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Decibels, distortion, amplifiers and golden ears - Page 6  

post #76 of 790
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure View Post
Well, that link contains many more results of the test than the current thread, so I'm not sure why you wouldn't have wanted to see the results there first instead of relying entirely on the new one for your thread.
As I said, I intend to look at it. It will probably be tomorrow when I'm not so tired, it's almost 1:30 here and just about time for some shuteye. Us old folks need our rest.

I hope that will be enough to satisfy you.
post #77 of 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVinylRipper View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by eightbitpotion
So you agree that one buys an amp based on what sounds best to them.
Actually I buy everything used, often from that auction site that may not be named.
Uh, this really didn't make any sense to me...but on top of that... you added a WHOLE lot more that kind of confused me .

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVinylRipper View Post
My speakers came from the flea market, Infinity three way's with a 3" dome midrange and a dome tweeter. I know what to listen for and stuck my ear up to each driver to make sure it wasn't broken somehow. The other vendors were complaining but the dude selling the speakers told them to can it because he could tell I was going to buy them if they passed my tests.

My amp came from a pawn shop, I hooked it up to the best speakers they had in there and turned it up to listen for problems, it came with a thirty day money back warranty. I had dealt with them before so I wasn't worried.

Searching for bargains is a form of entertainment for me. I bought a Mitsubishi linear tracking turntable on the auction site that may not be named for $160 shipped. I had taken the photo into photoshop and enlarged and enhanced it to see the cartridge, it was a B&O MMC 3. I sold the cartridge for $210, they retail for $600 and are unavailable now.

I bought a Yamaha four track cassette portastudio for $10 at the flea market, tried to sell it on a local BBS before the internet, didn't sell it but ended up becoming an amateur sound engineer for several local groups. Didn't make any money but I had a lot of fun and learned a lot.

And so on and so on..
I know you probably spent a few minutes typing that...but why? I simply do not understand. x_x Sorry.
post #78 of 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVinylRipper View Post
As I said, I intend to look at it. It will probably be tomorrow when I'm not so tired, it's almost 1:30 here and just about time for some shuteye. Us old folks need our rest.

I hope that will be enough to satisfy you.
It just doesn't make sense to me. You see a thread with a test on distortion, you're intrigued with the results that the few people that did post obtained, you're informed that there's an older thread more than four times as long with tons of more results than the current thread, but you decide you'll take a look at the more extensive thread later in your leisure so you can post your assertions based on just a few samples of an already flawed test right away. Meh.

I don't have much to say on this whole discussion of discerning differences between amplifiers with different distortion levels. I'm actually more on the skeptic side with you than with most Head-Fiers (have you seen my "Second Biggest Disappoint Ever" thread?) Anyway, now I don't mind paying for placebo, as long as that placebo will work. I pay for the sound that I perceive, not for the science & technology that produces the sound.
post #79 of 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVinylRipper View Post
If you look at my sig you will see that I have a quote which says:

"The first principle is not to fool yourself, and you are the easiest one to fool".

I grew up a rather hardscrabble life, we never actually went hungry but we didn't have much. I put my first bicycle together out of parts I scrounged. A frame here, front wheel there, rear wheel somewhere else and the chain from yet another place.

One thing I know, the wolf is never far from the door.

One illness, one accident, a car crash, a slip in the bathtub and your entire life can come crashing down.

Right now, my wife and I are in so much debt from medical bills that we will never get out, no matter how long we live. We didn't see it coming, we had insurance. But the insurance company used the fine print to weasel out of most of the bill and we were left holding the bag.

And the recent changes in the bankruptcy law has made it impossible to declare bankruptcy.

In the short time I've been here I've already seen at least two people forced to sell their treasured gear due to financial disaster.
May I ask something. If you're so much in debt, what are you doing here? Head-fi is a community where we discuss about things that aren't essential. This is a place for people with enough money and time, a balance of lifestyle.

I don't know your situation, but I grew up in a business family and my dad never had time to do anything. Our family sacrificed lots to survive in society. I am sorry that you have faced medical issues, and perhaps you are not able to work anymore, but it seems like you're trying to stress yourself even more so by bringing up endless arguments. That's not what people in debt do- correction, that's not that they should be doing.
post #80 of 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVinylRipper View Post

It is best not to spend too much on essentially frivolous things like hobbies.
This comment is just disrespectful and quite frankly, quite socialist sounding. Do you advocate that everyone should eat the same food and wear the same clothes since one can logically determine the perfect food intake and materials for environmental protection? You are free to speak your mind here but I am happy to have the freedom to make purchasing decisions without your approval and according to what meets my personal desires. I work hard to enjoy my toys.

