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Audiotrak Prodigy HD2 opamp configurations list - Page 31

post #451 of 492

Very nice! Beautiful capacitor mod. I tried myself once to upgrade the capacitors but ended up in a ruined card due to using a too high wattage soldering-iron, so well done! I see AD8066 as filter amps, but which amp is the nice can? How does your HD2 sound after the mod?.  
 

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post #452 of 492
sound is perfect, i was try 8066s two different combination, first one 49720ha and second one lt1028, i was happy with two different combo, now i am using 1x 1361 and 2x 1364, no big difference, i am happy with this combo too.
post #453 of 492

After adding the CLC-filter between the P24 +12V and -12V I realize that before I did that I listened and judged not only the SQ potential of the opamps but their capacity to suppress garbage on the rails. With insufficiently filtered rails, LT1028CN8 (on the buffer position) came out as the better one in that respect. With adequate filtering, however, both AD797 and THS4032 sound much better as buffer. LT 1028 and THS4032 are drier sounding as compared to the AD797 that is more emotional sounding. At times, however, it can be a little to much emphasis on the lead instrument I think, so I believe there may be a slight coloration, reflecting maybe an implementation issue on the HD2 (although the SQ is still on a very high level). THS4032 sounds very similar to LT1028CN8 and maybe it reproduces even more of micro detail, but to the prize of a slightly harsh upper end. So LT 1028CN8 remains the opamp of my choice as buffer. It benefits a lot too from the extra filtering of the P24 and P4 computer voltages and good quality electrolytic capacitors between +V and -V on the opamp adapters. What I have learned then is that 1x2xLT1028CN8 + 2xTHS4032 on the HD2 together with a careful overall computer voltage clean up can make very good SQ.
 


Edited by ingvarb - 9/22/12 at 11:08am
post #454 of 492

The 27pF ceramic disk caps I soldered on the AD797s proved to be a bad idea. Taking them off made an improvement. I now hear sweeter and more natural sound with the AD797 than with the THS4032 on the filter positions, so I'm back with the combo suggested in this thread, 1x2xLT1028 + 2x2xAD797. It's a really good combo, and if sound quality is important, try the LC- or CLC-filters on the computer voltages, they do wonders (e.g., small 2x 3.3 mH iinductors, as e.g. Schurter DKFP, combined with 470-2200uF electrolytics).


Edited by ingvarb - 11/10/12 at 5:59am
post #455 of 492

Tried the HD2 without bufferamp and got the best computer sound I have ever heard. Leaving the buffer opamp socket empty gave much better sound than with the LT1028 or any other opamp at that position I have tried. I then compared THS4032 and AD797 on the filter positions and the clear winner in my opinion is the THS4032. I hear more refined and distinct sound combined with much blacker background. It gives the impression, whether true or not, that it doesn't contribute with any coloring at all. It just reproduce the music beautifully in a true and belivable fashion. Sound level out in the RCAs is about the same with or without the buffer opamp. Lifting off the buffer opamp means that the active output stage consists of only one instead of three opamps per channel. That is good I think (less is more!). Instead of using the balanced output (+ and -) from the DAC chip, as with a buffer opamp in place, only single-ended output from the chip is used with the buffer opamp removed (that is, only the + output). But it works very well, so try it!

post #456 of 492

Using a Prodigy HD2 DE (VIA driver 5.12.1.3656, no VIA software), I went from an old configuration of (2)AD797BR and (1) 627AU to new configuration of (2) LME49990MA and (1) 627AU. or without the 627AU LT1028ACN8 in the output (needs this adapter).  Listening with either ATH AD700 (open) or ATH A900X (closed).

 

For a point of reference, listened to Donald Fagen - Morph The Cat - Mary Shut The Garden Door - 2006 in FLAC  Wavpack via Media Player Classic and The Very Best Of Fleetwood Mac - Everywhere - 2009 remastered from the original tape but well done for back in the day (1985-1987),  Hummin' To Myself - Linda Ronstadt - Hummin' To Myself - 2004  and a recent movie with Pitch Perfect (2012) Blu-Ray (DTS) 24bits, 48KHz sampling.

 

To my ears: LME49990MA beautiful on the mid and esp. high end. Lacks a bit on the low end but I prefer the detailed highs as there is much going on in that range. Compared to the old configuration the AD797BR has more low (bass) range and is missing an area between the upper mids and high range. LME49990MA covers the entire mid to high range with very good separation, details and clarity, bass is in the background somewhat but maybe the new chips will break-in, both headphones are broken in already.**

 

Because of LME49990MA clarity, I prefer listening with my AD700's staging and highs response, Most ATH always have good voice range, so no problems there.

