D2000, DX1000, Edition 9: A Comparison - Page 2

So, Soundinista, are you tempted to be Ultrasoned?

I wonder they compare to Darth Beyers? Anybody?

I can attest to this as well. The Edition 9's bass is strong all the way down to as deep as I've come across in a recording. It's also much tighter and punchier than the DX1000's bass. The DX1000 sounded muffled to me. It lacked the kick of the Edition 9.

I actually MEASURED the bass response of Darth Beyers and the DX1000 using the Stereophile test CD and my RS SPL meter. The Darth Beyers don't go much below 35 Hz or so, although they are very strong down to that point. The JVC's measure very strong down to 20Hz, which I thought was very impressive, although right in line with what I expected.

You absolutely cannot tell how deep headphones go by playing music, because there is incredibly little music content below 40 Hz. You really have to measure to know. It could be the Edition 9's have more bass down to 35 Hz, with an excellent quality to it, but do not actually reach as low as the JVC. I am not saying this IS the case, but rather that without actually measuring it, we won't know.

Great point Rob. Even if a headphone can reproduce 20Hz., it's not very often that you'll find any information on a CD in that frequency range. The cannons in the 1812 Overture possibly or Pipe Organ music. Most likely most of us are going to feel that more than hear it at any rate, and headphones can't move that kind of air.

You know, Cecala, as a matter of principle, I'm always tempted by anything that gets the nod from level-headed, knowledgeable, ultra-demanding audiophiles like Hardwired and a number of others here at Head-Fi. Sometimes, however, the inconvenience seems simply overwhelming to me. (Haven't yet gone down the tubes, for instance. The thought of babysitting those valves is more than I can bear. The combination of hypnotic glow and enthusiastic reviews alone won't drag me into it as long as there is affordable solid state gear offering comparable performance. But I haven't had the opportunity to listen to good tubed equipment. So, conversion is not ruled out. I'm just firmly skeptical for now.) For me, in headphone terms, "inconvenience" means low build quality and/or comfort level. For what they offer in that regard, they've priced the Edn. 9 beyond temptation for me. I haven't had the chance to put them on my head yet. But reliable reviewers assure me that the Ultrasone's are no match for what I already have as far as build quality/comfort. So, I very much doubt I'd be happy with such a huge investment.

That's the reason why I've also steered clear of the Grado GS-1000. These were much more tempting to me than the Edn. 9, because of the promise of comfort and a huge soundstage. But there is a serious build quality issue here as well. The thought of shelling out a grand for sponges and for those annoying rods was ultimately more than I could bear.

Speaking of Grado, I'm happy to see that they are beginning to address their comfort issues. I've always thought that the Grado people were geniuses for getting away with such low build quality/comfort standards. But the truth is, they've had a lot of help from the hi-fi press. Five short years ago, Robert Reina, a reviewer whom I respect, btw, gave the Grado SR125 a glowing review in Stereophile. Believe it or not, he wrote that the SR125 were the most comfortable phones he had ever used. I had the SR125 for nine long years. They always felt like torture instruments on my head! And I certainly don't mean to imply that Reina was insincere. It's just that the standards of the audio press for headphones have been so low that the claim didn't seem at all absurd to either Reina or the Stereophile editor, John Atkinson. Another example: Hi-Fi Choice calls the GS-1000 the greatest headphones under the sun (or words to that effect). Have they bothered comparing it to the likes of the JVC DX1000 and the Edn. 9? Their "Buyer's Bible" doesn't even acknowledge the existence of these phones!

Things have changed, as we know. Head-Fi is putting this industry under the microscope and keeping it on its toes. Reviews like the one that started this thread will do us all a lot of good. Keep at it, guys!

Is there a consensus on the comfort/dis-comfort of the Edition 9s? If they're comfortable, how comfortable? Beyer comfortable? 650 comfortable? SR-325 comfortable? Crown of thorns comfortable? And if they're uncomfortable then how and how extremely?

I'm with those above who take comfort to be a serious concern in a 1200 - 1500.00 headphone. But I'd like to hear from more Ed 9 owners about their experiences with long-term comfort (or not!) on these phones. I'm happy to make this a new thread rather than sidetrack this one.

And a GREAT review, Hardwired! I really feel like I know more about the phones under review, their strengths and compromises, after reading it. Kudos!

best,

o

The Edition 9 headband pressure can be relieved is you bend the headband with strength holding it in the center, and not by the plastic sides the steel blade will eventually give up a little bit...about the pads we have a mod but it will or not work depending on the ears, for me it worked wonders...the is my only beef with the Ultrasones, they still should work in the comfort issues a little more...to make it... (perfect?... )

The Ultrasone can go as low as 20Hz, and lower with authority, I have a CD here with test tones, and you can hear it...actually that is true that they is a little material below 40HZ, but what noobdy says I that there are harmonics that you feel from other closer freqs, and if the driver cuts them out you will feel it...

Pipe organs with 32' pipes can go below 20hz. The best I've heard for sub 20 hz sound might surprise some folks. (haven't yet heard the Ed9's)

This is not "bass slam" or bass loudness, but real useable bass depth. Here they are in order from best to worst. There may be others, but these are the ones I know well:

HD280 The absolute clearest lowest bass I've heard, even though these are not known at all for bass.
AD2000 Runner up
D2000 Darned good as well, nearly tied with AD2000
DX1000 Pretty good, but not as great as they are often made out to be
DT880 Goes very deep but soft down there
AD700 Same as DT880
K701 Same as DT880

The old Stax SR-5 go pretty deep as well, but only with serious EQing. The HD650, HD600 & K601 really don't go this deep at all, and the HD555 and K501 don't even register at all much below 40 hz.

I recently tried the Grado GS-1000 phones and while sonically pleasing, the comfort problem was I thought a disgrace. People here have vaxed lyrical about their comfort. I could not wait to take them off and wanted to throw them at the sales person who said "they were the best headphones in the world"(Guess what, he only sells Grado). I agree with you whole heartedly about paying $1000 for sponges. Even if I could purchase them for half the price I would still refuse-Sorry Grado fans. Comfort should be taken for granted once you pass the $500 dollar mark, not be an option. The edition 9s to me in photos look somewhat cheap, sure the pads and driver housing look wonderful and high grade but the headband looks like Lego made it and for 1500 dollars, is asking for far to much. Even if the sound coming from the Ultrasones is mind bending, whats the point if you need to take them off after a mere 10 mins.(Maybe that's the point, to much of a good thing might hurt you).


By the way I have posted this image elsewhere, its a cut shot of the JVC driver housing.

The comfort is not an issue for everybody with the Ultrasones, for me it is not right now...
Also they do not look cheap at all, once you own them, and you have them in your hands, they are heavy, and once you use them for a while you realized that they are not alike to other cheap solutions you find around, even while they look quite similar, the material use is different quality...

I suggest that you reserve the last verdict for the Ultrasones till you try them, ans listen them, and use them in your head...

The same happen to me with the Grados, to me they are unbearable, for others they can use them for hours...all depends on what you like, I will not consider never any supraural headphone, as the headphone touching my ears bother me, the main reason I do not use too much the Portapros...

I did state that my impression was solely based upon viewing photos posted here and elsewhere. Obviously ultimate decision is made in the flesh as it were.