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D2000, DX1000, Edition 9: A Comparison - Page 3

post #31 of 103
8/24/07 at 1:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cecala View Post
I did state that my impression was solely based upon viewing photos posted here and elsewhere. Obviously ultimate decision is made in the flesh as it were.
I read that, that is why I suggested you to wait till then, I know that probably you will change your mind after...
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post #32 of 103
8/24/07 at 2:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sovkiller View Post
I read that, that is why I suggested you to wait till then, I know that probably you will change your mind after...
I would love to change my mind although here in Melbourne Australia these phones are unavailable to audition or buy. Which might be a good thing since these would cost close to $2000 dollars here and more.
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post #33 of 103
8/24/07 at 11:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cecala View Post
I recently tried the Grado GS-1000 phones and while sonically pleasing, the comfort problem was I thought a disgrace. People here have vaxed lyrical about their comfort. I could not wait to take them off and wanted to throw them at the sales person who said "they were the best headphones in the world"(Guess what, he only sells Grado). I agree with you whole heartedly about paying $1000 for sponges. Even if I could purchase them for half the price I would still refuse-Sorry Grado fans. Comfort should be taken for granted once you pass the $500 dollar mark, not be an option. [...]
My feelings exactly! Once over the $500 mark, my patience level drops precipitously.

There's no picking on Grado here. If they have a good market for what they offer, it's a business decision like any other. It may be a perfectly-run business, for all I know. All I'm saying is, despite all the trumpeting about the presumed sonic quality of their products, and how it's natural for a stoic audiophile to pay $600 for one of their crowns of thorns, they've lost this ex-fan (surely an insignificant loss). I'm happy to have alternatives like this amazing JVC -- for which, to stay on topic, no corners were cut as regards comfort/build quality.

Head-Fi is about giving us such alternatives. The forum is useless to many of us if we hold back, fearing we might get in the way of fanboyhood. Fanboyhood is fun, of course, but it's not why this humble Head-Fier cares about this place. I like to think that I'll bash the JVC mercilessly if it misbehaves. No emotional attachment here, I hope. But I thought I should report that, so far, it's raised the bar in my household -- by my non-expert standards, in my very limited experience.

Now I'm thinking: Is there a place in this post for the guiltiest of my Head-Fi pleasures? Let's face it: We come here for the smilies!
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post #34 of 103
8/24/07 at 11:20am
Comfort, look, built quality are IMO, the easiest three things to achieve in headphones, the most difficult one, is IMO to make a headphone that sounds right, not sure why some manufacturers skim on that, honestly...while they get prodcuts that sound very good...why not do the homework and complete the product with a comfortable one...
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post #35 of 103
8/24/07 at 12:18pm
Surely Grado could find some thicker, softer foam?
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post #36 of 103
8/24/07 at 3:43pm
Isn't it also reasonable to say that "comfort, look, built quality" influences sound as well? The driver enclosure affects sound dramatically, but it also influences the look.
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post #37 of 103
8/24/07 at 4:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazuki View Post
Isn't it also reasonable to say that "comfort, look, built quality" influences sound as well? The driver enclosure affects sound dramatically, but it also influences the look.
Not always, the concept behind comfort and look is sometimes very personal, not sure, for example, if you ask me, what the hell Joe Grado was thinking while he put those horrible pads on the HP series, and later on they keep on going using them, till today.....and even while they look horrible to me, many people like them, and find the comformtable as well....BTW the enclosure is sturdy, nice, tight, do the job, we can not say the construction of the enclosure is bad, but IMO they are nothing pretty, extremelly basic and functional...So in this case, for my taste, comfort and look is ruled out, while they can still sound good...

In other words I can not believe that making a different external shape more appealing, will change that sound...or making a more sturdy headband, worth oif that price tag, not with those wires, will change in any way the sound....
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post #38 of 103
8/24/07 at 10:16pm
Are you sure the boominess you noticed in the bass department is solely due to burn-in?

I have had my Ed9 burn-in (white/pink noise) for over 450 hours now and been listening at different stages and things seem to have settled in by about 100 hours mark.

In particular, now just as much as at 50 hours mark, I can get 2 completely different sound presentations (boomy vs. tight bass, collapsed vs. deep soundstage) by shifting the headset (front to back and somewhat up and down) by no more than a 1cm. I am convinced it has to do with this S-logic design and the partially perforated back plate. Also, some of this effect depends on the clamping pressure applied. The force can be greater or less depending on how tight you keep the headband.

I have relatively small ears so lot's of room to move the headset position. Hence, you might be in a different boat. Still, if you get a chance, try out moving the headphone around and report the changes you hear (and how dramatic they are relative to the changes during burn-in).

BTW, nice review!