 

Through my Klipsch Ultra 5..1 sub, the bass is very clean. So the jury is still out if  the LME49990MA is producing a more natural clean bass sound versus the AD797BR coloring the bass or highlighting it to much. Having the open headphones on with the sub on pumping out the bass is a real plus.

 

** Bass only slightly highlighted. More bass showing up after 10 - 20 hours of breaking in the LME49990MA chips, can't really explain it but just starting booming better but still has the cleanness in bass sound that I am not use to. Turned my AD700 into a well balanced headphone. My A900X are turning out to be very capable phones minus some staging of course.

 

Because the LME49990MA is my first opamp that was specifically tailored for music [Discrete? (according to the literature)] that I have used versus opamps that had other uses (ex. MRI machines or phone banks) but also worked with music and human hearing ranges, I am finding the LME49990MA a great sounding opamp, very clean sounds throughout even the bass range being clean is something different to my ears. 

 

The following opamps are all used on their appropriate dual adapter boards. LME49990MA stayed on-board and I only exchanged in the output socket. Because of the LME49990MA the output opamps I tried below have a great signal to work with and give good benefits depending what you prefer...

*OPA627AU in the output seems to add a little unnecessary color to the sound,

sounds better without them/it.

*AD797BR in the output, more highlighted bass now with the highs slightly more pronounced (owing to more hiss present in poor recordings) maybe a hair tinny in the highs.

*AD8066AR in the output favors the bass, not in bad a way but colors/puts its tone even on a hum of a bad recording. Nice if you like your bass sounds.

*LT1028CN8 in the output makes the bass sound a bit more believable but the very highs suffered (purchased this model by mistake).

*LT1028ACN8 in the output gives clarity and separation throughout the ranges causing great staging, favors the highs, lows slightly hidden in the background (my favorite output chip so far).

 

Some dual channels chips that didn't require an adapter board...

*NE5532N in the output makes no changes to the signal other than enhancements like turning up the volume across the entire range at once, very very clean sounding.

*LT1364CN8 in the output favors the highs and enhances the clarity along with staging with a little bass boost. Very clean as well (like its brother LT 1028CN8 above).

*AD827JNZ in the output favors the lows to mids, brings them forward and puts the highs in the background. Very strong and realistic lows with a trade off of losing some detail in the highs. (So far best at handling lows)

 

Listened with, AD700 and A900X headphones.


Edited by razzz42 - 5/21/13 at 5:40pm
post #457 of 492

Thank you razzz42 for your report on the LME49990.. Because of it I had to buy those chips (on adapters from China), and now I understand why you like them so much. I fully agree, the LME sound even better than the very good in my opinion THS4032. So now I am about to be lost in Nirvana listening to computer sound through LME49990. No joking, the most detailed and yet uncolored and neutral sounding opamp I have heard, provided implemented correctly. I only use them at the two filter positions, leaving the buffer position empty for best SQ. I also soldered an Auricap 4.7uF PP cap in parallell with the 100 uF electrolytic cap at each one of the balanced plus outputs from the DAC chip (the minus outputs are not used as I use no output buffer amp). The plus outputs are at the uppermost and lowermost of the four 100uF/25V caps on the card connecting to the balanced DAC outputs (Oscon caps on my card). The Auricaps made the highs sound maybe even more detailed but too analytical and cold. The remedy was to solder an Elna Silmic II 100uF/25V cap between V+ and V- on each LME adapter and a wonderful sweetness of the highs was seducing me. At the empty buffer amp position I also soldered 0.47 ohm in series with a 0.47 uF film cap between V+ and ground, between V- and ground, and between V+ and V-. These RC networks serve to get rid of residual capacitor inductance in my CLC filters, which in theory may improve high frequency performance. Whether they do I don't know, but they don't hurt anyway. .
 

post #458 of 492
Quote:
Originally Posted by ingvarb View Post

Thank you razzz42 for your report on the LME49990.. Because of it I had to buy those chips (on adapters from China), and now I understand why you like them so much. I fully agree, the LME sound even better than the very good in my opinion THS4032. So now I am about to be lost in Nirvana listening to computer sound through LME49990...

Glad you are having a good time. I think, and it is always open to debate, that those LME49990 will burn in and sound even better after 50+ hours or so. I will scratch the THS4032 off my to do list.