I read and participate here because I want to learn from the experiences of others and do the same for other participants. This is a community of humans with experience unlike my own and I am not so egotistical to think my opinion/experiences are more authentic/true than my head-fi friends with the same equipment. If I wanted a non-human-biased reason for deciding which equipment to purchase, I would be no better than a machine. I vote human.
post #81 of 790
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure View Post
It just doesn't make sense to me. You see a thread with a test on distortion, you're intrigued with the results that the few people that did post obtained, you're informed that there's an older thread more than four times as long with tons of more results than the current thread, but you decide you'll take a look at the more extensive thread later in your leisure so you can post your assertions based on just a few samples of an already flawed test right away. Meh.
I'm not so sure that the test is as flawed as some are making out to be. I read the rest of the site and there is a fairly good explanation of the protocol used. I have a pretty decent BS detector and didn't see anything that really triggered it.

As for your earlier link, I was pretty involved in discussion at the time and forgot about it until you posted upthread. I'm still kind of busy so I'll get back to it in the morning. I do thank you for reminding me about the other thread.

Quote:
I don't have much to say on this whole discussion of discerning differences between amplifiers with different distortion levels. I'm actually more on the skeptic side with you than with most Head-Fiers (have you seen my "Second Biggest Disappoint Ever" thread?) Anyway, now I don't mind paying for placebo, as long as that placebo will work. I pay for the sound that I perceive, not for the science & technology that produces the sound.
I'm not averse to spending money when I get a tangible benefit with a price/performance ratio within reason. The law of diminishing returns steps in pretty early these days in audio, particularly if you buy used/refurb/overstock whatever.

I just went and looked at the Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 THX system and was shocked at how cheap it is. My brother has that setup and to my ears it sounds very good indeed. It seems to be well thought of here too.

I think a lot of refurb stuff comes back because people didn't know how to use it properly or even at all, particularly with computer related items.
post #82 of 790
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assorted View Post
May I ask something. If you're so much in debt, what are you doing here? Head-fi is a community where we discuss about things that aren't essential. This is a place for people with enough money and time, a balance of lifestyle.
I don't mind at all.

Once you get to the point where you know you will never be able to pay it off, debt becomes something you just live with. If you worry about it all the time all you are going to do is kill yourself with stress.

Note that I said not to spend *too* much on hobbies, not nothing. I watch what my brother in law spends on golf and it is far more than I spend on audio. He has been living on borrowed money almost five years now and has at least two more to go before he finishes his clinicals and residency to become a doctor at 44 years of age. He has been borrowing money from our mother in law for at least three years and will be for another two. Every member of his family has a laptop and he has three of them. I have two computers, one of which I put together from parts and the other that insurance bought six years ago when our house was hit by lightning.

I come here for entertainment and relaxation. I enjoy discussing technical things and know quite a bit about them from a lifetime of doing tech type work among other things.

Quote:
I don't know your situation, but I grew up in a business family and my dad never had time to do anything. Our family sacrificed lots to survive in society. I am sorry that you have faced medical issues, and perhaps you are not able to work anymore, but it seems like you're trying to stress yourself even more so by bringing up endless arguments. That's not what people in debt do- correction, that's not that they should be doing.
I don't find this stressful at all, I find it entertaining. To an extent I distract myself from my own problems. I don't sleep much and I don't watch TV or movies basically at all. I have no one in my life who is at all interested in the things that interest me and my only outlet for my curiosity is the internet. Otherwise I will be limited to talking about shoes, clothes, NASCAR, the weather and other mundane things which bore me to tears.

Most workaholics are workaholics because they are more comfortable at work than at home. A lot of people live to work and some of us work to live. Our home is modest and the mortgage is considerably less than renting an apartment in our area. My son in law inherited a very valuable commercial property and is basically going to pay off the little that we owe on our home when it sells sometime in the next couple of years. We have done a lot for him and his family over the years now and I don't feel guilty about accepting a gift from him which he freely offered to give. He is going to buy his mother, his grandmother, his brother and his uncle homes and cars and we just got included automatically.
post #83 of 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVinylRipper View Post
But here goes, you never know when disaster is going to strike, it is impossible to predict the future.

