comes to the grievances of other faced. He should be held accountable.

It would be a different story if Mikhail took responsibility for his actions. For example returning someone's amp six months after the quoted job time, should say, I'll only charge for the shipping, and parts, labor free. Or make concessions for what he did. Or simply a well written and sincere apology recognizing his wrong doings. But not here, he has just lied some more instead. There is a difference between Mikhail and the rest of the business world related to customer relations.

Why do I keep recommending Audio-gd's Compass to anyone looking for an entry level DAC/Amp solution? Yeah his product is great, but its because you couldn't ask for a more responsive business man, can't ask for better customer service. Kingwa cares what people think of him and his service. He doesn't just care about his product, he also cares about his relations with his customers. That's the biggest reason why I rave about Audio-gd. He answers questions promptly, easy to contact, he delivers on time, provided a real tracking number on time, and was very accommodating.
post #1376 of 1953
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbd2884 View Post
Yep I agree what you said Hankins is true.

I also believe his actions should not be tolerated because a few had good dealings. I believe his deceitful actions are not lessened by that others had good dealings. He should suffer the consequences for the people he screwed over. I am baffled how some think because they had good dealings that Mikhail deserves to be defended. It doesn't matter if a few had good dealings when it comes to the grievances of other faced. He should be held accountable.

It would be a different story if Mikhail took responsibility for his actions. For example returning someone's amp six months after the quoted job time, should say, I'll only charge for the shipping, and parts, labor free. Or make concessions for what he did. Or simply a well written and sincere apology recognizing his wrong doings. But not here, he has just lied some more instead. There is a difference between Mikhail and the rest of the business world related to customer relations.

Why do I keep recommending Audio-gd's Compass to anyone looking for an entry level DAC/Amp solution? Yeah his product is great, but its because you couldn't ask for a more responsive business man, can't ask for better customer service. Kingwa cares what people think of him and his service. He doesn't just care about his product, he also cares about his relations with his customers. That's the biggest reason why I rave about Audio-gd. He answers questions promptly, easy to contact, he delivers on time, provided a real tracking number on time, and was very accommodating.
I think everyone has a right to post there dealings with Mikhail. i can also see how some would be suprised that mikhail has done some of the things people are saying he did, when they had nothing but good dealings. however i have not seen anyone who is suprised with his actions, whose posts seem like they posted in order to make anyone elses dealings with Mikhail seem lessened or trivial.
I posted my thoughts on how Mikhail has been both here and elsewhere. (when he was right and wrong in our transactions)
Also (and i no nobody wants to hear this) but he did take responsibility for his bad actions with me, and made it right.
Now are you going to say by posting this that I am defending his actions? if so you really dont have a clue.
BTW, nice plug for that DAC company.
post #1377 of 1953
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbd2884 View Post
I am so happy I don't live where you live PhilS, glad where I am people are held accountable for their actions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbd2884 View Post
I am baffled how some think because they had good dealings that Mikhail deserves to be defended.
Who are you talking about? Are you reading any of the posts on this thread but your own? You certainly don't seem to be reading mine!?
post #1378 of 1953
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom hankins View Post
Also (and i no nobody wants to hear this) but he did take responsibility for his bad actions with me, and made it right.
I can't speak for everyone here, but personally, the reason I don't want to hear it is because Mikhail only takes responsibility when he is caught and publically called out. Do you really think he made things right? I'd say he just made things less wrong.
post #1379 of 1953
I like to think that most of the folks who are posting here are SinglePower customers who are discussing their experience and (unfortunately) their issues. I'm starting to see a bit too much activity by some posters who have no experience with SinglePower. I feel like this serves little purpose.

I'm not saying that folks who have no experience with SinglePower have nothing to add to this thread. What I'm saying is that the discussion about how well or poorly SinglePower serves its customers ought to largely be a discussion amongst its customers.

I also feel like some folks who have come here to share their positive experiences with SinglePower have been IMHO treated a bit unfairly...to a large degree by folks who have no experience with SinglePower. I'd like to see that stop.

It seems very clear that there are some significant customer service issues with SinglePower right now - I think we can all agree on that. That doesn't necessarily mean that things have always been this bad, and that's all part of the story. We should all feel free to express our opinions without having our motives questioned. That goes for those who have good AND bad things to say...though it would be better if most of the "talking" were done by actual SinglePower customers.
post #1380 of 1953
elrod-tom,

Very well said. Thanks.
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