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markl Mod for Denon AH-D5000 (With Pics!) - Page 4

post #46 of 295
10/28/07 at 2:27pm
I am still blown me away what a difference this makes to the sound stage and the tonality. It almost makes me think Denon built these on paper and never actually did any testing.
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post #47 of 295
10/28/07 at 2:59pm
I also tried the mod with some power wire about the same thickness as the cotton in the pads. Sounds the same and much easier to do. I don't think you really need the tape or just a minimal amount. It would also allow you to fine tune it with different sizes of wire/tubing/rope/anything round very easily with no wear or tear on the pads. And since there is no tape the pads go on and off easily and they can still be adjusted.
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post #48 of 295
10/28/07 at 3:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by markl View Post
Also, forget about the cans stock, you will hear all the flaws I laid out at the top of the thread. The mods do not make the cans utterly perfect, but allieviates the issues considerably.
Come on now.... I don't think you should tell people to forget about the stock D5000. They sound much better than many top-tier cans out there. I'm sure your mod makes them sound even better, but other people (such as myself) prefer the level of bass the Denon already offer that you don't care for.

Don't get me wrong, I'd still try the mod if I had a second pair. I just have no desire to void my warranty. I don't have that kind of cash to throw around.

And Caribou679,
Before you knock the Denon's so bad, I suggest you listen to them.
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post #49 of 295
10/28/07 at 3:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by naamanf View Post
I also tried the mode with some power wire about the same thickness as the cotton in the pads. Sounds the same and much easier to do. I don't think you really need the tape or just a minimal amount. It would also allow you to fine tune it with different sizes of wire/tubing/rope/anything round very easily with no wear or tear on the pads. And since there is no tape the pads go on and off easily and they can still be adjusted.
Good point. I used the cotton without the tape. The plastic cup trick holds the cotton in just fine.


Quote:
Originally Posted by IPodPJ View Post
Don't get me wrong, I'd still try the mod if I had a second pair. I just have no desire to void my warranty. I don't have that kind of cash to throw around.
I would be interested to know how you think Denon will know that you modded them? These mods can be reversed in seconds and don't physically change the cans at all. There is no security tape or secret screws in there.
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post #50 of 295
10/28/07 at 3:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsonad View Post
I would be interested to know how you think Denon will know that you modded them? These mods can be reversed in seconds and don't physically change the cans at all. There is no security tape or secret screws in there.
How are you going to unmod the earcushions when you pull the sewn portions of them away?

How are you going to restore the gold lettering that you rubbed off?

And Markl says once you unscrew the screws they will become loose and you may not be able to put them back in.

That sounds like a pretty un-reversible mod to me.
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post #51 of 295
10/28/07 at 4:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by IPodPJ View Post
And Caribou679,
Before you knock the Denon's so bad, I suggest you listen to them.
Dear Ipodpj,

Sure I will listen to them,eventually!

But have a tought for the nobody like me, who sits and reads this thread and sees a $2 mod applied on a $700 headphone which has as results that a member is ready to sell his R10, probably worth a couple and more thousands $$. And where 4 other members did the mod and are going WOW!

As far as I know Denon might have been bought by Sears( or whatever cie) and this is the results of their "share increase return on the profit."

I find it weird that Denon has not spotted that before and made correction.And they are probably stuck in an administative bureaucracy of dinausors!

Also will this mod work the same for the D2000?

regards,
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post #52 of 295
10/28/07 at 4:54pm
A couple of questions... how thin should the plastic ring be, and what brand plastic cup is 2.5"? I seem to be stuck at 2" or 3"...
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post #53 of 295
10/28/07 at 5:08pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
How are you going to unmod the earcushions when you pull the sewn portions of them away?

How are you going to restore the gold lettering that you rubbed off?

And Markl says once you unscrew the screws they will become loose and you may not be able to put them back in.

That sounds like a pretty un-reversible mod to me.
You aren't doing anything to the sewn portions of the pads. The stuffing just goes loose under the plastic ring and can be simply pulled out. I prefer to use the electrical tape as it allowed me to get a bit more stuffing up under there, but even the electrical tape will simply peel right off.

Yes, the screws are weak, and I wouldn't recommend unscrewing and screwing them in 100 times. I've already read reports of people who have not done any modding who have had screws fall out, and who's lettering has rubbed off. I suspect Denon's repair dept. is already well aware of these issues.

I put that warning in the original post just to make sure people keep this in mind, but I'm 99.9% sure if you simply undo the mod and send it in, they'd never know.

Quote:
A couple of questions... how thin should the plastic ring be, and what brand plastic cup is 2.5"? I seem to be stuck at 2" or 3"...
The cups I actually found at Staples of all places, they are Staples brand. When you set the cup ring into the pad, it should not extend over the pad's plastic ring.
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post #54 of 295
10/28/07 at 5:16pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Come on now.... I don't think you should tell people to forget about the stock D5000. They sound much better than many top-tier cans out there. I'm sure your mod makes them sound even better, but other people (such as myself) prefer the level of bass the Denon already offer that you don't care for.
Sure, but I know Nik fairly well, and I'm certain he'll find the bass overwhelming, so the comment is aimed more at him. Nothing wrong with liking them as is.

