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Review: ZERO 24 BIT/192KHz DAC/Headphone Amp/Pre-Amp - Page 89

post #1321 of 9228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henmyr View Post
I have now used LT1057 in the dac and LT1469, LT1361, LT1364, LME49720, LT1358 in the amp. With my headphones (dt880 05 250ohm, ms2i, dt990 05 32ohm), I find LT1469 to be the winner in the amp.

dac + amp:

LT1057 + LT1469 sounds very musical and euforic with a very beautiful midrange, but still with ok air and everything else. I find that it's the combo with the most bass out of all those also. It is rather coloured, but in a nice musical way, the timber is ok but nothing special. The sound is on the warm side.

LT1057 + LT1361 was very airy and quite pleasent sounding, it was the brightest of the bunch. It had some sharp edges which made the sound very clear.

LT1057 + LT1364 I didn't think that the difference between LT1361 and LT1364 would be as large as it was. The sound was still airy, but not as much as with LT1361. The midrange was not as clear and sharp as with LT1361, a little dry but still pleasant. I did not find it harsh at all. The timber was probably the best of the bunch.

LT1057 + LME49720 This combo is similar to LT1469, but takes the euforic sound a bit too far, which makes it a bit too colored. From what I've read, LME49720 is very similar to LM4562, and thus should not be very colored so I guess that it's LT1057 which shines through. The sound is airy but still thick at the same time. The midrange is about the same as with LT1469. I will not use this combo as LT1057 + LT1469 was very similar but better.

LT1057 + LT1358 This was a really strange combo. The sound was reeeally relaxed. I could easily fall asleep listening to this. It sounded like the music was playing in slow motion, had to check all of my settings in foobar to be sure that there wasn't something wrong. Not a harsh note found. The midrange was rather dry and soothing. It was hard to pinpoint what made the sound so slow, but it sounded like the music was "floating" on water. Every edge was softened.

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The focus of LT1057 in the dac is not air, details, and timber. This will be found elsewhere. It does have a nice clear midrange which works very well with ms2i and dt880. It was okey for dt990 also, but I think that I will find a better one with just a tad more bass control. I found every combination to be more or less to the warm side, with LT1361 the most neutral and LT1469/LT1358 the warmest.

LT1057 did not show a large amount of bass and it was not super tight. Only LT1469 did carry some bass weight.

The treble was not overpowering in any way. I can not say for sure if it's the LT1057 which have rather laid back hights, or if it was the op-amps used in the amps which held it back. Only LT1361 and LT1364 to some extent let the airy sparkly treble of the dt880 shine. DT990 did have the sparkle to some extent with every pair.

I would say that the LT1057 worked best with MS2i + bowls, it was not airy and clear enough for me to use flats.

I'm not sure if I've found the best combination for the beyers yet, not to say that it didn't sound good, but for the MS2i the LT1057 + LT1469 could very well come out high in the end.

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LT1057 + LT1469 will be in the zero for now, until I get the chance to try another one in the dac and make all comparisons again. The warmness of the combination might get me in the end and I might try to find a more neutral combination, but for now it will do.

LT1057 + LT1364 was the next best combination I think.

EDIT: The only combination I might use instead of the stock combination is LT1057+LT1469 due to it's euphoric and "fun" colored sound with good prat, in mostly all other aspecs, it is worse than stock. Stock is more airy and has better timber, better bass, more hights, larger headroom, better detail and more natural and neutral.
Thanks for sharing your findings! I noted your current combo 1xLT1057@DAC / 2xLT1469@AMP is listed as good/good while the reversed combo is listed as great/great. Just wondering did you only use LT1057 in the DAC all the time, if you have two LT1057s why not try the recommended 1xLT1469@DAC / 2xLT1057@AMP instead? Might be a win/win combo for you too
post #1322 of 9228
Quote:
Originally Posted by aural1ty View Post
Thanks for sharing your findings! I noted your current combo 1xLT1057@DAC / 2xLT1469@AMP is listed as good/good while the reversed combo is listed as great/great. Just wondering did you only use LT1057 in the DAC all the time, if you have two LT1057s why not try the recommended 1xLT1469@DAC / 2xLT1057@AMP instead? Might be a win/win combo for you too
I will try that combination also when I get there LME49720 is the next one to take the place in the dac. I will get to LT1469 in the dac eventually, maybe after LME49720
post #1323 of 9228
Quote:
Originally Posted by aural1ty View Post
My phones are 40 Ohm and this is kinda putting me off I'm not sure if it would get bothersome for me in the long run, was thinking of hooking it up to the game console so won't be able to back down the source then..
I tried the same song again with the dt990 32ohm and the peak volume is now 72db with an average around 68-70db. So the gain has been lowered by burn-in and is now acceptable.

EDIT: Also, this is when using LME49720 in both dac and amp (got 3 of those). Will try the stock later and see if that is as low also.
post #1324 of 9228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allure View Post
Hmm no I don't think..
Well maybe the gain hasn't been lowered, but the channel imbalance might have recessed. When I first got it, I turned the volume up to the point where no channel imbalance was evident, and at that time it was around 78dB. When I tried it now, the volume when the channel imbalance is gone is around 70dB average.

In any case, it is now possible to listen at 70dB, something which was not possible with dt990 32ohm when it was new.
post #1325 of 9228
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allure View Post
Hmm no I don't think..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henmyr View Post
Well maybe the gain hasn't been lowered, but the channel imbalance might have recessed. When I first got it, I turned the volume up to the point where no channel imbalance was evident, and at that time it was around 78dB. When I tried it now, the volume when the channel imbalance is gone is around 70dB average.

