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New Xin Reference Amp by Dr. Xin !!! - Page 29

post #421 of 559
jamato8,on your portable amp ratings(signature),you rated both the Xin Reference and Xin Supermicro as 1st and not 1st and 2nd.
Is it due to how the amp fare for different genres or how each amp fare for different sort of headphones/earphones?
post #422 of 559
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamato8 View Post
I would like to add that on my visit with Xin and comparing sounds from different amps, I realized he has very good hearing. This might or might not be assumed but he could almost instantly hear things I had to listen for and could hear details on the recording, such as background noise from the recording that I had not so easily noticed and some of these I have heard over 100 times. With such hearing no wonder he keeps driving for something better and better.
I hope he survives this compulsive nature! Any ideals as to when he will be able to release the Reference into the wind?
post #423 of 559
The Micro is a very special amplifier. The size means nothing except to put an exclamation point on the fact that this great sounding amp is so small. To me there is a difference in bass presentation and high frequencies in the Reference but the Micro has qualities that to me, do not hold it back from being one of the finest portables, and better than some home amps, I have heard. I might give the Reference a + with regards to the highs and bass but this is all in my perception and frankly there is nothing lacking in the Micro. I find that the Reference and the Micro can drive IEM's and headphones with aplomb.

The Reference design is still in motion but it also takes over 400 hours to hear the total sound of the Reference due to the large cap but I have not found this to be true of the Micro.
post #424 of 559
""I hope he survives this compulsive nature! Any ideals as to when he will be able to release the Reference into the wind?""

I have heard 5 different versions. They all have the same nature but slightly different signature. The cap is the problem as you really need to let the amp burn in for 400 hours plus to know the final sound. Having said this I have noticed over the years that the sound you first hear within 10 to 20 minutes of a new design is the nature of the amp. It is after this time period that the forming starts and the sound often goes down hill and starts it climb back up, if it was good to begin with.

I do not know the time frame I do know that Xin would like to get this done sooner than later but he really wants this to be a final version with no need to revise or change.
post #425 of 559
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamato8 View Post
... I do not know the time frame I do know that Xin would like to get this done sooner than later but he really wants this to be a final version with no need to revise or change.
As eager as I am to get my hands and ears on one to hear the things that the few of you with prototypes have been hearing, I'm totally willing to wait patiently for the various prototype versions to come into their full, stable sound, for the sonic comparisons to be completed, and the final design decisions to be made. (Again, many thanks to those of you with prototypes who are so generously making your observations available to us.) My time expectation, based on Dr. Xin's post on his own forum for the Reference, is that he does not want to fill many orders for this as a finalized product until July, which even gives time for the "final" version (perhaps incorporating features from a few of the prototype versions) to come into its stable sound to be sure that it produces the "purest sound possible" that Dr. Xin is offering this amp for. With the discerning ears and passion for sound that jamato8 has observed in Dr. Xin, I, for one, am far more interested in getting something that Dr. Xin has had time to be satisfied with than in getting something released a little too soon - only to have to send it back shortly thereafter for a modification. I fully support Xin in taking the time to make this first offering the one he really wants us to hear and enjoy - for a good while, anyway.
post #426 of 559
Thread Starter 
I agree with Jamato8 comments. I have heard 3 (not quite 5 ) versions of the Reference. At the moment one has about 250 hours and the other 200 hours, frankly it is very hard to tell them apart because of the wide swing in changes from one day to the next.

One day the bass is tight, pronounced, and the next it changes. One day the treble is clear, detailed, and the next not so much. There are two constants though, first the soundstage it is huge both left to right and in depth. I have said that it almost seems like you have two amps inside the reference one taking the main center and a second for the extreme L/R. The second constant is the clarity, I hear bells and hi-hats that all other amps (except the Supermicro IV) simply can not reproduce.

Next Saturday I hope to get together with Vorlon1 and compare some amps. The only thing that would hold be back is that neither of the Reference Amps will have 400 hours (one will be very close). I have had two other portables with large caps, The Hornet which took 400 hours and the Tomahawk which took 800 hours. Time will tell how many hours the reference needs.

Meanwhile I am eagerly awaiting the 400 hour mark.
post #427 of 559
Any comparisons to the hornet?
post #428 of 559
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by forsberg View Post
Any comparisons to the hornet?
Sorry, I sold my Hornet when I got the SR71 which I find superior for the kind of music I listen too (Jazz).
post #429 of 559
Now seriously, is there really any such thing as a "final" version of any Xin amp?
post #430 of 559
Well I believe that this is what Xin really wants. I can tell you that listening to different versions and trying to decide which is better and balances with what isn't always that much fun. The combinations to arrive at a final great sound are many and perplexing. There are many good amps on the market but to make an amp that truly stands out and has that something special is a pursuit that a few here have chosen to pursue.
post #431 of 559
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamato8 View Post
What matters is the time on with some type of signal running through it. I leave a radio playing normally with white noise when I am not listening as I want to know the changes but if I waited for just listening time the burn in would take too long.
Does the amp have to have an output while it is burning in? That is, do headphones need to be connected to the out jack while the amp is burning in?
post #432 of 559
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jemsound View Post
Does the amp have to have an output while it is burning in? That is, do headphones need to be connected to the out jack while the amp is burning in?
Yes, the amp must have a load while being burned in.
post #433 of 559
Listening to a Micro (close to a Micro) with a 12,000uF cap in the Reference case. Wow. . .
post #434 of 559
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamato8 View Post
Listening to a Micro (close to a Micro) with a 12,000uF cap in the Reference case. Wow. . .
Am I right in taking this to be one of your amp tailoring efforts? It sounds like you took a Xin SuperMicroIV, rehosted the board into the Reference case, and solder-rolled in a 12,000uF cap? Is this the already-formed cap from your burned-in Reference? If you're in a sharing mood, you've going to have to flesh out that "Wow. . ." for us a little more, John. How is the sound from this tailored SuperMicroIV relative to the Reference? Relative to a stock SuperMicroIV?
post #435 of 559
Exciting.
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