But just to clarify, what happens with this mod is not so much a reduction in actual level of bass (though there is a mild one), what happens is more dramatic reduction in the shakes and shivers that the driver passes on the frame and that you feel rattling your skull. Brain interprets this vibration as bass content as it coincides with bass notes, and bass vibrates the air in real life. But it's not actual musical information, it's more like what happens when you sit on one of those gimmicky rump shaker plates that sit under your home theater seat and vibrate in time with the bass to increase your sense of bass presence.

Me, I don't miss all that distracting rattling around, it muddies the image, intrudes into the midrange, and reminds me I've got little drivers strapped to my skull, taking me out of the experience of music.

The damping is still not perfect and it still rattles more than I'd like, but the improvement over stock is still reasonably dramatic.
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post #55 of 295
10/28/07 at 5:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pabbi1 View Post
A couple of questions... how thin should the plastic ring be, and what brand plastic cup is 2.5"? I seem to be stuck at 2" or 3"...
I used a 3" cup and it worked fine. You have to bend the plastic a little to fit it but it holds the cotton in well and snaps back out once you get it in. I used the rolled lip facing toward the pad and the cut edge toward the driver. If you cut it the right height it will fit right under the plastic lip and hold the cotton in without the tape.
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post #56 of 295
10/28/07 at 5:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by markl View Post
Me, I don't miss all that distracting rattling around, it muddies the image, intrudes into the midrange, and reminds me I've got little drivers strapped to my skull, taking me out of the experience of music.

The damping is still not perfect and it still rattles more than I'd like, but the improvement over stock is still reasonably dramatic.

I guess that's why there are so many different headphones out there for all of our ears. I happen to like feeling the bass of my music as well as hearing it, as I would in a live performance. If I can get another pair of earchusions, I will definitely do THAT mod because I think the distance away from the ear will help a little bit.

But I'm not going to do anything until my Opera arrives. ...or my M-Audio card, which I will have to wait until they approve my beta tester application to get the Vista drivers.

Do you think you would need to do the dampening mod on the D2000 since it isn't using a wood cup? If so, you could make a nice little business out of it.
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post #57 of 295
10/28/07 at 6:44pm
I wondered why the heck you were selling your R10's MarkL.

Oh well, cancelled my Sennheiser HD650 order with Amazon and ordered a pair of Denon D5000 from Audiocubes.

This should be interesting...
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post #58 of 295
10/29/07 at 12:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by markl View Post
I like the JVC for the pure grainless resolution they offer, fantastic dynamics and excellent soundstage. They have just the right amount of bass and slam for me as well (nott too much, not too little). On the right material, they can sound awesome. However, where they really fall down is in terms of tone (which is not that natural at all), and the fact that you can "hear" the wooden earcups in their sound.

That said, the JVC sounds very different from the Denons.
Its time to mod the JVCs. I think a bit of stuffing will rid that 'Wooden Earcup sound' you speak off. I've seen inside images of the cups and apart from the driver being in there, a small piece of glue or tape exists to hold the cable to the cups ceiling. By stuffing I mean not cotton balls but damping material attached to the sides. I just purchased my DX1000 phones so I'm a little hesitant to perform this mod right now.
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post #59 of 295
10/29/07 at 7:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by IPodPJ View Post
Do you think you would need to do the dampening mod on the D2000 since it isn't using a wood cup? If so, you could make a nice little business out of it.
I am also wondering this. I dont really detect the rattling. Though I can see the flabbiness of the bass (im not sure id want the higher end boosted any more than it is...)
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post #60 of 295
10/29/07 at 9:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by markl View Post
[...]But just to clarify, what happens with this mod is not so much a reduction in actual level of bass (though there is a mild one), what happens is more dramatic reduction in the shakes and shivers that the driver passes on the frame and that you feel rattling your skull. Brain interprets this vibration as bass content as it coincides with bass notes, and bass vibrates the air in real life. But it's not actual musical information, it's more like what happens when you sit on one of those gimmicky rump shaker plates that sit under your home theater seat and vibrate in time with the bass to increase your sense of bass presence.[...]
By parity of reasoning, all subwoofers are defective, since deep bass does of necessity come with physical impact!

Markl,
Like PJ, I'm one of those who think that there is nothing -- absolutely nothing -- wrong with the D5000's bass. To my mind, it would be a huge mistake for Denon to meddle with the one thing the D5000 does perfectly. Otherwise, there are some really interesting ideas in your mod. I do share in your view that the D5000's drivers deserve better housing. But how much more would we be willing to pay for an improvement on that front? (Look at Sennheisers and Grados in that price range.)

Cheers,
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