New Power Cable to consider--IeGO Power Cable - Page 4

You can use the word magic when seasoning impressions of sonic characteristics such as...

"Miles horn solo magically appeared in the listening room"

You cannot use the word magic to avoid explaining scientific principles or engineering implementation.

The new $150MM bridge is suspended by "MAGIC"...
(see, it just doesn't work IMO)

Jumpping into this thread because I just put a IeGO cable into my system and believe that it has made a positive change.

It seems to me that there is more detail in the reproduction, better sound staging and more "space".

It is early days for the new cable (just a few hours on it) but I am pleased so far.

Sorry to jump in the middle of a discussion of magic or whatever but so far I am pleased with the change to my system and hope that impression can be useful to others considering these cables.

Well, like I previously said in my message, the information is easily available if you just google a little bit.

Science

This is one link I had found, again in only a few seconds by just entering "Copper Cryogenic Treatment"

You can easily find more by searching the exact term that I had just searched.

As for resistance and those other possible changes, let's just put it this way, the original resistance of copper is already so low that it is impossible to use a easily available multi-meter to measure any change of resistance in cable length that is representative of what is usually used in homes.

Just try accurately measure a 0.5 ohm resistor with a sub $100 USD meter, it's not going to work, and it will just be even harder if you try to measure a cable with much, much lower resistance than that.


Again, what do you really want? Better sound? or better specs? So far the comment that I've heard are all quite positive regarding IeGO cables, both in terms of performance and value. It easily outperforms cables of similar price range, and it will easily cost much more than what I charge if you wants to build the cable yourself.

Well, I did not design the cable and I can't tell you exactly what went through the mind of the designer when they are working on the cable. But I do know the designer and I believe that he is quite good at cable designs.

What I'm assured is that the cable is going to be well made with sonic signature that is mostly balanced and neutral, plus a bit of coloring and "flavors" to add to the fun. Higher end models that further improve on virtually all aspects of performance and stay on the neutral and balanced trail.

Which is pretty much what I hear from the five different cables that I have here. And I'm into the cable business only after I have purchased 2 IeGO's entry level L70530+unplated connector via retail channel. I have to say that I was impressed with the performance, especially when considering the price of the cable.



As for other manufacturer's product, I feel it would not be wise or prudent for me to comment of their product.

Well, it may not make sense to you, but AC power kinda works in strange ways. You can cover the entire cable with RFI chokes that blocks everything above 60Hz and the works, and likely you will hear the detail muffled and muted highs.


To me, what I really focus on is not exactly the science behind the cable, but those specs are only used as "indicator" of how the cable may perform. As what we would want is something that makes our stereo work better, and as I believe you know, there are a lot of stuff in stereo that measures well but does not sound good at all.


As for the magic part, what I can say is stick a good cable into your system and find out. That's what I did when I couldn't understand why it would work the way that the cable manufacturer had claimed. Thankfully it worked as the cable manufacturer had claimed, and I'm still not quite sure about the science behind it.


As for the Wikipedia articles, like I said, it was found with very little effort, if you are into the science behind it, please search a bit on Wikipedia and Google, there's more info than you can shake a stick at.

That company does cryogenic treatment, so they are a somewhat unreliable source.

Again, you mis-understand me I think. I don't care about the specs, I care about how/if it works. I would like better sound, but until someone does a double blind test or loans me one I can't see any reason to think that there is better sound.

Also, if the how and why don't matter, why even try to explain how this thing works? If you use it in marketing, you must expect people to cast a critical eye over it.

One thing I find interesting is that all high end audio manufacturers claim that their high end products are better than the ones lower down in the range, and that they cost more to produce.

That doesn't make much sense to me. Why are more expensive materials always better? It's a how in blind tests often the cheaper cosmetics out perform the super expensive ones with all the pseudo-science behind them.

That makes no sense at all. The only possible explanation is that the amp/source you are using has a rubbish power supply section and the noise from the mains was getting into the audio, causing you to hear extra "detail" which is actually just distortion.

Maybe it's like some kind of bizarre dithering effect? In which case you might as well use a cheap power cable.

At least we can usually say why something makes a noticeable difference to sound though. I'm just trying to understand how this cable has any effect on the power that could affect sound. I mean, you wouldn't pay a lot extra for a car with "go faster" stripes, just because the salesman told you they magically made the car faster, would you?

Thus I said, if you are really interested, it would be reasonable for you to search/google around a bit for more info. If you don't want to do that, then that means you are not really interested in that subject at all.

Simple, because that would turn a simple ad and light discussion into heavy textbook stuff, like I said, if you really want to know the deep down stuff, I can give you pointers. If I don't have more info, I can ask for some pointers for you even. However, I nor anyone else I believe would really want to turn a thread here into some text book stuff that 99.99% of people won't bother read or try to understand.


It makes PERFECT sense, if you ever had a hand in manufacturing, you will know that the factory and designer strive for the balance of lowest cost and best performance. There is NO holy grail of highest performance at the absolutely lowest cost, but more of a balance of the two, higher performance at higher cost, or acceptable performance at lower cost.

You may wonder about the choices where it costs higher but does not provide performance increase or actually lowers the performance. Well, it is simple, factory and the designer would have removed those options from the available choices. It does not serve them any good to make it worse and make it costs more. Capitalism at its best, really.


Well then if theory doesn't work, then maybe you should seriously give some cables a try at your home. I'm sure you can find some Head-Fiers or other audiophile buff, or some really nice stores that are willing to loan you a cable to try it out.