It is best not to spend too much on essentially frivolous things like hobbies.
I agree with you to an extent. In Canada, we are more healthy than our unfortunate southerly friends. I feel grateful everyday that my family hasn't faced any enormous health difficulties yet. Or any accidents. One of my family member has had complications, with frequent thousand dollar needle shots, but nothing that's burdening.

Quite frankly I'm very lucky, I get to share the little wealth earned from years by my family, ride in a 750i everyday, crank up the heat to 25C in the winter, grand watches and cars for birthdays. From your perspective this might be very crippling, life's not fair, why am I getting along life so easily. But look at it from my family's point of view. My father's family immigrated to Canada two decades ago, naturally without any money, since the purpose of immigration was to improve quality life and contribute to society. Employment was plentiful. Dish-washing, paper, the large sum of the service industry. He could have taken an easy job of being the bus boy, or serve as a waiter. But he took the job of management -- this might sound all high and mighty, but managing is the dirtiest job in the service industry. Unlike those trades people with salaries and labor unions to save their behinds, managers have to wake up early to make appointments, fix appliances, clean out garbage, make important decisions and being liable for it, and many more. Finally, he comes home past midnight everyday and sleep on the couch. No time for drinking or socializing, and only occasional relaxing time. Eventually this became routine, and our family was able to buy out the business and maintain it. He could have easily taken out a student loan to take a degree of higher education and never have to worry about business-level responsibility.

So did my family (technically my two parents) earn the extra wealth? Certainly, moreso than other families who sit around and let the government money chime in, or who aren't willing to sacrifice anything to get the most out of what little they worked for through means of corrupt labor unions, unfair taxation, the irrational system of the narrow minded "special interest groups", and extremely overweight people on disability.
post #84 of 790
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmk005 View Post
This comment is just disrespectful and quite frankly, quite socialist sounding. Do you advocate that everyone should eat the same food and wear the same clothes since one can logically determine the perfect food intake and materials for environmental protection? You are free to speak your mind here but I am happy to have the freedom to make purchasing decisions without your approval and according to what meets my personal desires. I work hard to enjoy my toys.
Why is my opinion any more disrespectful than anyone else's? I have been directly insulted both on this thread and on others and have never replied in kind.

I'm not quite sure how advocating getting the most for your money is socialist, perhaps you could explain further.

For your information I am a libertarian leftist, I will leave it at that since I have been cautioned not to discuss politics on this board.

Quote:
I read and participate here because I want to learn from the experiences of others and do the same for other participants. This is a community of humans with experience unlike my own and I am not so egotistical to think my opinion/experiences are more authentic/true than my head-fi friends with the same equipment. If I wanted a non-human-biased reason for deciding which equipment to purchase, I would be no better than a machine. I vote human.
Are you suggesting that I am a Turing machine?

If you stab me, do I not leak electrons?

Just because my opinion differs from the majority, should I then just shut up?

Frankly that sounds more socialist to me than what I advocate.
post #85 of 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVinylRipper View Post
Most workaholics are workaholics because they are more comfortable at work than at home.
I realize you are probably much older than me. It wouldn't be right to discuss life lessons with you, however with 100% confidence I will tell you that that is an excuse that people don't work as hard.

I don't feel comfortable working at a hot kitchen doing the same things over and over again. But I do it in excess of what other kids my age going to the mall work, all for the reason of going to post-secondary education without the anticipation of future burdens. If somebody tells me that I'm lucky to have such personality and that they're not able because they were not born with such strengths, I will laugh at them. Those guys fail at life, and they blame everything on the government.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVinylRipper View Post
My son in law inherited a very valuable commercial property and is basically going to pay off the little that we owe on our home when it sells sometime in the next couple of years. We have done a lot for him and his family over the years now and I don't feel guilty about accepting a gift from him which he freely offered to give. He is going to buy his mother, his grandmother, his brother and his uncle homes and cars and we just got included automatically.
That seems like very good news. I genuinely hope your life will improve.
post #86 of 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVinylRipper View Post
For your information I am a libertarian leftist, I will leave it at that since I have been cautioned not to discuss politics on this board.
I know I'm not following forum etiquette, but I can direct you to forum more suited to your needs. Here's a thread in the forums that should get you started for you... "entertainment" needs.
post #87 of 790
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assorted View Post
I agree with you to an extent. In Canada, we are more healthy than our unfortunate southerly friends. I feel grateful everyday that my family hasn't faced any enormous health difficulties yet. Or any accidents. One of my family member has had complications, with frequent thousand dollar needle shots, but nothing that's burdening.
I'm sorry to hear of your relative's problems.

