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E-MU 0404 First impression (Arcam CD73 vs E-MU 0404 USB) - Page 2

post #16 of 25
3/14/08 at 5:52pm
Thread Starter 
Out next: Daft Punk: Human After All.

If there is a difference in bass presentation, this record should reveal it!
And there it is! Not. No difference, again.
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post #17 of 25
3/14/08 at 6:07pm
Thread Starter 
Orrf: Carmina Burana (NAXOS): Nothing

Beethoven Symphony no 9 - Molto Vivace: Nothing

Bande Du Orgniale Du Film Bleu - Song for the Unification of Europe, Van Den Budenmayer / Funeral Music: Nothing

The instruments sound exactly the same.
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post #18 of 25
3/14/08 at 6:21pm
Thread Starter 
Let's try some rock music.

The White Stripes: Elephant.
this record is famous for being a spectacular recording. but... nothing.

AC/DC - The Razors Edge: Thunderstruck. Absolutely impossible to tell the 0404 apart from the Arcam. No sound signatures to differentiate the two apparatus.
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post #19 of 25
3/14/08 at 6:27pm
Thread Starter 
Apparently I do not have the HI-FI ears needed for this test.
Alternatively, there are actually no important differences.

But I am not giving up just yet. We are dealing with a spectacular sounding CD player versus an inferior DAC after all.

Now let's go electronic:

The Knife: Silent Shout / Silent Shout. This record is one of my all-time favourites. It is absolutely fantastic and I have spent hours listening to it through the Arcam.

But I do not hear any difference.

So far, my next paycheck is not going into a new dac.
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post #20 of 25
3/14/08 at 6:30pm
^^^Hehe...
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post #21 of 25
3/14/08 at 6:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DefectiveAudioComponent View Post
Apparently I do not have the HI-FI ears needed for this test.
Alternatively, there are actually no important differences.

But I am not giving up just yet. We are dealing with a spectacular sounding CD player versus an inferior DAC after all.

Now let's go electronic:

The Knife: Silent Shout / Silent Shout. This record is one of my all-time favourites. It is absolutely fantastic and I have spent hours listening to it through the Arcam.

But I do not hear any difference.

So far, my next paycheck is not going into a new dac.

I don't understand why you keep saying the 0404 is an inferior dac. It utilizes one of the best DAC chips on the market and has one of the most superior price to performance ratio. If anything, it should be the $1000 equipment that's "inferior" for the money you paid. Let's be honest, if with all the placebo effect of 0404 being inferior and you still can't tell the difference, then there is probably no difference.
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post #22 of 25
3/14/08 at 6:54pm
Thread Starter 
In fact, I find that the presentation of the music is fantastic. There is nothing inferior about it. That was just my expectation of the 0404 after reading several negative posts of it in this forum.

One last (maybe) test then for tonight. I have ripped Violator and Nashville Skyline through Exact Audio Copy into uncompressed wave files. Let's compare that to the Arcam.

Violator: Again, nothing.

Nashville Skyline. Now I am getting worried that I will hear nothing on this one either comparing the wave file to the Arcam. So I switch to the Sennheiser 414 anniversary edition. They have a completely different sound from the 580s and tend to put details of the music in the foreground at the cost of bass.

But once again. I simply cannot tell the sound of the two devices apart at the moment.

Let's add that also Nashville Skyline and Violator are two of my all-time favourites that I have spent countless hours enjoying.

Comments? Ideas?
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post #23 of 25
3/14/08 at 7:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DefectiveAudioComponent View Post
I have now connected the Arcam to the 0404 with audio going through my Pioneer A449 (powered off) - XcanV3 - HD580.

I have started with Depeche Mode - Violator.
As I start the comparison I expect a dramatic difference. The 0404 is to some ears not even a decent dac, whereas the Arcam has received rave reviews (when new).

First impression: I can't hear any difference whatsoever through an A-B test.

The difference might be subtle. I have to bring a friend over to do a proper blind (deaf?) test, but I suspect I will be unable to hear any difference.

Ideas?

(Note: The connection from the Arcam is through one optical cable, thus the Arcam clock is used. The Arcam does not have optical in anyway.)
You've have been testing 1)0404 USB only & 2)0404 USB with Arcam as your transport!

That means you're comparing 1) whatever format your rip is(flac, mp3...etc) to 2) your actual CD using 0404 USB as your ONLY converter.

Now, Would you please try 1) Output from 0404 USB and 2) Analog output of your Arcam and tell us the difference. In this case your comparing the DAC of your 0404 and the DAC of your CD73.
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post #24 of 25
3/14/08 at 7:20pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cankin View Post
You've have been testing 1)0404 USB only & 2)0404 USB with Arcam as your transport!

That means you're comparing 1) whatever format your rip is(flac, mp3...etc) to 2) your actual CD.

Now, Would you please try 1) Output from 0404 USB and 2) Analog output of your Arcam and tell us the difference. In this case your comparing the DAC of your 0404 and the DAC of your CD73.
No! I have done both!

First, I compared:
Arcam CD73 analog out (through pioneer A449 powered off) - Xcan V3 - HD580
with
Arcam CD73 optical out - 0404 USB - (through pioneer A449 powered off) - Xcan V3 - HD580

then I compared
Arcam CD73 analog out (through pioneer A449 powered off) - Xcan V3 - HD580
with
Uncompressed wave file ripped using Exact Audio Copy - Mac Book Pro - 0404 USB - (through pioneer A449 powered off) - Xvan V3 - HD580

and then the last test also with the HD414

The result was that I could hear no differences between the apparatus.
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post #25 of 25
3/17/08 at 5:03am
Thread Starter 
So, what to conclude from all this?

First, the 0404 is an excellent DAC, after all. (Compared to the Arcam, where I could hear no differences, and compared to the mac book pro where the differences were very clear).

Second, if you are going for a more expensive DAC, my advice is that you first listen carefully to make sure you can hear any differences at all compared to a cheaper DAC like the 0404.

Third, if you are thinking about buying a CD player, I'd recommend listening to a lossless rip of whatever music you enjoy through a computer with a good DAC first.
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