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Orgy of Capacitors: The Cap Thread - Page 41

post #601 of 608

Hi Lehmanhill, it was reading your post which sparked my interest in the K71-4. As I mentioned I have the 10uf K71-4 paralleled a 0.1uf K72P-6 and a 1uf MBM. I think the MBM mix with the them, while the MBMs add a bit of body they are also quite transparent which is very important when you are dealing with caps like the K17-4. Further, adding these to the mix did not mess up the soundsgate which was improved by the K72P-6.

 

I have had this combination in my amp for a few days now but I think I a slightly smaller MBM cap might be better. I just finished some more testing with and without the MBM tonight. Without the MBM the combination f K71-4 and K72 has deeper and punchier bass but the bass also sounds a bit more forced, boxy, and less natural. There is also less bass in quantity overall signature is more forward with a more attack and airy highs. Upper mids are emhasised voices and guitars really stand out. I also think the sound is slightly more detached from the speakers but this could be due to the forward signature.

 

With the MBM caps the sound becomes more focused on the midrange instead of upper mids and highs. Overall the sound is more balanced. The sound is less punchy but much more natural and organic with transients being more drawn out. I think a smaller MBM cap might retain just a bit more airiness and make the sound just a tad punchier and more detached from the speakers.

 

Today I asked an ebay seller to make me a selection of MBM caps of different values. When these arrive I will play around with them a bit to see what ratio is best.

 

Also, I have seen these in widely different voltage ratings from 160 up to 1500. I wonder what the sonic differences are.


Edited by Jasper9395 - 3/14/15 at 9:22am
post #602 of 608

Hi. I have a question about mundorf s/g/o caps.

I have a LD MKVI+ amp and I want to upgrade the caps to Mundorf s/g/o .

Someone I know used .64uf caps and said they made the amp sound like a whole new amp.

I found a good deal on 1uf caps and I'm wondering if I risk anything by going up to 1uf.

I would assume there is a size that is considered "too big" and since my friend found nirvana in the .64uf caps I might be risking bad synergy by getting something bigger.

Any thoughts?


Edited by coinmaster - 3/5/15 at 8:57pm
post #603 of 608
Quote:
Originally Posted by coinmaster View Post

Hi. I have a question about mundorf s/g/o caps.



I have a LD MKVI+ amp and I want to upgrade the caps to Mundorf s/g/o .



Someone I know used .64uf caps and said they made the amp sound like a whole new amp.



I found a good deal on 1uf caps and I'm wondering if I risk anything by going up to 1uf.



I would assume there is a size that is considered "too big" and since my friend found nirvana in the .64uf caps I might be risking bad synergy by getting something bigger.



Any thoughts?


 



To avoid risk, I always rolling caps with same value. Caps can be Film Capacitors and Oil Capacitors , Teflon etc.
I tried Jensen PIO and Mundorf SGO on my SET 300B amp, I prefer SGO..
post #604 of 608

OK time for an update on the MBM paper in wax capacitors

 

The MBM capacitors sound very warm, full bodied, and have a slightly rolled off though extended top end. They really bring out the bass and lower mids while providing a lot of texture. Another positive trait of this capacitor is that it does not effect soundstage negatively, this is an area where it in on par with the teflon caps. While the MBM is very transparent, it does not quite exhibit the same level of transparency as the teflon K72P-6, FCH or the polystyrene K71-4. The character of the bass is different to that of the teflon capacitors which have a tighter, more controlled bass, sound a bit drier and provide less bass quantity. Overall the character of this capacitor actually reminds me of the Mundorf Supreme although the Mundorf is far less transparent.

 

In terms of price these are inexpensive, I bought a bag with about 30 MBM caps of different values for 4.75 USD. Another positive is that these caps are relatively compact. This is especially true for the 160v version. The 750v MBM capacitors are quite a bit larger. I have experimented a little with the 160v and 750v versions, keeping the capacitance the same, the 750v version is more transparent bringing it close to the level found in teflon caps.  

