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Electrostatic vs. Dynamic Headphones - Page 3

post #31 of 327
3/31/03 at 7:01am
Quote:
Originally posted by jpelg
If I could, I'd simply poplulate each room in my apartment with a pair of the AKG's, and be very, very happy. It will be fun to build my basic system up around them.
I would do the same, but sometimes it's the situation that dictates using another headphone. For example, it's impossible to use the AKGs when in the same room someone else is watching TV.

I agree that it is tough to switch between headphones, but the AKGs and Sonys are similar enough to reduce the shock of switching back and forth.

I figure either way, I win.
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post #32 of 327
3/31/03 at 9:23am
Quote:
Originally posted by Mike Scarpitti
Yes, indeed. Here's the problem. If you're going to use them at home, the Stax are clearly superior. The CD3000's are too bulky and inconvenient for portable use, but you might want them for an office or bedroom pair. The Stax are clearly superior, though, in all respects.
You're saying all this, having HEARD the CD3000'S, RIGHT?
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post #33 of 327
3/31/03 at 10:25am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by wallijonn
Excellent review, John. Congratulations on your choice for best overall headphone (CD3000). It's a great headphone and hopefully will give you years of pleasure.

You may want to consider buying a 4 pin XLR jack AND a 1/4" stereo jack for the nOrh SE9. It may be easy enough to connect both receptecles in a 2" or 3" Radio Shack box. Of course, the CD3000 may not play too well out of it, but at least it would be there for future use. Believe me when I say that you don't want to be using the K1000 extention / adapter cord. You could just get the silver wire or just put the 4 pin XLR receptecle with inches of the speaker output leads. Mine uses 4" 18 guage copper speaker wires - connected to my Parasound amp.

now you only have to worry about what will happen when you replace the Corda HA.
Thanks Wallijonn-
It's nice to hear some tips for modding. I am total DIY newbie.

Not to worry about that stock K1000 cable....I have my peepers on one of the 5 foot Equinox extensions. Just need to move of few of these cans first. And Orpheus is making me an extension with a 1/4" plug as well for amp experimenting.
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post #34 of 327
3/31/03 at 10:34am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by jpelg
I, personally, cannot go from one headphone to another quite so easily as you all seem to. Each of the headphones mentioned here have vastly, vastly different sonic signatures. Me, I tend to be a headphone monogamist.
Well, it looks like Sony is the winner. I had originally thought like OldPa...I was going to have one set for music and one for film. (actually, I was considering keeping them all...my wallet had other ideas) However, the CD3Ks do both so much better than my other contenders (to MY ears) , it came down to just the big grays. It's odd that they are so cumbersome looking, yet the most comfortable on my head out of the lot. I honestly cannot find anything I do not like about these headphones.

So...the final survivors are:

Living Room: Sony MDR CD3000 w/Corda HA-2

Bedroom: AKG K1000 w/nOrh se9

Portable: Koss Porta Pros


..at least till the NYC meet....hehehehehe

John
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post #35 of 327
3/31/03 at 10:59am
One final plea for insanity. Don't let them hear this, but if push came to shove, my DT880s and W1000s are the most vulnerable cans in the collection. Hearing you say the K1000s are already safe, it really comes down to the HD600s and the CD3Ks, right?

I remember how impressed I was with my CD3Ks; no buyer's remorse, wanted to hear one musical selection after another on them to delight in how they treated "old friends". I can understand how they won your comparison. But the smurfed HD600s are not chopped liver. They are also broken in, appropriately modded, and paid for.

You have to consider what it would cost to replace the HD600s in a couple of months if you decide they were not so hateful to have around. If it was me, I would sell/return the other stuff, but put the smurfed HD600s back in their nice black box and stick them in a closet for a month or two. Listen to them again then and decide if they are better to you as cash. You would not be out a thing but the use of the money their sale would have brought you earlier.
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post #36 of 327
3/31/03 at 11:19am
Good advice, Old Pa. The Sennheisers are easy to take for granted in the midst of other, newer, flashier cans. In a state of wanderlust I sold my HD580's for a pittance, and have regretted it ever since. Although I prefer my AKG's, I wish I still had the Senns as an inexpensive backup.
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post #37 of 327
3/31/03 at 11:26am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Old Pa
One final plea for insanity. [/I].
Too late guys...the dirty deed is done. I hope I don't miss them too much...they were a close second for me and I love the way they sound. But I needed to free up the hobby cash for the nifty Music Hall 7 turntable I just bought from Hirsch at a nice Head-Fi friendly price (thanks Hirsch!). I also need to get a phono stage, another set of decent ICs and something to clean the 300 plus LPs I have here in my old college fruit crates.
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post #38 of 327
3/31/03 at 11:55am
Quote:
Originally posted by williamgoody
You're saying all this, having HEARD the CD3000'S, RIGHT?
I used to own the MDR-CD1000, which is essentially the same as the MDR-CD3000, but with a cheaper plastic shell and no case (that case is very expensive). And yes, I LOVED them, and yes they were second best to my Stax Lamda's, but I used them for portable phones with my MZ-R3 Sony minidisc. I dropped that minidisc unit and broke it, and Sony (despite three attempts) was unable to repair it, so they offered me an MZ-R50, which would NOT drive the MDR-CD1000's (it clipped). So I got the MDR-D77 which works splendily with the minidisc unit, and I have the Stax for home use, so other than price, I can see no reason for you to have an MDR-CD3000 when the Stax are clearly superior, and I DO know how good the MDR-CD3000 is. The only other reason would be that you need a semi-portable unit, and don't want to have to drag the Stax amps or transformers around. The Sony's are the best dynamic headphones, but electrostatics will always remain superior, on the basis of physics, as the moving mass of a diaphragm is always less, and therefore the reaction time is less.
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post #39 of 327
3/31/03 at 1:36pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Mike Scarpitti
but electrostatics will always remain superior, on the basis of physics, as the moving mass of a diaphragm is always less, and therefore the reaction time is less.
The CD3000 gives you the flexibility of a variety of amps, while the Stax is limited to their offerings, unless you go DIY. There are some *very* good amplifiers that can drive the Sony that simply can't be used with the Stax. So, the moving mass of the diaphragm may be overridden by superior amplification characteristics, and you're back where you started.