Arnaud.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardwired View Post


Ultrasone Edition 9

Break-in: These headphones are a beast to break in and they continue to change during the process, or at least mine did. These are the brief notes I kept during the nearly 500-hour process:
  • New: boomy bass, harsh highs
  • 100 hours: boominess left in midbass, only sometimes shrill, mids confused
  • 150 hours: highs mellowed a lot, midbass boominess barely there, mids still muddled and too forward
  • 200 hours: highs mellowed completely, mids beginning to clear up, midbass boom barely evident
  • 300 hours: good highs, bass boom increasing, still slightly muddy mids still too forward
  • 350 hours: much the same, sell them?
  • 400 hours: bass boom intolerable, can't concentrate on the music for trying to EQ out the boom
  • 450 hours: boom mostly gone, mids cleared up, great treble
I even changed amps during the process, moving from a Corda Opera with its slightly warm mids to a HeadRoom Desktop that is reported to be more neutral. It helped the mids which I felt were too forward but that's when the bass boominess came back and I was scared it was the amp. Not so, as since then the bass has settled down nicely and the HeadRoom amp pushed the mids back just a touch where I wanted them.
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post #39 of 103
8/24/07 at 10:46pm
Sorry but my experience was quite different, I have two pairs, and I have tried them side by side, out of ther same amp, and they took more than 300 hours to settle, it is true that they have a point around 200 hours in which you feel they will not change anymore, but after that they keep on smoothing out...it is by direct comparison, and not by memory...Aslo I do not feel any dramatic change while moving them around,, of course the right position will give you the best sound, but in any case i feel the bass boomy at all, unless you are using a system that sounds boomy...
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post #40 of 103
8/24/07 at 11:06pm
As you know, I am using the same amp (Opera / USB) as the OP and really, I don't believe the Opera is the source of boominess. The OP noticed the same by trying with a different amp. Of course, I am sure the Rudistor you're using is good, but don't assume the Opera can't drive those cans until you hear one!

All I can say is that the bass will tighten up (or maybe just be less prominent) when moving the headphone around.

And as far as smoothing out, yes no question about it I does sound smoother and more "pristine" in the highs than at the beginning. It's been really good for some time so I can't really tell a number like 100, 200, 300? I just had issues with harshness till the 50 hours mark. I am enjoying the music more and more so maybe that's what you refer as smoothing in the 300h + range? ...

Anyhow, other people who have the Ed9, please chime in (unless this is not relevant for this thread? but I think it is...).

Arnaud.

PS: Sovkiller, send me an RPX-100 for free in Japan and I will find out for myself what's so magic about this guy .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sovkiller View Post
Sorry but my experience was quite different, I have two pairs, and I have tried them side by side, out of ther same amp, and they took more than 300 hours to settle, it is true that they have a point around 200 hours in which you feel they will not change anymore, but after that they keep on smoothing out...it is by direct comparison, and not by memory...Aslo I do not feel any dramatic change while moving them around,, of course the right position will give you the best sound, but in any case i feel the bass boomy at all, unless you are using a system that sounds boomy...
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post #41 of 103
8/24/07 at 11:11pm
Personally I think we all hear things differently. That means a few will hear a boominess, a few will hear a leanness, and some will hear perfection. I don't think we all have to enjoy the same things but some believe we do.

I am quite pleased with my UE9.
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post #42 of 103
8/24/07 at 11:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnaud View Post
As you know, I am using the same amp (Opera / USB) as the OP and really, I don't believe the Opera is the source of boominess. The OP noticed the same by trying with a different amp. Of course, I am sure the Rudistor you're using is good, but don't assume the Opera can't drive those cans until you hear one!

All I can say is that the bass will tighten up (or maybe just be less prominent) when moving the headphone around.

And as far as smoothing out, yes no question about it I does sound smoother and more "pristine" in the highs than at the beginning. It's been really good for some time so I can't really tell a number like 100, 200, 300? I just had issues with harshness till the 50 hours mark. I am enjoying the music more and more so maybe that's what you refer as smoothing in the 300h + range? ...

Anyhow, other people who have the Ed9, please chime in (unless this is not relevant for this thread? but I think it is...).

Arnaud.

PS: Sovkiller, send me an RPX-100 for free in Japan and I will find out for myself what's so magic about this guy .
As I have not heard the Opera, I can not comment in its sound, and I will not do it even if I heard it, becasue of some ethics I still have, OK? I was just making a general comment about the Edition 9 behaviour, sorry if you misunderstood my post.

But to me it is true that the Editions are not boomy, unless driven by a bomy source/amp, or playing a boomy material, I have some experience with them, with different amps, in any case I have found them boomy...

Also I'm assuming that the Meier amp is good enough to drive them properly at least, Jan Meier is an excellent professional, and designer, we have no doubt of that, but do not forget also (and I'm not saying that this is the case) that the synergy plays an important role here as well, not only an amp needs to be good, it also needs to match the headphone load. How many good amps we know of, for one particular hepadhone, and for others are just a average, or simply a miss...same as tubes, OPAmps, etc...

PS: About the RPX100, we can sent it for free, of course, we never charge for shipping...just pay the price tag and it will go there... And yes it is magic, trust me on that...
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post #43 of 103
8/25/07 at 2:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sovkiller View Post
PS: About the RPX100, we can sent it for free, of course, we never charge for shipping...just pay the price tag and it will go there... And yes it is magic, trust me on that...
Who are "We", are you selling Rudistors now?
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post #44 of 103
8/25/07 at 2:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew_WOT View Post
Who are "We", are you selling Rudistors now?
Somebody's been out of the loop

A certain designation has been missing from these parts for quite a while, so it's not quite as obvious as perhaps it otherwise would be
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post #45 of 103
8/25/07 at 3:43am
I spent some meaningful time with the ED 9's this weekend...comparing them to the PROline 750's.

I thought the Ed 9's had terrible clamping...unbearable. I understand that I might be able to bend them into (out of) shape and cure the problem, but they were not my pair to mess with like that.

The bass is certainly big in the Ed 9's, but I would call it boomy bass, not clean and tight like the 750's. The Ed 9's, in my opinion, are beautiful works of headphone art, but on sound quality alone I do not believe the price is justified.
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