 

These capacitors mix quite well with teflon caps as well as the K71-4 capacitor as they add a bit of warmth and body while taming the highs. In my pre-amp I have experimented with a mixture of MBM and FCH capacitors which worked quite well. I currently have the MBM in use as a bypass on the K71-4 input capacitor of my power amp. I decided to only keep the bypass on the K71-4 as using them in both places resulted in too much warmth and a slightly wooly sound. Overall I think this is a very nice cap which is worth experimenting with especially if your system sounds bright or cold.

 

In terms of bypassing I am using a 0.25 750v MBM capacitor and a 0.1 uf K72P-6 to bypass a 10uf K71-4 this is working quite well. Before I was using a 1uf MBM which in my system was too large a value.

 

These are the 750v and 160v versions of the 0.25uf MBM capacitor


Edited by Jasper9395 - 3/17/15 at 7:34pm
post #605 of 608

Nice report.  I have got to make some time to play with them.

 

One thought since they are a bit stronger at the bottom than the top.  It might be fun to cut away the outer aluminum can as Jon and others have done with other caps.  Since it is a paper in wax cap, I expect it will be dry inside.  You could just wrap it with several layers of kraft paper for insulation, candle wax seal the ends, and see what happens.  Others write that removing the metal often opens up the high end of a cap.

 

Once again, have fun.

 

Jac

post #606 of 608

Hi Jac,

 

Thanks for the encouragement, I had already done some potting but in the past couple of days I did some more. You were right about the MBM caps being dry inside. Today I read on a ebay sellers page that the MBM caps are waxed paper and aluminium foil which seems to be correct.

 

Here is a picture of one of the 750v MBM caps which I opened.

 

So far I have removed the metal sleeve and encased two K73-16 caps (crossover), and four FCH caps (pre-amp) in candle wax. I also removed the metal sleeve from two MBM (input cap bypass) caps and wrapped these in baking paper. I am using these inside my amp as I am afraid wax could melt inside. My impression from these three modifications is that it gets rid of unwanted distortion while not changing the basic character of the capacitors. The result is that the background becomes darker while transients are revealed. By transients I mean the decaying frequencies associated with a particular sound. These become more audible which makes everything sound more realistic/natural.

 

My impression was also that the caps don't need to burn in again after having wax applied. Rather I think it takes a little time to get used to the new sound.

 

I was wondering what the advantage of using bees wax is? Also, can anyone recommend materials to pot capacitors in which have higher melting points?

 

I might order some FT3 capacitors to compare to the FCH. It would be interesting to compare them to a better known teflon cap.


Edited by Jasper9395 - 3/23/15 at 8:44am
post #607 of 608

I can suggest one idea for a high temp potting material, but I haven't tried it on a capacitor, so I don't know the sonic effects, if any.

 

Devcon 2 Ton Epoxy (Devcon 35345) is an epoxy that is available at local home and hardware centers here in the US.  I'm not sure if it is available in the Netherlands, but hopefully there is something similar available.  The advantage of using this for potting is that it doesn't shrink when it dries and doesn't get too hot when curing.  I have used it for electronic circuit boards that need moisture or vibration protection, but it has a service temperature up to about 93 degree C, so it should be good inside an amp.  Epoxy has a higher dielectric constant than, say teflon, which might suggest more distortion, but then, many capacitors are dipped in epoxy, so I'm not sure what to think.

 

What would be ideal would be to find a low temperature curing polymer with low shrinkage and a very low dielectric constant.  Perhaps potting the cap in a housing in wax with just a cap of epoxy to seal the wax in place.

 

Jac

post #608 of 608

Hi Jac,

 

Turns out we do have Devcon 2 Ton Epoxy here. It's not cheap though, almost 15 euros for an amount that covers just 15 square cm. Your idea of encasing the wax in it is interesting though. I was thinking another option could be to encase the wax in varnish. Varnish is sometimes used to pot or vacuum impregnate transformers although it is also possible to use epoxies. I am not knowledgeable at all about what materials would be best suited though.

 

BTW I also read that the operating temperature of the MBM caps only goes up to 70 degrees celsius so I am guessing the caps would basically melt if heated to a temperature higher than this.

 

Best,

Jasper

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