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Copper vs silver cables - Page 7

post #91 of 157
2/11/08 at 5:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaZZ View Post
It's fruitless to ask for measuring data standing for audiophile quality -- nobody can tell which measuring criteria cause which sonic characteristic. The same applies e.g. for amps. We're running in circles with such a discussion. Audiophile cables just are those which make the sound in your stereo setup (subjectively) better than standard cables.
Do you believe that there are no measurements at all that can be made that are indicative of the quality of audio reproduction, or just that they fail at some point to discriminate audible differences?

Are there any "night and day" differences that would always and forever be beyond the capabilities of measurements?

And this is a serious and honest question......what are a couple of areas in which you feel audiophile cables consistently perform better?
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post #92 of 157
2/11/08 at 5:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by sejarzo View Post
Do you believe that there are no measurements at all that can be made that are indicative of the quality of audio reproduction, or just that they fail at some point to discriminate audible differences?
The latter. It's more than an assumption. Amplifier sound is still somewhat of a mystery, regarding virtually identical measuring data, but apparently the human hearing threshold is much lower than officially accepted -- in certain areas --, that's why harmonic distortion values of 0.001% apparently still matter for perception (within the frame of a «distortion pattern»). So let's assume the «microscopic» distortions (WRT phase and frequency response) in cables do something as well.

Quote:
Are there any "night and day" differences that would always and forever be beyond the capabilities of measurements?
Certainly not.

Quote:
And this is a serious and honest question......what are a couple of areas in which you feel audiophile cables consistently perform better?
I really value honest and non-sarcastic questions! (Not especially addressed to you, though.) My personal perception is that of higher transparency and smoothness and especially more fluid and sparkling treble. That's what I like in the few audiophile cables I bought and which is an even more pronounced trademark of my homegrown magnet-wire cables. It's not without side effects, though, as it sacrifices a bit of accuracy (although not in comparison to standard cables).
.
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post #93 of 157
2/12/08 at 10:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaZZ View Post
The latter. It's more than an assumption. Amplifier sound is still somewhat of a mystery, regarding virtually identical measuring data, but apparently the human hearing threshold is much lower than officially accepted -- in certain areas --, that's why harmonic distortion values of 0.001% apparently still matter for perception (within the frame of a «distortion pattern»). So let's assume the «microscopic» distortions (WRT phase and frequency response) in cables do something as well.

Certainly not.

I really value honest and non-sarcastic questions! (Not especially addressed to you, though.) My personal perception is that of higher transparency and smoothness and especially more fluid and sparkling treble. That's what I like in the few audiophile cables I bought and which is an even more pronounced trademark of my homegrown magnet-wire cables. It's not without side effects, though, as it sacrifices a bit of accuracy (although not in comparison to standard cables).
.
Exactly what i found out/heard when going up the ladder of high end cables.
More transparent, more neutral, better top end and low end and more musical, music flows easier...more lifelike.
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post #94 of 157
2/12/08 at 10:48am
Can't we all just get along?

Seriously though, the OP asked for some recommendations on what cables to get and instead of getting that he got....5 pages of debate
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post #95 of 157
2/12/08 at 10:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebby View Post
Can't we all just get along?

Seriously though, the OP asked for some recommendations on what cables to get and instead of getting that he got....5 pages of debate
I don't know about that, I think the thread title sums it up perfectly.
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post #96 of 157
3/11/09 at 11:53am
i just placed an order for these... hope they're good. decided to not spend the extra cash on silver/gold cables, based on what i've read here.

would anyone like to give their views on this and this?
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post #97 of 157
3/11/09 at 11:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenkelby View Post
I don't know about that, I think the thread title sums it up perfectly.
steven,

do you still custom make cables/LODs?
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post #98 of 157
3/13/09 at 2:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by milkpowder View Post
65 bucks



Nice ay?
Its just 75 ohm cable TV wire with a nylon jacket net covering and fancy connectors.
I didnt like 75 ohm cable when i tried it here. Sounded dead to me.
They are pretty though.
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post #99 of 157
3/13/09 at 3:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sejarzo View Post
So, you think that classical recording engineers just use whatever is handy, and have never compared cables?
Being engineers produce CDs using a 31 band EQ and other processing, the balance or imbalance that a cable causes just doesnt matter.
If one cable slightly accentuates the highs, well so what, because he can fix it with the EQ.
Most Music mixers do not care about audiophile cables, but they do try to buy good name cables with good connectors and well shielded so they can resist noise.

