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BEST crossfeed plugin for foobar 0.8.3??

post #1 of 68
3/9/07 at 10:34pm
Thread Starter 
What is the best crossfeed plugin that will work with foobar 0.8.3? I need a good one that won't cause echoing and make the the music sound like it's bouncing around in a tin can.
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post #2 of 68
3/9/07 at 10:41pm
Bs2b hasn't let me down.

More info on the bs2b crossfeed technique: http://bs2b.sourceforge.net/
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post #3 of 68
3/9/07 at 10:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alleyman View Post
Bs2b hasn't let me down.

More info on the bs2b crossfeed technique: http://bs2b.sourceforge.net/
that's the best foobar crossfeed, but not nearly the best crossfeed in general. i discovered that the hardware crossfeeds are much better.
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post #4 of 68
3/10/07 at 2:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cotdt View Post
that's the best foobar crossfeed, but not nearly the best crossfeed in general. i discovered that the hardware crossfeeds are much better.
That's true, but I think that you could make a good software crossfeed. To be honest I have no idea about this because I have no knowledge of crossfeed (other than the basic stuff everyone knows) whatsoever. It just can't be that hard to make.

To answer the question in the OP: I still have to hear a good software crossfeed. I haven't heard anything which I would call good. I have tried a lot of them since I have been driving my headphones straight out of my soundcard jack for years.
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post #5 of 68
3/10/07 at 4:54pm
Thread Starter 
So would you guys suggest if I don't have the option for hardware crossfeed that I just don't use any crossfeed?
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post #6 of 68
3/10/07 at 6:56pm
I would suggest trying out software crossfeed (whichever one you choose). As it is, crossfeed is subtle and only helps reduce listening fatigue, and the basic idea behind all of them isnt rocket science.

If the software crossfeed helps you in reducing listening fatigue then keep it. If not, then you can invest in a hardware based version. Although bs2b author claims that his software mimics the Chu-moy hardware crossfeed at certain settings.
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post #7 of 68
3/11/07 at 12:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
So would you guys suggest if I don't have the option for hardware crossfeed that I just don't use any crossfeed?
I'm afraid that is what I did.

If you can find a crossfeed that you like you should use it. I have however, not been able to find a decent one.
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post #8 of 68
3/11/07 at 6:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alleyman View Post
As it is, crossfeed is subtle and only helps reduce listening fatigue
When I tried crossfeed for the first time I found it subtle, but once I got used to it it was always very obvious to me when it was missing.

Of course it depends a lot on the recording, some benefit only very slightly, but others, particularly many things of the '60s and '70s with a lot of channel separation, are almost unlistenable for me without crossfeed.
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post #9 of 68
3/11/07 at 7:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
So would you guys suggest if I don't have the option for hardware crossfeed that I just don't use any crossfeed?
Not IMO. I can't tell much of a difference between the standard foobar software crossfeed and the Meier Audio hardware crossfeed in my Corda Aria.

And just as I said: I don't find the crossfeed effect subtle - just try it for some time and switch it off again and you'll probably be surprised.

However I hear some of crossfeed's downsides too: a slightly less focused and tight bass and an overall slightly 'looser' image.
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post #10 of 68
3/11/07 at 8:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sisyphos View Post
Not IMO. I can't tell much of a difference between the standard foobar software crossfeed and the Meier Audio hardware crossfeed in my Corda Aria.

And just as I said: I don't find the crossfeed effect subtle - just try it for some time and switch it off again and you'll probably be surprised.

However I hear some of crossfeed's downsides too: a slightly less focused and tight bass and an overall slightly 'looser' image.
I agree with you. I didnt mean that crossfeed itself was subtle enough to discard but subtle enough that it doesnt change the sound as other DSPs would.

I also have learnt to like crossfeed and instantly notice its absence when I remove it from the DSP chain.

My one gripe with the bs2b crossfeed is that it introduces a -3db gain to the sound, nothing that the volume slider wont take care of.
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post #11 of 68
4/9/07 at 1:41am

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP - the best?

Try Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP, foo_dsp_dolbyhp in Foobar2000. Here is the thread on Hygrogenaudio forum:
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/...howtopic=39404
It goes beyond what the standard crossfeed tries to do in that "it makes you think you are hearing a five-speaker home theater system, when in fact you are listening over ordinary stereo headphones."

The concensus is that in Foobar2000 the order
Convert to 4 channels ---> Dolby Headphone
is the best configuration. In the plugin itself set room as DH1, Amplification at 50% and point it to dolbyhph.dll version 1.10.0.270 on your computer if you have a software based dvd player like PowerDVD installed. This dll was developed by the Lake division of Dolby Labs. See this link for more on the concept:
http://www.dolby.com/consumer/techno...one_story.html

What this plugin does is not subtle and so far I have not pinned down anything significant that it does wrong - no muffling of images, loss of detail, narrowing of soundstage width or frequency range. The soudstage is moved outside your head to such an extent that it now resembles listening to a good surround sound system. Listener fatigue is nil and I now find it hard to remove my headphones.

I have not heard any of the hardware based crossfeeds but IMO it is far better than bs2b, which I first tried.
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post #12 of 68
4/9/07 at 4:47am
What about this one?
http://www.naivesoftware.com/software.html
I have used it and could definitely hear a difference. The slightly weird effect that you have when e.g. a guitar has been mixed to one channel only is reduced quite noticeably and voices get a bit more prominent.
However, it isn't very customisable yet, but it seems like a new version might be coming out (soon?)
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post #13 of 68
4/9/07 at 6:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alleyman View Post
Bs2b hasn't let me down.

More info on the bs2b crossfeed technique: http://bs2b.sourceforge.net/
I'm giving it a go right now. It's surprisingly subtle (good) and does not exhibit any of the negative traits so often associated here with software crossfeed. So far I'm liking it. Thanks for sharing!
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post #14 of 68
4/9/07 at 6:11am
For customizability you can't beat head-plug!!
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post #15 of 68
4/9/07 at 1:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hew View Post
Try Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP, foo_dsp_dolbyhp in Foobar2000. Here is the thread on Hygrogenaudio forum:
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/...howtopic=39404
It goes beyond what the standard crossfeed tries to do in that "it makes you think you are hearing a five-speaker home theater system, when in fact you are listening over ordinary stereo headphones."

The concensus is that in Foobar2000 the order
Convert to 4 channels ---> Dolby Headphone
is the best configuration. In the plugin itself set room as DH1, Amplification at 50% and point it to dolbyhph.dll version 1.10.0.270 on your computer if you have a software based dvd player like PowerDVD installed. This dll was developed by the Lake division of Dolby Labs. See this link for more on the concept:
http://www.dolby.com/consumer/techno...one_story.html
...
I have not heard any of the hardware based crossfeeds but IMO it is far better than bs2b, which I first tried.


Thanks for the info, it is indeed quite a bit better than bs2b...which I had been using until now... It's so good on the road with my E4s (they lack bass) that I'm thinking about converting most of my stuff with this DSP sequence...
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