 

Only relaying my opinions on sound, the LME49990 used alone without the buffer socket filled, sounds 'cluttered' as if all the instruments are on top of each other bleeding together like into only two stereo pickup mikes. Not necessarily a bad thing, as you can still hear all the details and ranges. I find using the buffer socket gives separation and with that comes more clarity depending on what buffer opamp is used.

 

For the buffer I favor LT1028ACN8 for its highs and clarity which causes better staging to me and recently AD827JNZ for favoring lows and mids plus brings everything forward with only the slightest loss of staging (nice on lows and mids so you won't miss much loss of highs, if any). I could live with either as long as LME49990 is feeding them.

 

Leeperry, who has good observations and ears, was speaking to some adapter boards like the Brown Dog Single-to-dual Op-AMP Adapter

(wanting the (2) dip-sockets pre-mounted is extra) as flimsy. I agree, when compared to waiting for China to send the same type of adapter but more substantial is worth the wait. Thought I ordered an extra (2) LT1028ACN8 but ended up receiving (2) LT1028CN8 and ordered the said adapter board from China too. Of course I tried them out anyway but on the swap I saw the existing (2) LT1028CN8 were mounted on a the green Brown Dog adapter and on closer inspection found the legs fit loose in some of the through holes to the point that I wondered if they were making a decent connection or not. Might have attributed to my thinking that I had some hearing loss on the right ear cup instead of my actual ear drum for the last month or so. Might be hard to tell now with the burn in possibly being unequal. I think it was poor contact. Red colored adapter fits snug.

 

BTW, the (2) LT1028CN8 preformed under the AD827JNZ by making the bass sound a bit more believable but the very highs suffered by going missing.


Edited by razzz42 - 5/9/13 at 1:46am
post #459 of 492

Hi , seriously thinking of getting this card , do the opamps effect both the head output and rca output ? just thought i read somewhere that it wasnt both , but that could be an entirely different card , among the many ive been researching of late !!

post #460 of 492
Quote:
seriously thinking of getting this card , do the opamps effect both the head output and rca output ?

Hi, don't think you will be disapointed. As far as I understand, the two dual filter opamps closest to the DAC affect both the head output and the RCA outputs, while the single buffer opamp after the filter opamps only affect the RCA output. That is, you can remove the buffer opamp and the head output still works as before. I just checked it on my card.

post #461 of 492
Quote:
Originally Posted by ingvarb View Post

Hi, don't think you will be disapointed. As far as I understand, the two dual filter opamps closest to the DAC affect both the head output and the RCA outputs, while the single buffer opamp after the filter opamps only affect the RCA output. That is, you can remove the buffer opamp and the head output still works as before. I just checked it on my card.

Hi , many thanks for the info , can you change the output power of the headphone amp via software ?

post #462 of 492

I am also considering this sound card.  I am looking for an upgrade over my onboard Realtek ALC 887.

 

My setup.

 

I don't use headphones...the set around the base of my monitor in the pic is literally just for the microphone.

 

Satellites:  Cambridge S30s

Subwoofer:  Outlaw M8

Amplifier:  Audiosource AMP 100

Soundcard:  Realtek ALC 887

post #463 of 492

HD2 [special that has upgraded(?) capacitors]   

 

Good enough for changing out opamps to satisfy your stereo sounds curiosity without breaking the bank but you need a PCI slot.

 

I never read much comparison on the old Vinyl Envy chip, now re-branded,  used on this card to any newer chips. Sounds fine to me.

post #464 of 492

Hm... $20 cheaper, even after being "upgraded"?  Not sure If I would trust that...no mention of any warranty either.  :/

 

EDIT:  Yeah, it comes with the "LITE" edition's Op-amps, which I would end up swapping out for the "ADVANCED" configuration.  I'm pretty sure that the "Special Edition" is just a LITE edition under a false label.


Edited by Darknecron - 6/6/13 at 7:44pm
post #465 of 492
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darknecron View Post

Hm... $20 cheaper, even after being "upgraded"?  Not sure If I would trust that...no mention of any warranty either.  :/

 

EDIT:  Yeah, it comes with the "LITE" edition's Op-amps, which I would end up swapping out for the "ADVANCED" configuration.  I'm pretty sure that the "Special Edition" is just a LITE edition under a false label.

Yes your correct , it is the "Lite" version

 

This info i copy and pasted a while ago , from some forum , might even be from here !

 

 

Audiotrak Prodigy HD2
There are three official manufactured configurations (as far as I know):
LITE --- 3x NE5532
GOLD --- 2x OPA2134 + JRC5532
ADVANCE --- 2x OPA2134 + OPA2604

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