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HD650 uses HD580 drivers?? - Page 31

post #451 of 502
So Chris are you keeping your HD6580s?
post #452 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by greggf View Post
You may not want to live in this world of images, marketing b.s., public relations, and "stories," but you do, and you can't extricate yourself.
The concept of personal responsibility may be nearly dead, but I can assure you that it is not completely dead. I certainly do see huge sense of entitlement in this thread, though.
post #453 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by zkn View Post
So Chris are you keeping your HD6580s?
HA! HD6580. That's hilarious!

<edit> and I bet he is going to keep them ... 'cause they're good sounding headphones.
post #454 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by zkn View Post
So Chris are you keeping your HD6580s?
And I'll tell you another funny one:

In my little email conversation, one of the VP's said that he was sure there was no quality problem, but if it turned out that thy decided to change the labeling, then some headphile mythology would arise that claimed the 6580 were the best sounding ones. And that there may be a brisk 2nd hand market for mislabled 650s.

I thought that was pretty funny. The truth is that these guys do know who you are and are truying to understand the value of this hobby, and whether they see a need or an opportunity to do something there.

What I think is that you guys need to figure out how to maximize your value to them. As you do, they will pander to you and send loaners to meets and support the annual headphone festival. If you guys think you're valuable, then it's worth thinking about that value and how to exploit it.

post #455 of 502
If we [Head-Fi] might possibly represent a possible 10% of HD650 headphone sales, then i think Sennheiser should take an interest in having at least one person on this forum to represent them and answer questions from us and take care of customer service issues.

Look what personal involvement does to sales.
How many people call some of the company owners and amp builders by first name and everyone knows who they are?
And when they meet them,they practically want an autograph and would probably treasure a Pizza Box signed by John Grado, or an amp signed by Ray Samuels, etc.

Most of us know who we mean by ...
Tyll
Ray
Justin
Xin
Gary
Larry
Vinny
Jan
Myo
Jack
Chu or Cmoy
Tangeant
Todd


And also many other names on here. Most only require first names like Cher, Liz, Barbara, etc.
And they become very familiar to everyone because of their participation and customer service to this forum to the point that everyone is very sad to see them leave the business, like with Gary and Electric Avenues.

How many people would by a headphone just because Kramer modded it? Or an amp just because SkyLab approved it? And theyre not even in business,but at this point theyre well known enough to start one here and people would buy their stuff.


I think if there were a popular Sennheiser rep here to feed us on new things comming out etc., that people would be even more into being Sennheiser FanBoys.....Just like with Grado.
It makes it more personal,which is something big companies lack.

If someone was able to get through to Sennheiser for an answer much earlier, this wouldnt have excalated to the amount it has.
Actually someone did get through,and the rep gave a flippant answer.
He could have said " Well im not sure of an answer right now,but please be patient and i will ask someone that may know. It may take some time as i am also busy,but ill get an answer."

That would have been all it would take to calm things some, just knowing someone from the company was in our corner and gave us just a touch of respect on an issue that for the purchasers of the HD5860 was an important and sensitive issue for them.

Im glad there was finally an answer though, but really if it wasnt for Tyll, we would still be at it.
But because of this personal relationship with the owners and builders in these companies,we trust them more and buy their products even before hearing them at all.

The Pico must be good.....Justin said its his best creation yet!
The D1 has to be good....
The Move will be awesome,put me in for one! We all know Jan!
Yeah ill wait 2 years for a XIN...

Etc.
post #456 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drag0n View Post

Most of us know who we mean by ...
Tyll
Ray
Justin
Xin
Gary
Larry
Vinny
Jan
Myo
Jack
Chu or Cmoy
Tangeant
I'd add Todd.

You're right ... assuming there is something in it for them. Tell me, exactly what's in it for Sennheiser? While the 650 may be their most expensive headphone, it's not where they make thier money. Head-Fi may influence a lot of HD650 sales, but does it really effect CX300 sales? We might buy 10% of their 650s, but we probably make up 0.01% of PX100 sales. And those customers aren't doing a lot of on-line research when choosing those cans. Tell me how Head-Fi can significantly alter CX300 or PX100 sales? If you can answer that one, then you'll get some interest.
post #457 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyll Hertsens View Post
I'd add Todd.

You're right ... assuming there is something in it for them. Tell me, exactly what's in it for Sennheiser? While the 650 may be their most expensive headphone, it's not where they make thier money. Head-Fi may influence a lot of HD650 sales, but does it really effect CX300 sales? We might buy 10% of their 650s, but we probably make up 0.01% of PX100 sales. And those customers aren't doing a lot of on-line research when choosing those cans. Tell me how Head-Fi can significantly alter CX300 or PX100 sales? If you can answer that one, then you'll get some interest.
Tyll here's how, it may or may not be significant. Just like when people want to leap into the deep end they may ask about 650s ve 701 vs RS1 when people see my headphone set up and hear it they want to ask about ipod upgrades. That is where the px100 cx300 come in. Most people taht ask my opinion are not in the market for the $500+ can but are in it for the DAP upgrade. My guess this is more true for the college headfi market at they have a greater group of people that actively use devices that benefit from the lower tier of their offerings. In business a 3-5% growth rate in a product above the target is sweet I beleive we could and do offer that swing vote.
post #458 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyll Hertsens View Post
I'd add Todd.

You're right ... assuming there is something in it for them. Tell me, exactly what's in it for Sennheiser? While the 650 may be their most expensive headphone, it's not where they make thier money. Head-Fi may influence a lot of HD650 sales, but does it really effect CX300 sales? We might buy 10% of their 650s, but we probably make up 0.01% of PX100 sales. And those customers aren't doing a lot of on-line research when choosing those cans. Tell me how Head-Fi can significantly alter CX300 or PX100 sales? If you can answer that one, then you'll get some interest.