I'm not trying to say anything against electrostatics. Simply trying to point out that absolute statements that A is always better than B almost always have some qualifiers, personal preference not the least of them, that may negate the statement.

And also, in the end, it's the music that matters, not the physics.
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post #40 of 327
3/31/03 at 1:58pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Hirsch
The CD3000 gives you the flexibility of a variety of amps, while the Stax is limited to their offerings, unless you go DIY. There are some *very* good amplifiers that can drive the Sony that simply can't be used with the Stax. So, the moving mass of the diaphragm may be overridden by superior amplification characteristics, and you're back where you started.
No amp is going to make a dynamic headphone as fast as an electrostatic. Physics precludes it. And Stax offer a variety of amps to suit any budget and taste, tubes, solid state, and transformers. No possible amp on a CD3000 will beat every Stax, no matter what it is.
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post #41 of 327
3/31/03 at 2:09pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Mike Scarpitti
No amp is going to make a dynamic headphone as fast as an electrostatic. Physics precludes it. And Stax offer a variety of amps to suit any budget and taste, tubes, solid state, and transformers. No possible amp on a CD3000 will beat every Stax, no matter what it is.
So it's impossible to prefer a CD3K to a pair of Stax phones, because "physics precludes it" and "Stax are clearly superior"?

- Chris
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post #42 of 327
3/31/03 at 2:16pm
Quote:
Originally posted by minya
So it's impossible to prefer a CD3K to a pair of Stax phones, because "physics precludes it" and "Stax are clearly superior"?

- Chris
Yes, more or less. Anything the Sony's can do (and that's a hell of a lot) the Stax can do better. Again, the Sony is probably the best dynamic phone out there--but no dynamic phone can compete with the best electrostatics. Anyone who like what the Sony does will like the Stax even more--because they provide more of what makes the Sony's so good. Please don't misunderstand me, I'm not knocking the Sony's, not at all, they're just about the best dynamics that exist.
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post #43 of 327
3/31/03 at 2:36pm
Thread Starter 
Hey guys....this talk of electrostats vs. dynamic is all really interesting...but I would like to point out that electrostats were not considered in my original comparison. That comparison was the point of my original post.

All of my 7 choices were dynamic headphones. To my ears, the Sonys were among the winners in my little comparison.

I hope to hear some Stax in the near future. I will probably love them. But, for now, I am quite pleased with my Sonys and my AKGs

Thanks for all the insight into the two technologies Mike....I appreciate it and look forward to hearing the super Stax setup at the NYC meet.

John
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post #44 of 327
3/31/03 at 2:38pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Mike Scarpitti
No amp is going to make a dynamic headphone as fast as an electrostatic. Physics precludes it. And Stax offer a variety of amps to suit any budget and taste, tubes, solid state, and transformers. No possible amp on a CD3000 will beat every Stax, no matter what it is.
Just because the diaphram of the Stax are thinner than a dynamic headphone doesn't really mean squat other than they're faster. Some people may prefer this type of sound others may not.

Speaking in absolutes like this is similar to some of the debates of the past like solid state vs. tubes. A lot of people used to say that because solid state didn't have the inherent distortions of tubes it had to be better. With the resurgence of tube gear over the past 10 years I think we could safely say this isn't true. What it comes down to is a matter of preferences and priorities. In the end every design is a trade off.
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post #45 of 327
3/31/03 at 2:44pm
Quote:
Originally posted by elnero
Just because the diaphram of the Stax are thinner than a dynamic headphone doesn't really mean squat other than they're faster. Some people may prefer this type of sound others may not.
As I said, whatever anyone likes in the Sony's will be present in even greater degree in the Stax. There are no trade-offs (except price). The trade-offs are in the dynamic phones, because of the greater moving mass of the diaphragms.
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