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Disturbing Trend - Page 8

post #106 of 528
Oracle CD Player > Nordost Valhalla Interconnect > RSA Apache Headphone Amp > Kimber Silver Headphone Recable > KOSS KSC75 Headphones

If someone cant afford an Apache amp, using a modest amp on a Sennheiser HD650 would be better than a lower model headphone on a matching catagory amp, like a Koss KSC75 and a Cmoy as a paired up match because of price catagory.

Sennheiser HD650's arent so much a dream to try to reach because $350 or so is attainable to have the reasonable "Best", without going as rediculously esoteric as the Orpheous,etc.

A person without as much money can buy a reachable amp for $300 and a Senn 650 and decent cables and maybe a Rotel or similar CD player and have a really good sounding system for under $1200, which for a full system can be attainable for most people. Or buy the nice comfy Senn 650 now, and add later even, and even though its not being run at its best, you know that whatever is before it is at its limit in sound and you at least got the 650 sound signature,if thats your cup of tea.

I have lots of little portable headphones here. Yes i could have just saved my money and got one big killer system, but frankly im having fun just playing with my little toys and listening to how each sounds and helping noobees find their first inexpensive rig.

All my little portable amps are in the $100-$125 range, nothing uber special here, but theyre fun.

I have plans on buying better things ,and all thats in my profile, and i will get them.....but for now, all my little inexpensive toys are alot of fun.

This isnt a contest, or a fashion show, or a test at college.
Match up what makes you happy,and if you can offer some honest advice,then do so. Thats the fun of it all.

Some people here talk their butts off and have 20,000 posts in a year of being here and say nothing, and others have 100 posts and have been here 6 years,and sometimes the guy with 100 posts has owned and heard higher end equipment than the guy with 20,000 posts, but hopefully both are having fun and being a meaningful part of the Head-Fi community no matter what theyre doing,and for how long.
post #107 of 528
Quote:
Originally Posted by boomana View Post
I'm not ridiculing anyone, and that's not what this thread is about. I don't think you have to break the bank to get good sound, and that includes the 701s and 650s. On the other hand, why can't it be said, without being accused of ridicule, that certain headphones don't sound right with portable gear. Find me one portable amp that makes the K701s sound as well as they can sound with even a modest home amp. That's just truth. Where is the ridicule in that?
the ridicule in that stems from your insinuation that if people don't have the resources or the desire to go higher up the chain, then they should.

i haven't seen any posts stating that the tomahawk bests any home amp on the market, and if there are people out there making those claims, there are hardly enough of them to comprise a "disturbing trend."

what is disturbing is some of the delicate sensibilities around here that feel that a headphone is being disrespected or "insulted" [as one poster stated] if not paired with higher end gear. i wasn't aware that headphones had feelings.

if there's anything portable amp users could be guilty of, it would be over enthusiasm and hyperbole. but the same could be said for posters of high end gear, as well.

the mantra here seems to be, "if it sounds good, it is good."

is this just lip service, or something to be typed with one hand while the other crosses its fingers behind one's back?

-a n00b
post #108 of 528
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhaedrusX View Post
the ridicule in that stems from your insinuation that if people don't have the resources or the desire to go higher up the chain, then they should.


-a n00b
can't you read man the post stated twice that no ridicule was intended.

All that was said and or intended is rather than blow your load on a cheap portable and later sell maybe just F-ing maybe you could save up and buy a well regarded yet entry level amp. Like the Heed Can Amp or Eddie Current EC/SS or even a frigging dark voice.
post #109 of 528
,
post #110 of 528

semi articulate post with good intentions

Having heard many set ups with many headphones at over a dozen meets and two nations. I can say this that yes setting up a dedicated home rig is essential to a greater quality experience.

There is no need to spend many thousands of dollars if your budget is tight you can do this for under a grand in most cases.
For example a senn 650 or AKG 701 or Grado 225 used with a scott nixon usb dac or used vdp of audiogon that 5 years ago was the "cats meow" into a heed can amp or ecss or used Dynahi ( a real sleeper of an amp if you can ever find a used one) will afford quality listening sessions.

Is there room to grow yes and could you spend $10,000 easily but you donlt have to if you are budget constrained.

Also as a side note this thread has tickled a thought that always stimulates me. Why is it that everyone has to be special. I mean isn't it ok to struggle and not have the best set but strive for something down the road. What is it about modern humans that we can't simply accept that he our crap isn't the best but it's what I have now and I am simply going to enjoy it.