Todd added...lol.

And i cant spell the other guys name...ummm.. mikeil,mickeil,umm..omg,........anyway,i did say there were others,i cant remember everyone spurr of the moment And alot of us use PX100/PMX100 i have that and also PMX200. So i think many of us have those also. We have all different Senns, not just the 650's etc.
post #459 of 502
Seriously, what I REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY don't effing understand is how it takes 23 pages for people to realize what's going on even though post #8 already explained everything. . .
post #460 of 502
That wasn't what we were talking about. Everybody knows they changed the dampening material.
post #461 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drag0n View Post
If we [Head-Fi] might possibly represent a possible 10% of HD650 headphone sales, then i think Sennheiser should take an interest in having at least one person on this forum to represent them and answer questions from us and take care of customer service issues.

Look what personal involvement does to sales.
How many people call some of the company owners and amp builders by first name and everyone knows who they are?
And when they meet them,they practically want an autograph and would probably treasure a Pizza Box signed by John Grado, or an amp signed by Ray Samuels, etc.

Most of us know who we mean by ...
Tyll
Ray
Justin
Xin
Gary
Larry
Vinny
Jan
Myo
Jack
Chu or Cmoy
Tangeant
Todd


And also many other names on here. Most only require first names like Cher, Liz, Barbara, etc.
And they become very familiar to everyone because of their participation and customer service to this forum to the point that everyone is very sad to see them leave the business, like with Gary and Electric Avenues.

How many people would by a headphone just because Kramer modded it? Or an amp just because SkyLab approved it? And theyre not even in business,but at this point theyre well known enough to start one here and people would buy their stuff.


I think if there were a popular Sennheiser rep here to feed us on new things comming out etc., that people would be even more into being Sennheiser FanBoys.....Just like with Grado.
It makes it more personal,which is something big companies lack.

If someone was able to get through to Sennheiser for an answer much earlier, this wouldnt have excalated to the amount it has.
Actually someone did get through,and the rep gave a flippant answer.
He could have said " Well im not sure of an answer right now,but please be patient and i will ask someone that may know. It may take some time as i am also busy,but ill get an answer."

That would have been all it would take to calm things some, just knowing someone from the company was in our corner and gave us just a touch of respect on an issue that for the purchasers of the HD5860 was an important and sensitive issue for them.

Im glad there was finally an answer though, but really if it wasnt for Tyll, we would still be at it.
But because of this personal relationship with the owners and builders in these companies,we trust them more and buy their products even before hearing them at all.

The Pico must be good.....Justin said its his best creation yet!
The D1 has to be good....
The Move will be awesome,put me in for one! We all know Jan!
Yeah ill wait 2 years for a XIN...

Etc.
This is classic delusions of headfi grandeur. Just because you participate in an online forum doesn't mean it has earth shaking importance.
post #462 of 502
Uh... wow do we really make up for 10% of 650 sales? I am very surprised, do you have a source on that?
post #463 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assorted View Post
Uh... wow do we really make up for 10% of 650 sales? I am very surprised, do you have a source on that?
I said "if".................and Tyll said he figures it could possibly be around 10% of 650 sales,but it was a guestimate, not an official number. He said how he figured out his guess.
post #464 of 502
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyll Hertsens View Post
Hmm. I'd guess there's about 3000 650s sold in the US annually. And, I'd guess that Head-Fi members might buy 1/day. So, Head-Fi might be about 10% of the market for 650s. These guesses have some pretty big error bars, so 5% - 20% is probably possible. It also depends a bit about when you san an order "came" from Head-Fi. Does it mean a registered member? Or does it mean the person has been to Head-Fi and might remember it by name?

The more important expression of Head-Fi's power is how influential the general opinion here is. While only 5% of 650 purchasers might be Head-Fi members, how many purchasers of 650s got their advice to buy from someone who is informed by the opinion on Head-Fi? Once your friends know you're a headphone geek, you get a lot of people asking you for advice. Also, writers lurk here for information, or PM folks they know for advice. Then the writers sort of "parrot" the opinion from Head-Fi. If you add that, I wouldn't feel too uncomfortable saying maybe half the 650s sold have had some Head-Fi influence in the purchase. The question is whether or not that's really true. I believe it, but I'll bet Sennheiser, AKG, and for sure Sony probably don't. And I certainly might be deluded and quite subjectively bent on this point.
Advice at head-fi is seen as "independant" since most don't trust advice of a sales rep. that will try to sell the most expensive stuff anyway. A good local store won't but that is just the general idea.

I know for sure, head-fi has a big influence...headphones ain't big business where i come from (speaker sales are much bigger), so are seen generally as a niche market and the knowledge is accordingly. So, if you wanna know anything about headphones, you gotta go here.

On a worldwide bases, i think alot of people get their reference headphone through head-fi by asking, reading reviews or just get the headphone noted when they read about it on the forum.

Head-fi stimulates people in a healthy way.

I wouldn't ignore the influence of head-fi worldwide. It is THE biggest central for headphones.

Most headphone amps, cables and other stuff are sold because people read about them on head-fi And in general get "honest" advice from people that have hands on experience.

Where did i read first about the new to come sennheiser headphone, right, on head-fi! And it still keeps me into his grasp untill the new product is actually released and can read first hand reviews of it. If a head-fi review IS possitive, then you cannot ignore that alot of people will base their judgement on that review and get one themselfs.

In short, i think tyll is correct that alot of people worldwide get influenced on head-fi in a possitive way.
post #465 of 502
Smallened for you.

Pretty conclusive, anyone going to pull the trigger on some cans w/ the net is pretty likely to google 'headphone'.

It is photoshopped, Head-fi was below Headphonic[off the page] but on Page 1.

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