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post #46 of 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaloS View Post
Correction

HD650 = HD600 with a faster driver, lots more bass, rolled off treble but with a mild boost in upper mids / lower treble. Which one is more refined is left up to the ears of the listener - I can happily listen to balanced HD600 rigs, but I for the life of me cannot start liking HD650.
... The HD650 does not have a boost in the upper midrange, sorry.

Quote:
You have no idea how different the 2 cans sound, do you?
I do, and it isn't very much. This was my first thought when trying out the HD600s at the last Atlanta meet: "Hmm. It sounds a lot like my HD650s... slightly less bass... there is a small spike in the treble."

But the difference was not profound.
post #47 of 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by anadin View Post
To cut a long story short I purchased a pair of SENNHEISER HD600's last week and absolutley loved the sound quality in every way from these cans.

But I kept getting this voice inside my head saying if you think these are good can you imagine what the SENNHEISER HD650's will sound like.

In the end I buckled and returned the HD600's and the shop agreed to exchange them for a pair of HD650's.

I have had the HD650's for around 3 days and to be perfectly honest I hate the sound that is coming from these cans.

The highs are so excruciating to my ears that I cringe at almost every note.

I keep taking them off just to see if anyone has stuck cotton wool into my ears, I know understand why these cans are tarnished with the "veil" trait.

They sound truly dire to my ears and in my opinion the SENNHEISER HD600's are sooooo much better in every way.

It looks like ebay will have a new pair of HD650's very soon.

I want my HD600's back and fast
The 650's are very euphoric to my ears.
post #48 of 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by anadin View Post
Well funny you should mention Turnkey that's exactly where I got them from.

They have a nice display of headphones but the ridiculous thing is they are all rigged up to a 4th gen ipod, Hehe the hd650's hardly made a sound.

I often visit north london to see my beloved Tottenham Hotspurs play.
Can you take them back, armed with an Ipod & portable amp, and try another pair?

Turnkey are usually pretty good for after sales service.

I had a few people (forum members) try my 650s & 600s and no-one ever said they were that far apart soundwise
post #49 of 58
Thread Starter 
The only amp I have is a Musical Fidelity X-Can V3.

Not really portable.

I am going to get another interconnect cable and see if that makes any difference.

Do you have any suggestions.
post #50 of 58
EDIT: I mistook the word excrutiating to mean "sharp"..........the treble is a little tamer on the 650 yes, but in return you get a more refined, organic midrange. It's a matter of taste, try returning the headphones to the store for your old pair.
post #51 of 58
A few personal opinions:

1) The difference between the HD650 and HD600 is fairly pronounced. The degree of tonal difference is fairly small, but the overall effect is that the HD600 is neutral to a fault while the HD650 has a warm, creamy coloration with recessed (but not rolled-off) highs and boosted bass.

2) I can't see how the HD650 would be considered harsh, and I don't think the upper mids/lower treble are boosted at all. However, I can see how the HD650 can be considered fatiguing in the long term. It needs volume in order to shine, and at that volume, the combination of big slam and slow transients starts to grate on my ears, after some time.

3) In terms of transient response/speed and resolution the HD650 is superior to the HD600; it also reaches further down in the bass. If only it had a neutral tonal balance! Sennheiser specifically voiced the HD650 to have a tonal balance that's more appealing to high-end consumers... except that the selfsame high-end consumers usually voice their own systems however they want, or are professionals that don't want a pre-tuned headphone.

Or, I could be wrong. My recording engineer friend uses HD650's, because they approximate the tonal balance of a consumer system while possessing high resolution. Still, his neutral reference headphone is the HD600.

4) The HD600 is, in my opinion, one of the best dynamic headphones ever made. It does things that no other dynamic headphone can - to my ears it's neutral to a fault (I think that the word "neutral" has become synonymous with "bright" in a lot of hi-fi publications and communities, but this headphone is well and truly neutral), has a very accurate tone and tembre, and portrays instruments very realistically. It does struggle with texture, and it is, well, one of the slowest hi-fi headphones out there, if not the slowest, so its abilities with complex music are very limited.

5) If the HD650 isn't doing it for you, while the HD600 is, then get rid of it!. Don't let anybody persuade you otherwise. Sure, you can drive the HD650 balanced, from bright, aggressive sources and fast, lean amplification to make it less dark and laid-back, but as a general rule, system components will fine-tune a speaker's - and a headphone's - performance, but they will not radically alter it. You need to start with a speaker or a headphone that you like, and then build a system around it. If you're fortunate to have a headphone that neatly fits into your sonic preferences, then use it and be done with it. There may be other headphones out there that you'll like (just you wait till you hear the HE90), but that doesn't mean that you have to throw away what you already like to get them.