Peace Out hope to see you all at a meet soon
post #111 of 528
Are there actual quotes for somebody saying that the HD650/K701 is able to give out their fullest potential using portable equipment? I'd like to know, because I rarely see such balant statements.
post #112 of 528
I have not heard many portable amps and have only owned home amps since joining Head-Fi so I can't say whether the OP is right or wrong. What I can say based on my reading of this and other posts by the OP is that she comes off as condescending and yes, somewhat of a Head-Fi elitist snob. As other people have stated already, budget is an important factor to consider when buying gear...and believe it or not, the upgrade journey IS part of the fun for many of us. Many of us have families to support and priorities other than buying what the Head-Fi Elite deem as the "appropriate" equipment necessary to drive an HD650 or K701 to it's fullest potential.

Personally, I take everything I read here with a grain of salt...even from the almighty Head-Fi Elite. I'm here to experience new gear and share those experiences with other people and to have fun. And, along the way, if I offend someone because I suggest a portable amp with an HD650 because I think it sounded really good, well then, so be it. The people on this forum that my suggestion would offend are not worthy of my consideration in the first place.
post #113 of 528
Quote:
Originally Posted by boomana View Post
Every time I check into this forum, I find more and more threads recommending portable amps for headphones like the K701 and the HD650.[snip]

Please note that I'm not saying that a portable amp isn't a good starting point (my first amp was a Headroom mircoamp, which I used with HD580s), can't offer enjoyment, or isn't an appropriate solution for people who travel or, like me, take things back and forth to work. I am saying that I'm disturbed by what I see as a trend that infers that if someone buys the K701s or the HD650, pairing them with a portable amp will give them the quality for which they are known. I'm not trying to be a snob, but I'm a big fan of both the Senns and the AKGs, and it irks me to think they are being short-changed with recommendations that make it appear portable amps will offer them what they need when it's not true.
Bold added for emphasis by me

I'm quoting the original post because reading this thread has made it clear many people who have posted in this thread either didn't read the first post, or skimmed through it. What's so hard to understand?

post #114 of 528
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp11801 View Post
Also as a side note this thread has tickled a thought that always stimulates me. Why is it that everyone has to be special. I mean isn't it ok to struggle and not have the best set but strive for something down the road. What is it about modern humans that we can't simply accept that he our crap isn't the best but it's what I have now and I am simply going to enjoy it.
Not sure where this sentiment comes from but I do agree that the overall point of Head-Fi is to BOTH enjoy what we have now, but also strive for something better down the road.

Returning this thread to the original topic, there have been people coming down on both sides of the argument. If you have a good pair of cans but only a little bit of money leftover for an amp, there are a number of things you can do. You can not buy any amp, buy a portable amp, or buy a desktop amp. The OP was making the point that when a portable amp doesn't cut the mustard, it's better to save up for the proper desktop amp rather than shortchange oneself now only to regret it later.

While this is definitely good advice, it's impossible to say whether this is "right" or "wrong." There is always going to be something better, and there is always going to be something more expensive. So at some point the person has to make a judgment about what they are going to buy and hopefully plan it out well enough to be satisfied with their purchase. To this end, I applaud the OP's advice because it represents a wise financial decision.
post #115 of 528
701 and 650 are not my type of can so I won't comment on them, but I will comment on the grado rs-1. They are so easy to drive that people believe there is no point in even using them with an amp. Well I believe that there exists no headphone amp on the market that can even drive them to their potential. The rs-1 likes a ton of current and tubes. A sissy preamp with a headphone jack or any sort of otl amp just isn't going to get it done right.

Biggie.
post #116 of 528
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp11801 View Post
can't you read man the post stated twice that no ridicule was intended.

All that was said and or intended is rather than blow your load on a cheap portable and later sell maybe just F-ing maybe you could save up and buy a well regarded yet entry level amp. Like the Heed Can Amp or Eddie Current EC/SS or even a frigging dark voice.

This thread started out great and as usual the crowd that just started shaving yesterday had to chime in.
People want to know why those who have knowledge and have tried many amps, sources and headphones don'y post it's half cocked arrogant sh!te like this. Why the F%^K should anyone who has years of experience and could actually lend a hand and ear to you want to help if you are going to act like this. Seriously people no one said oh you spent $500 on an amp then raised their nose.
All that was said was hey people there is a HUGE MFing difference between your portable amp that you just fell in love with and even a decent well designed home amp.

