[krmathis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AuroraProject /img/forum/go_quote.gif I forgot the OS doesn't come with iLife. As a side note, anyone know how Apple controls piracy of the OS? There is no serial number with the Leopard package, how do they lock it down?

They trust the end user.
But Mac OS X only run on Apple hardware. So they don't totally loose anyway, since you need to update the hardware once in a while...

 

[blessingx]

I'm surprised there are so many Camino users. I'm glad it's out there, was once a user and used to work with its primary developer, but Safari is so fast and stable and people are actually asking if Firefox should switch to WebKit/KHTML now. Camino, which once felt like the best of both worlds, now feels like the worst of both to me. Not as fast as Safari, not supporting all OS X services like Safari and not supporting most extensions like Firefox. To each their own of course.

 

[kugino]

Quote:

Originally Posted by blessingx /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm surprised there are so many Camino users. I'm glad it's out there, was once a user and used to work with its primary developer, but Safari is so fast and stable and people are actually asking if Firefox should switch to WebKit/KHTML now. Camino, which once felt like the best of both worlds, now feels like the worst of both to me. Not as fast as Safari, not supporting all OS X services like Safari and not supporting most extensions like Firefox. To each their own of course.

i sort of understand where you're coming from...but this latest version of camino is very fast so i don't miss safari's speed. it still does some sites like USPS and various travel sites better than safari. and with built-in flash and ad blocking, it's preferable to having a plugin or add-on to achieve the same with safari. its inability to do extensions is a PLUS for me...FF is bloated, slow, and almost useless when extensions are added.

still, i tend to use both...both does different things well and i'm happy to use both.

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by krmathis /img/forum/go_quote.gif They trust the end user. But Mac OS X only run on Apple hardware. So they don't totally loose anyway, since you need to update the hardware once in a while...

True for say in my case...my student stipend has software upgrades as part of the budget so I am able to go with "school cash" to the school shoppe and buy a license. So far nothing fancy. But my wife has a Mac too. I could just as easily install my 10.5 on hers with no problem and not have had to pay the "Family" license when I merely paid for a regular license at the student cost.

Of course I could have saved the budget 120 bucks nad just downloaded it, but I have no qualms paying for software I will use so long as I am not forced into it and there are real world benefits. I'm still a major fan of FOSS and I use that exclusively at home, but for work...some things just require closed source pro apps and with the new Mac systems...bootcamp included, I get everything I want in one unit despite the OS being mostly closed. Trust the user goes a long way. Too bad Apple doesn't do this for all things, or permit flexibility everywhere *cough*FLAC support on iPods*cough*

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by blessingx /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm surprised there are so many Camino users. I'm glad it's out there, was once a user and used to work with its primary developer, but Safari is so fast and stable and people are actually asking if Firefox should switch to WebKit/KHTML now. Camino, which once felt like the best of both worlds, now feels like the worst of both to me. Not as fast as Safari, not supporting all OS X services like Safari and not supporting most extensions like Firefox. To each their own of course.

I too felt this way and acted the same way...starting with Safari because it was the stock browser, then realizing it had speed and rendering issues. I then went to Firefox but hoped Camino would be a better fit. It wasn't for me over time as Safari and Firefox either sped up or supported more sites/extensions. Eventually I went with Opera and have been using it up until this week when Safari blew my mind with its speed. I'll eventually fall back to Opera though (speed dial is such a winning feature for me) and it is the only multi-platform browswer that doesn't take a hit depending on the OS its running on. I like consistancy.

 

[kugino]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wodgy /img/forum/go_quote.gif I just downloaded it now and it worked for me... try this URL: http://pimpmycamino.com/parts/morecamino

just installed it...and it doesn't really do anything new for me. plus, some options are in red, i.e., not usable because it says i need a newer version of camino. ?? oh well...

 

[unclejr]

Safari is not faster in my experience, plus I favor gecko over webkit any day, from my own (meager) site development perspective as well as general browsing. I find Camino faster than Safari and more reliable -- that is when I have Camino's user agent spoofed so sites think it's Firefox! This more or less completely eliminates the silly problems I have with websites.

I usually spend a lot of time in Camino, and then for a site or two use Safari or Firefox (or Shiira -- another webkit based browser, when I'm really feeling adventurous), and I'll then try to switch for longer terms on Firefox or Safari. The speed or UI issues that I have with those browsers usually send me quickly back to Camino.