Cheers,
Cat
post #52 of 58
Very nice post Cat - lovely descriptions. Makes me long for both the 600 and the 650! My wife will only let me have the 580s though .
post #53 of 58
I don't have much time, so I haven't read the whole thread... let me second anyone who has surely already said this: let them burn in!

I had never heard of burn-in when I bought my HD-650's. I was NOT a happy camper at first. The difference in the sound over time sent me on an internet search to find out what was going on! That's actually how I found Head-Fi, if memory serves. Once I heard about burn-in, it started to make sense and I started leaving the cans running relatively quietly all day while I was at work. Pretty soon (a few days made the most difference, but subtle changes continued for a week or two). I was running them out of a Total Bithead at the time, and the most objective change was the ease at which it drove them. That is, at first, I couldn't turn the volume past "barely audible" without the amp clipping - with time I was able to get them louder and louder (it still can't make them really loud, I wouldn't recommend such a small amp for the 650's, honestly - but it certainly isn't bad!)

Also, make sure none of your tubes are blown.
post #54 of 58
Thread Starter 
Hello all you wonderful people its me the person that started this thread.

I am not going to go into to much detail but I just buckled under the sound of those awful sounding HD650's about 3 hours ago and run for the door and promptly headed for my local Hi-Fi store.

I then handed over another large wad of cash and ran excitedly out of the door with a beautiful pair of HD600's under my arm.

I have them on my head as I type this with about an hour of burn in and already they sound like heaven to me.

The harshness of the highs and that awful veil is nowhere to be heard and that over ridiculous exaggerated bass is now a lovely warm thump that is flowing through my body.

I tried the HD650's and yes people will say I didnt give them anywhere near as long to burn in but I knew from the start that I made a big mistake.

Nearly forgot to say just how much more comfortable the HD600's are on my head.

Thank-you everyone for giving me advice but I no longer need any because I have the HD600's and they are here to stay for a very long time.
post #55 of 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by anadin View Post
Thank-you everyone for giving me advice but I no longer need any because I have the HD600's and they are here to stay for a very long time.
Congrats!!!

Now RUN from this horrid place before you lose your sanity or your money!
post #56 of 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by anadin View Post
Hello all you wonderful people its me the person that started this thread.

I am not going to go into to much detail but I just buckled under the sound of those awful sounding HD650's about 3 hours ago and run for the door and promptly headed for my local Hi-Fi store.

I then handed over another large wad of cash and ran excitedly out of the door with a beautiful pair of HD600's under my arm.

I have them on my head as I type this with about an hour of burn in and already they sound like heaven to me.

The harshness of the highs and that awful veil is nowhere to be heard and that over ridiculous exaggerated bass is now a lovely warm thump that is flowing through my body.

I tried the HD650's and yes people will say I didnt give them anywhere near as long to burn in but I knew from the start that I made a big mistake.

Nearly forgot to say just how much more comfortable the HD600's are on my head.

Thank-you everyone for giving me advice but I no longer need any because I have the HD600's and they are here to stay for a very long time.
A bit harsh don't you think?
post #57 of 58
Hrm...thing is whenever I put on an hd650, with various amps/sources, there were 3 things that struck me.
1. Strong bass
2. sense of treble roll-off, made trumpets sound weird
3. very pronounced midrange, especially upper midrange. Boosted or not - the prominence can get too extreme.
post #58 of 58
I own the Sennheiser triple: 580's, 600's, and the 650's. For a year and a half now, the 650's have functioned as my primary cans, and I consider them to be one of the greatest headphones ever made, but when I first got them that wasn't the case.

Originally I found them harsh and constrained. My WELL used 580's sounded mesmerizing by comparison. I wasn't, and am still not a strong believer in burn-in, because I just don't understand the science behind it. None the less, for whatever reason I decided to stick my HD-650's in a drawer and let them play a sine wave with pink noise for 400 hours straight.

When I took them out, they sounded completely different, they sounded amazing. I immediately preferred them to the 600's.

Placebo? Maybe, but I never listened to them once during that burn-in period, and all the while I was using my 600's, so I have a hard time believing it was "brain adaptation".

I've also found that the 650's are much pickier about what you amp them with, whereas the 580 / 600 are a much "friendlier" phone to work with.


Ultimately the 600's and 650's are two different sets of cans, they do sound different. As one person (like myself) will prefer the 650's, another person (like yourself) will prefer the 600's. Model numbers and cost don't dictate what you should enjoy; I own and have owned cans that cost much more than the 650's, and they just don't do it for me.
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