You can't have it both ways guys and gals if you want the well regarded folks that have been around to offer advice we do it all the time and offer suggestions at price points every day then you can't drop your draws and act like you know everything after you bought your first go-vibe


RANT OFF
wow...

i was under the impression that membership did entitle me to chime in.

my mistake. i guess i missed the stickie regarding that.

is this part of the aforementioned campaign to drive off all new members?

if so, i think you've found your new henchman.

i'll leave the playground. you can take my lunch money as well.
post #117 of 528
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by joneeboi View Post
I'd say some of us buy the budget stuff because life's expenses consist of much more than having expensive, proper-headphone-driving listening gear, eg. families, rent or mortgage payments, groceries, transportation, tuition, etc. At the same time, how many non-top-of-the-line products have you bought?
Absolutely! That's why I have repeatedly posted that I believe you can get good sound on a budget. As for my own gear, feel free to read my profile. You'll see that most of what I own/owned has not been top-of-the-line. One of my current fav rigs is an ipod > Rockhopper mini^3 > Yuin Pk1s.

Quote:
And how would you define what drives another piece of equipment well? Would everyone have just home setups because all portable amps are insufficient? Would those who wanted to listen to their HD650s and K701s on the go be forbidden to do so by good head-fi manners because portable amps can't drive them well? To suggest that only home amps can drive HD650s is not only ignorant and intolerant of the budget-fi portion of not only head-fi but in every realm of life, but it is also completely fallacious in itself.
Portable amps are sufficient to drive many headphones, but they do not drive the HD650 and the K701s well. Period. It has nothing to do with manners. It has everything to do with sound. It is not ignorant to state the truth, nor is it intolerant of the budget-fi community. It's just the way it is.

The 650s and 701s, with decent portable amps, may sound better than crappy headphones, but that's not what this thread is about. It's about a trend of people short-changing the sq of two really fine headphones by pairing them with portable amps when it's both inappropriate and not necessary. As Skylab said, there are very decent budget home amps, that can cost less than the better portables, and would make a huge improvement in sound over any one that I have heard.


Quote:
For example, the Grado RA-1 can be considered as a home amp. Incidentally it doubles as a portable amp as the various CMoys that often pop up. You would need to define what a home amp is, and inevitably your definition would either be too broad that it could contain amps such as the RA-1 or too narrow that it would exclude amps like the RA-1.
What the heck are you talking about? You are not making sense.

Quote:
Besides, who's to say that all home amps not only better portable amps in sound, but that they drive all headphones properly? I wouldn't check off your name in that ballot, no matter what gear listing you had.
Some home amps don't drive certain headphones as well as some portables. Other home amps just stink. Some are amazing with certain headphones and not with others, and some headphone designers even voice their amps with certain headphones in mind. Again, what are you talking about? This thread is about the trend of people recommending portables to drive the K701 and HD650.

Quote:
Further, what do you have to say about Tyll Hertsens going the way of the desktop speaker setup? Clearly everyone here should "be interested in the qualities of reference headphones," including one of the premier sponsors and one of the foremen of the headphone amp movement.
I think it's great! I haven't heard it yet, but I hope it blows me away!

Quote:
With your minimalistic view of audio, meets would be pointless because there would be two clearly distinct groups: those with nothing good to listen to since they couldn't afford the rig that drives their headphones well and those that can, whose setups would have very little variation
Dang. I guess I'll have to cancel my attendence at this weekend's meet, and since you've decided what my views on audio are based on one topic, you would also probably find it fit that I step down as one of the planners for this year's International Head-fi Meet. Too bad. I love meets.

Quote:
Not only did you fail in all the aforementioned aspects, but you fail to clarify whether any of these portable amp praisers have heard anything better.


Quote:
I could go on...
Thank you for stopping.
post #118 of 528
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhaedrusX View Post
wow...

i was under the impression that membership did entitle me to chime in.

my mistake. i guess i missed the stickie regarding that.

is this part of the aforementioned campaign to drive off all new members?

if so, i think you've found your new henchman.

i'll leave the playground. you can take my lunch money as well.
yes and you are correct my post was over the top and not aimed directly at you by any means which is why I edited it as you were quoting it just like edited your post. Sometimes we type then reconsider the larger audience and edit
post #119 of 528
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhaedrusX View Post
wow...

i was under the impression that membership did entitle me to chime in.

my mistake. i guess i missed the stickie regarding that.

is this part of the aforementioned campaign to drive off all new members?

if so, i think you've found your new henchman.

i'll leave the playground. you can take my lunch money as well.
OK. BYE.

Make sure you pack your enthusiasm for confrontation along with your sardonic wit with you.
post #120 of 528
Quote:
Originally Posted by boomana View Post
I'm sorry, that's the funniest thing I've seen in a while.

kthxby

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