In any case, it is now possible to listen at 70dB, something which was not possible with dt990 32ohm when it was new.
This would also be variable due to specs on the Opamps used. Some have less output and this would be noticeable in the end.
post #1326 of 9228
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by aural1ty View Post
Thanks for sharing your findings! I noted your current combo 1xLT1057@DAC / 2xLT1469@AMP is listed as good/good while the reversed combo is listed as great/great. Just wondering did you only use LT1057 in the DAC all the time, if you have two LT1057s why not try the recommended 1xLT1469@DAC / 2xLT1057@AMP instead? Might be a win/win combo for you too
The chart was developed with Senn HD-650 use. Other headphones will have a different end result for sure.
post #1327 of 9228
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allure View Post
I think that the LT1469 may just be the sweet spot for the DAC between resolution and musicality for many setups.
Eventually, I'm going to go back and check this one with my newly broke in HD-600s and see what is what. I sure do like the LT1469 and the LT1364. What they bring to the Zero is nothing short of spectacular!
post #1328 of 9228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Penchum View Post
I'll answer this, even though I'm not sure it was for me.
The Opamp in the DAC is very important for the built-in headphone amp. It is the first signal processing that happens, and is then routed to the headphone board for more, by the Opamps there. So, some "flavor" happens in the DAC and some "flavor" happens in the headphone amp. The final result is a mix of both "flavors". This is why testing is done to "combinations" of Opamps in both places. Does this help some?
yea it was directed at you ,

and thanks that was really helpful
post #1329 of 9228
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmel View Post
It's time to remove the sunglasses ... my Zero LED Mod:

1) Unscrew the LED circuit board.
2) Remove the following 3 resistors and solder 4.7kOhm 1% resistors into the empty places.
3) Test the brightness in relation to the green LED. If it is still too bright, try 10kOhm or more.


4) Reinstall the LED circuit board.
Hi KMEL, what power rating are the resistors? Also my power LED keeps going off, then dim, its back again now but was out for 4 days, any ideas?

Thanks
post #1330 of 9228
I have now tested LME49720 in the dac and LME49720, LT1057, LT1469, LT1361, LT1364 and LT1358 in the amp using my phones (dt880 05 250ohm, ms2i, dt990 05 32ohm). LT1469 was my favorite of the bunch yet again.
----------------------------------------
Dac + amp

LME49720 + LME49720 : Clear sound, okey details, airy. The timber and naturality is not perfect. Works okey for all 3 headphones, but good and best with dt990. I though that the treble was going to be overpowering, but that wasn't something I found at all.

LME49720 + LT1057 : The sound of LT1057 show itself again, the midrange focused, closed in and unharsh sound. A lot of air is lost, as is detail, naturality, bass, treble and timber. The LT1057 midrange is good and detailed. Not harsh at all.

LME49720 + LT1469 : My favorite of the bunch. Very natural sound, neutral, transparent and airy but still musical and quite euphoric (not as euphoric as LT1057+LT1469 but better at everything else). The sound is similar to the zero stock op-amps, a bit more detailed maybe. The treble sparkles nicely and let the beyersound through. Was very good for both DT880 and MS2i (really good with both bowls and flats), though not the best for dt990 as it sounded a bit like the midrange was more sucked out than usual. Better timber for brass instruments with ms2i than usual. Overall a nice sounding one.

LME49720 + LT1361 : EXTREMELY clear and airy. Yet again the LT1361 shows it's clear and airy sound, just as it did when LT1057 was in the dac. This is the clearest sound yet. Sounds similar to LT1469 but with a little less naturality and much more focus on treble and more air. Very much details, especially in the treble.

LME49720 + LT1364 : Yet again the difference between LT1361 and LT1364 is big. It sounds a bit like with both LT1469 and LT1361, but with softer edges, and less details and everything else. Not a favorite.

LME49720 + LT1358 : LT1358 really shows it's face again. The very strange sound from when LT1057 was the dac is still here. Sounds like slow motion. The words from the singers sounds much longer than usual, like they keep the note much much longer. I'm not sure why it sounds like this, very very strange. Otherwise the sound is very similar to LT1364. I liked the combination of LT1057 + LT1358 more than this combination, as LT1057 + LT1358 had a much more focused tonality. This combination doesn't really have anything nice at all, where as LT1057+LT1358 at least had some euforic sound from LT1057.
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LME49720 in the dac sounds very clear and airy. The timber and naturality is good, but not perfect so it needs help with those, something the LT1469 and LT1361 could do. The treble is sparkly and detailed, but not overpowering, a very nice one. The bass is tight and with a good amount.

It worked well as a dac out to the headfive, something which the LT1057 wasn't very good at.

Out of all these, LME49720+LT1469 will be placed on my "alternative op-amps list" together with LT1057+LT1469.
The stock is still in the fight.

I find the stock to be a very nice sounding one indeed. Good at everything and bad at nothing, fun but still neutral and natural, clear and airy but not harsh.
post #1331 of 9228
Replaced my headphone opamps with LT1469, I left the DAC alone as I am still waiting for my 627's (i odered sm ones before doh).

I thought it was a tad bright at first, but now its had some time to burn in its a lot better, not quite the impact my LD MKV has.
post #1332 of 9228
I have just put LT1364 in dac and LT1469 in headphone amp, sounds great
post #1333 of 9228
this might sound like a silly question

but is there a particular opamp that seems to perform best in the headphone amp???
post #1334 of 9228
This might also be an stupid question..
For the time being my zero is connected to an normal cd player (burnin).
The primary and future use will be connected to my pc.

When playing music, I have heard that one is supposed to use passthrough.. to get a bitperfect transfer to the DAC (in my case optical out from my audio card)

question: If the computer is configured for audio passthrough, what will happen when i use my computer to see movies which have an none stereo signal? (i.e. ac3)
post #1335 of 9228
that LT1364 gets so isn't it a stabilty problem? I have read that..
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