Originally Posted by selfdivider
I hear you, White Mike, on how you should approach audio not only subjectively but objectively as well. Before you think that I'm bashing on 840C, you should know I had 840C in my system for a couple months and if you look in my previous posts, you'll see that I was one of the guys who came to the fore about the 840C and praised it highly in this forum and elsewhere. Then I heard the PS1 in my system, and as I've said, whatever happened happened.
One thing that I don't understand is why it should piss anyone off if someone likes one component or the other. What's up with that? Another thing I don't like is the usual simplistic cliche/stereotyping... if you like certain component, you must be a subjectivist, and if you like the other, you must be an objectivist, that kind of reductive bs. What is this, some audio Bloods vs. Crips or something?
Lame. I think White Mike has it exactly right when he says you have to have the right balance of subjective & the objective.
That said, on PS1: rolled eyes or not, many people do like it. Some people will get it. Some people won't. Skullguise and I DEFINITELY hear glare/sheen on Cambridge Audio 840C, some people can't. Based on that, would I roll my eyes at people who don't/can't hear that? No... because as Jay-Z says in "Heart of the City," - "What I eat don't make you sh*t." Who the hell cares?!? We all hear differently, at different times.
And as for the reasoning that PS1 must be crap b/c it's a crap video game machine from the past, and it's all voodoo... I'd say that's faulty logic, too. If you know John Devore at all, in fact, if you know any artisanal speaker makers, they're hard core into science of it all. They have to be, in order to build top-end speakers which sound well, as well as measure well. Which means they approach each component objectively first, with skepticism. When he puts in PS1 confidently at a show & not in his living room, I'm sure he's not doing it on a roll of the dice or voodoo magic. Another example is John Marks of Stereophile who reviewed PS1 in April issue; it was an unfavorable review. He said it wasn't worth the trouble & plans to sell his unit on ebay again (he seems to have gotten one with a tracking problem). But even with the negative review, he still preferred its sound to the $999 Music Hall CDP/receiver. Given the fact that he didn't like the PS1 much, I'd say his opinion was pretty objective.
At the end of it all, I think you have to approach everything with an open mind, w/o prejudice. There's no doubt that 840C represents one of the best bang-for-the-buck, I never questioned that. With the digital-in, it's a killer, and I seriously debated on keeping it, even just to use it with my SB3. I'm still trying to get a CDP with a digital-in, b/c 840C was just too convenient like that... I don't think I can get a traditional CDP anymore, which is one of the reasons why I won't buy the Primare or Consonance players...
But seriously, I don't get why some people have to be so dogmatic about their approach to audio, that they just have to assume the worst about some people's preference or approach - oh he must be a dunce following rumors, etc., it just CAN'T be good. Seems pretty condescending to me. Doesn't seem too objective either. As a matter of fact, it's the exact opposite of objectivity if you think about it. Because that kind of judgment operates out of assumptions and pre-conceived opinions. I'm not saying I'm the de facto objectivist here (I don't even want to be that kind of an objectivist anyways), but at least I tried both approaches with an open mind. I liked 840C a lot, but I just liked PS1 better. That's that.
Thanks for the more detailed reply, in ansewering some of the many questions which come to mind to anyone who , having the C.A. Azur in their system, naturally would have come to mind; Ig. burn-in (which now you say was running for 50 days), on and on, trying to square how it is a seemingly,(although now I can see that isn't the case), drive by poster chips in (without much of the follow-up info, given, then only upon being challenged), "the Playstation v1 "outclassed" the 840c in my system" a $10,000 system.
As you say, if my position was out of line, then my bad. No foul intended ...
Skullguiese, best of luck with the new Dac solution from fiercefreek, who IIRC bought the 840c replacing it(?)...
Back to the subject, no one addresed the source material being played, other than what I was trying to allude to with folks, in terms of their preference for the most analog sounding, which is an ideal, difficult, if not nearly unheard of "due to the digital source medium itself in combination with the materials mixing" especially if ones referance is causing folks to deal with the many drawbacks of T.T.s or exclusively $2400 machines or $20 PSv1s.... At this point no reply is necessary, as I'm now satisfied in my comprehension of the issues...
Not at all trying to be combative or defensive, but just to further flesh out in specific terms these positions for further understanding...Which I'm satisfied with, at this point, both due to the discussion, and my understanding now derived from it...
In any event, my 740c is settling in quite nicely, now in its 9th day of all but continuous operation, playing "lay It down" Cowboy Junkies, gorgeously here, without my tube pre inline...Bloods,
P.S. , we have nearly all been exposed to interjections of the typical arguement of what's most important to achievement of sonic bliss, in hardware choices in a system, specificly to wit, Speakers matter most or Source first exclusivity, rather than the mainstream of the majority, I believe from experience to be, a balanced "system" delivers best results in and towards, the persuit of the ever compromised ideal of "sonic bliss"... And perhaps this too, is a good part of the very real issue I have with believing any other such system configuration of either/or thinking, delivering those experiences (build issues and or, utility aside),of near(albeit ever compromised), sonic bliss...
In conclusion, "If it sound "good", it is good"-