And as interesting as it may be, I'd say 2/3 of the time, the more expensive the equipments, the more improvements you get out of the cables. I don't think those expensive equipments lacks any filtering or regulating circuits at all.

Yes, but lots of people paid big money for optimized fuel injection mapping, spark advance mapping and optimized cam shaft profiles that get them the performance and efficiency boost that they want. All in a black box more or less, so you mean those don't work either?

Uh, I'm not sure why you referenced capitalism at its best, because if that's how you believe market forces work you have a flawed understanding of economics. There are plenty of times where manufacturers, in the cable world and in other industries, will make a product that's more expensive and provides poorer performance. Pick up any old Consumer Reports and you'll likely find the higher-priced models from a given manufacturer scoring much worse than a cheaper model. The reason they do this is because they can make a larger profit, because they end up on a more advantageous supply/demand curve. I could get into the calculus of it (still a bit shaky on it, but I still know the rudiments of marginal cost of substitution), but the intuition behind it is pretty clear.

Also, for the sake of everyone please stop comparing audio components to cars! Think of the children! In all seriousness, they're horrible comparisons, because in the racing world everyone stakes performance on one thing - speed. Speed is objective, measurable, and uncontested as the measure of performance for a car (if we're talking about racing, which seems to be the case). However, "performance," in an audio system is a completely different animal - there are plenty of instruments that can detect change, but plenty of people contest that and only look to what is audible. Whether or not this is sound is another debate entirely, but it's pretty clear that there's a big difference between automobiles and audio components. This is just one difference between cars and audio, mind you. There's also the competitiveness involved, and the ease in noticing performance changes (oh look - he passed the finish line first!). There's no difference in perception in these cases.

Man, cars get used in every single internet debate. Macs vs PC, atheism vs. theism... you name it, somebody brought up an analogy to cars.

To rephrase it as cleanly as possible (relying less on the actual "car" content of the analogy), what if the racing stripes made the car feel faster, even though the laser told you the car was traveling at the same speed. Would you still buy it? (I hope this captures the intent of the original comparison)

I'm getting into the cable making business.

I did search Google and as far as I can tell (with FE level of physics) there is no reason to think it would help in this application.

That's what I've been asking for all along.

Well it might be interesting to them if you can convince people who do understand it that you didn't just invent some techno-babble. This isn't Star Trek.

My point was though that why must there necessarily be a balance like that? Sometimes the cheap stuff performs better than more expensive materials. Silver cutlery for example - cheaper than gold but gold is too soft and would wear out.

To give you another example, you can buy generic medication. It works just as well as the branded stuff, because in fact it is the same as the branded stuff. The branded meds that cost 10x more are total snake oil, a complete rip-off. Idiots buy them of course, but we are trying to avoid being idiots here.

Sure, some times we pay extra for stuff that is no better than the cheaper version, for fashion reasons. A £5 t-shirt is as effective at clothing you as a £50 one, but sometimes people pay more because the expensive one looks nice. The same happens in audio - high end gear comes in nicer enclosures and that is factored into the price. Presumably you are not selling this cable based on looks though.

Care to explain how the cable improves the sound then?

I don't know, has anyone raced a modified and stock care to find out? I'd be surprised if there were not measurements to back those things up, since car enthusiasts love to measure power output and 0-60 times when tweaking. That's how they know their tweaks are working.

But when I put cat piss in my gas tank, my car FEELS faster to me . . . and that's what it's all about, how fast my car feels to ME.

I guess I didn't make it clear enough, I didn't put marketing into the picture as from purely the POV of manufacturing and design, there is no point making a more expensive product that performs worse, unless someone really want to trash that company's bottom line.

Well, racing stripes would be like the labels on the cable, they do nothing other than add a little bit of weight and trying to make the thing look better. As for the comparison to the car, I'd prefer a different comparison if I may.

Let's say there are two seat options, both weight the same, one costs less and felt like barbed wire fence, and one holds the driver in good comfort and does not impede his control of the car but costs a lot more.

Laser will say both goes just as fast in drag strips, but I think you know the rest when the car start to put a little G forces on the driver.

Have you actually tried any of them?

The cables, the cryo processed cables and the cars? I don't think any amount of theory will satisfy you at all, is it really that hard to try some cable out? I don't speak techno-babble, if you don't intend to understand, I can't help you either. I wrote the English version of the spec with the intent that it will be as accurate as I can make it. With none of those funny acronyms, invented names and stuff, if you try that hard not to get it, I'm not sure any more info from me would have helped.

If you think copper that is alloyed with silver and gold is just like any generic copper, well, I can't help you either.

As for silverwares, ultra-pure silver is very soft too... the silver you often see are alloyed with a lot of copper or other metals to make it hard. Thus Sterling silver is only 92.5% pure.

So you really are pushing these products because of aesthetics, not performance?

That's precisely what your analogy means. . . it performs exactly the same but one is more uncomfortable.

Well, I think you missed the point completely. The road is never straight all the time, and it is proven that a properly designed seat does help the driver corner faster and stay focused longer. Who said a seat wouldn't actually help performance?


If you do not feel IeGO's cable being any good, by all means don't get it. I have performed many test of the cable on my system, before I even start writing the description of the cable. Including the Head-Fi forbidden tests too; believe it or not, I would not be stocking those cables myself if I cannot hear some improvements on my system.