Quote:
Quite frankly I'm very lucky, I get to share the little wealth earned from years by my family, ride in a 750i everyday, crank up the heat to 25C in the winter, grand watches and cars for birthdays. From your perspective this might be very crippling, life's not fair, why am I getting along life so easily.
"I thought I had a poor lot in life because I had no shoes, then I met a man who had no feet."

Of course life is unfair, some are born with horrible birth defects, or something like progeria where they die of old age at eighteen. Others are born beautiful and perfect. Crap happens.

On the whole I've had a good life. I have a great family, I've enjoyed good health for the majority of my life despite abusing my body quite a bit when I was younger. I don't really have any complaints about how I have lived.

Quote:
But look at it from my family's point of view. My father's family immigrated to Canada two decades ago, naturally without any money, since the purpose of immigration was to improve quality life and contribute to society. Employment was plentiful. Dish-washing, paper, the large sum of the service industry. He could have taken an easy job of being the bus boy, or serve as a waiter. But he took the job of management -- this might sound all high and mighty, but managing is the dirtiest job in the service industry. Unlike those trades people with salaries and labor unions to save their behinds, managers have to wake up early to make appointments, fix appliances, clean out garbage, make important decisions and being liable for it, and many more. Finally, he comes home past midnight everyday and sleep on the couch. No time for drinking or socializing, and only occasional relaxing time. Eventually this became routine, and our family was able to buy out the business and maintain it. He could have easily taken out a student loan to take a degree of higher education and never have to worry about business-level responsibility.
My wife is a manager also, although she does not have to do some of the nastier things you mention. She leads by example and is basically the "fixer" for the corporation she works for. If there is a store that is doing badly, she goes in, gets rid of the unproductive workers, hires and trains a decent crew, straightens out the messy store and then goes to the next one and does it all over again.

Meanwhile the store she just fixed gets handed to another incompetent manager (good help is almost as hard to find as a good job) and then a couple of years later she goes back and straightens it out again.

Quote:
So did my family (technically my two parents) earn the extra wealth? Certainly, moreso than other families who sit around and let the government money chime in, or who aren't willing to sacrifice anything to get the most out of what little they worked for through means of corrupt labor unions, unfair taxation, the irrational system of the narrow minded "special interest groups", and extremely overweight people on disability.
From what you relate it seems that your parents did indeed earn what they have.

There are basically two ways of getting through life. One way is to work your butt off and have very little life but a lot of material possessions.

The other way is to forgo many of the material things and have more of a life.

When our daughter was growing up, both my wife and I basically devoted more time to her than to furthering our careers. It certainly paid off for our daughter, she is now a stay at home mom with three children and a husband who loves her. Some of her friends with more "successful" parents have done far worse in life.

First point, you don't see no hearses with luggage racks.

Second point, there are few people who, on their deathbed, say "you know I really wish I had spent more time at the office."

Life is short and the older you get the faster time seems to go by.
post #88 of 790
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assorted View Post
I know I'm not following forum etiquette, but I can direct you to forum more suited to your needs. Here's a thread in the forums that should get you started for you... "entertainment" needs.
My entertainment is just that, mine.
post #89 of 790
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assorted View Post
I realize you are probably much older than me. It wouldn't be right to discuss life lessons with you, however with 100% confidence I will tell you that that is an excuse that people don't work as hard.
I was a Marine at 19, I do know something of expending effort.

Quote:
I don't feel comfortable working at a hot kitchen doing the same things over and over again. But I do it in excess of what other kids my age going to the mall work, all for the reason of going to post-secondary education without the anticipation of future burdens. If somebody tells me that I'm lucky to have such personality and that they're not able because they were not born with such strengths, I will laugh at them. Those guys fail at life, and they blame everything on the government.
"Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans" - John Lennon.





That seems like very good news. I genuinely hope your life will improve.[/QUOTE]
post #90 of 790
Thread Starter 
I forgot to mention, I have a black belt in thread drift.
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