I also find that most of Camino's problems are because the gecko build it's using happens to be a bit buggy. A nightly build usually helps that out.

 

[Wodgy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by blessingx /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm surprised there are so many Camino users. I'm glad it's out there, was once a user and used to work with its primary developer, but Safari is so fast and stable and people are actually asking if Firefox should switch to WebKit/KHTML now. Camino, which once felt like the best of both worlds, now feels like the worst of both to me. Not as fast as Safari, not supporting all OS X services like Safari and not supporting most extensions like Firefox. To each their own of course.

Darn, I had written a long response to this, ironically inside Safari, and it got lost. That reminds me that Safari's text preservation on back button clicks is nowhere as good as Camino or Firefox. It's on par with IE's behavior, which is unfortunate.

I don't really feel like re-writing my response, but there are many, many reasons to choose Camino, from better adoption of Mac technologies (AppleScript, real toolbar customization, etc. -- and yes, services support is in Camino trunk) to a more practical approach to color management, to way better customizability, to not needing InputManager plugins to do things, to compatibility, on and on.

The only advantages I see to Safari are speed (especially over Camino trunk, it is true) and the nice search overlay. But even on that latter point, it doesn't have type-to-search, so for searching they're really just tied.

The one massive beef I have with Safari is its color management. It has the potential to be the most color-accurate browser on any platform, but due to an absolutely inappropriate choice in implementation which Dave Hyatt continues to defend for silly reasons, the majority of web graphics that don't have color profiles embedded look wrong on Safari. (Specifically, if an image doesn't have an embedded color profile, Safari uses the monitor color profile rather than assuming sRGB, as the W3C standards dictate. I'm not joking, the monitor profile!) Leopard makes this a little better, in that if an image lacks a ColorSync profile but has sRGB EXIF information, it uses sRGB, so at least most Flickr images will look right, but I fear that this will only make it harder to get Hyatt to move from his position on the default color space. It's sad, because of course Safari could have the best color representation in the world -- and for a selection of pro photography sites where many photos have embedded profiles, it is already true -- but on the majority of sites Safari does absolutely the worst thing.

 

[Pangaea]

Just got my copy from apple. So far it is very easy to use and I like the improvements. One issue- I had something downloaded on my old OS that allowed me to open a blank internet page in the same window by simply double clicking just below the address bar. Very convenient and def. a 3rd party appl. Whatever it was Leopard got rid of it. Do you guys know how to get that back with Leopard?

DISREGARD- figured it out- just right click with arrow in the bar and it gives you the option to open another safari page/ tab in the same window.

 

[blessingx]

Well installed last night. So far like the improvements. Did a clean install so while the OS is quicker, I'm not sure the cause. Only problem has been a Microsoft keyboard.

Sure there are drivers to fix that. Overall like the GUI changes once I dumped the space theme.

 

[trose49]

Quote:

Originally Posted by trose49 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Anyone try to upgrade on a G5? I usually do a clean install. Is there any dif vs doing it as an upgrade? besides the obvious, I mean will it run faster it starting from blank HD?

Still unanswered?

 

[Wodgy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by trose49 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Still unanswered?

I doubt it will make any difference in speed whether you do an upgrade or a clean install. (This isn't like Windows.) If you're in doubt, use the "Archive and Install" option, which is halfway between a clean install and an upgrade.

Do note however that if you have the abomination known as APE (Unsanity Application Enhancer) installed in any form (this includes some Logitech mouse drivers), it is best to totally remove it before using the upgrade option.

 

[450]

I really hate myself for gettign a Vostro now...

If only the MB had dedicated vid...

 

[kugino]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 450 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I really hate myself for gettign a Vostro now... If only the MB had dedicated vid...

yeah, the dedicated vid would be nice. however, the integrated graphics have been upgraded in the latest MB update...and the max ram has been upped to 4GB, which should take a little bit of the sting off the integrated graphics.

 

[Wodgy]

The GMA X3100 is pretty good... in general I think the integrated/dedicated graphics distinction is becoming artificial. It makes more sense to look at performance. Even the lowly GMA 950 is much faster than dedicated graphics cards from 2-3 years ago. And the major advantage with these integrated chipsets is longer battery life, which Apple builds upon by using the battery-efficient Seagate Momentus series hard drives. Especially for students who plan to take notes on their laptops, don't discount the importance of good battery life, because you can't depend on being plugged in everywhere.