Drag a cheap guitar cable along the ground and youll hear alot of noise, then drag a good one and you wont hear noise, or at least less noise.
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post #100 of 157
3/13/09 at 3:29am
It's hilarious that some people think Studios won't invest in the best cables if it actually made a difference. They will spend millions on their studio and equipment, but can't spare a few thousand for cables. That's hilarious...
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post #101 of 157
3/13/09 at 3:44pm
$50,000 CD Player > $50,000 preamp > $50,000 amp > lamp cord > $100,000 speakers > $100,000 room treatments > $6000 ac conditioner > pressed wood componant rack

location: sams trailor park
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post #102 of 157
3/13/09 at 4:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drag0n View Post
Being engineers produce CDs using a 31 band EQ and other processing, the balance or imbalance that a cable causes just doesnt matter.
If one cable slightly accentuates the highs, well so what, because he can fix it with the EQ.
Most Music mixers do not care about audiophile cables, but they do try to buy good name cables with good connectors and well shielded so they can resist noise.

Drag a cheap guitar cable along the ground and youll hear alot of noise, then drag a good one and you wont hear noise, or at least less noise.
Just out of curiosity (and this isn't sarcastic or rhetorical in the least), if engineers can simply EQ away the difference that a lousy cable makes, couldn't the listener also get an EQ for under/matching the price it would cost to completely outfit a rig with high-end cables and then just tweak that to their preference? If it works for the ones producing the music, why wouldn't it work for the end user?

I ask not because I think that cables don't make a difference; I'm just not entirely convinced that EQ is the reason why professionals don't use high end cables, especially given people like Steve Hoffman who IIRC uses such high end cables - but I can't see him mastering basically anything without some sort of EQ.
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post #103 of 157
3/13/09 at 4:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by essentiale View Post
would anyone like to give their views on this and this?
Isn't that lil'knight? looks like the same cables he makes, same location, and I think I've seen that ebay name associated with him somewhere.

Pricing seems kind of high. Seems like the prices were upped for ebay, compared to what I've seen him offer in the past (in regards to senn cables). $115 for 6ft mogami neglex senn cable, sure I saw kimber TCSS for around the same price from him in the past. And the jena labs senn cable listing says:
Quote:
More infos and reviews can be read here: http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f70/al...-cable-293581/

Please keep in mind that the same cable will cost you >400$: ALO Audio
Though with Jena Labs cable prices, I'd say his price is pretty fair. The mogami one is screaming at me to pickup a soldering iron and learn to make cables though.

If the pricing of the senn cables is any indication, I'd expect you could get roughly the same quality of LOD (likely same parts) for a lot less via contacting DIYers here on head-fi.
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post #104 of 157
3/13/09 at 5:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by royalcrown View Post
Just out of curiosity (and this isn't sarcastic or rhetorical in the least), if engineers can simply EQ away the difference that a lousy cable makes, couldn't the listener also get an EQ for under/matching the price it would cost to completely outfit a rig with high-end cables and then just tweak that to their preference? If it works for the ones producing the music, why wouldn't it work for the end user?

I ask not because I think that cables don't make a difference; I'm just not entirely convinced that EQ is the reason why professionals don't use high end cables, especially given people like Steve Hoffman who IIRC uses such high end cables - but I can't see him mastering basically anything without some sort of EQ.
I agree and I have made the same observation before. Never got an answer.
I am curious though. The EQing they do in studios would make any audible cable difference moot....
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post #105 of 157
3/13/09 at 7:00pm
I believe in cable differences for my system, but i do not believe you have to spend crazy dollars to get it right. I think if you try many reasonably priced cables, youll find one that has synergy with your system.

Audiophile purists wont use an EQ because too many things in the line will eventually cause distortion and loss of detail.

The guys that make your CDs are not going to keep trying wire combos etc, because they would have to do it with every band they record. So many mic and amp and instrument and processor combos!!!

Also most audio engineers just dont buy into all the cable hype anyway.
They do believe in quality-made cables with good connections and shielding,as i said earlier.

EQing is for a last resort if you just cant get the sound right naturally with componants,wires,speakers,room acoustics,etc.
If you do resort to an EQ, you need one that matches the level of your equipments quality. I dont know any company that makes a truly high-end audiophile EQs, because most real high-end audiophiles do not use EQs anyway, so the best might be a good quality Pro mixer EQ.

I have a decent EQ made by Coustic.
Sometimes i use it for certain recordings, especially live ones recorded at local venues by friends of mine, but mostly i dont use an EQ.
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