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post #23791 of 24765

^ It started with this comment, which I think is totally valid. How does one know what a reference amp is for an electrostat? Many people use the O2 as a reference amp for dynamic headphones.

Originally Posted by 3X0 View Post

Never really understood electrostatic amplification either. All I know that the concept of "reference" amplification is much more nebulous and less well-understood than such amplification for dynamic drivers (e.g. Objective 2).

post #23792 of 24765
Originally Posted by miceblue View Post

^ It started with this comment, which I think is totally valid. How does one know what a reference amp is for an electrostat? Many people use the O2 as a reference amp for dynamic headphones.

IMO... a reference is only useful if a significant number of people have tried it. That's only possible if the amp is fairly low-cost. So that's never going to be that possible for Stax. The amps aren't "cheap". If you must have one, the closest are probably the 252 or the 323s. It doesn't help that most people buy different bundles. Again, that's fairly meaningless since so many folks either:


a) happy with their vintage stuff that they aren't "upgrading"

b) go straight for the high-end stuff and skip everything in between

c) start in the mid-range stuff of Stax and sufficiently happy


TLDR: The large number of folks on Stax wouldn't have tried as many amps as on dynamic setups... so why chase something that isn't really that achievable? Again, from what I've observed... most people come to Stax after they have tried everything else and whatever Stax they are at, they've achieved what they've set out for. Most don't upgrade endlessly on Stax amps - just look through the whole thread and you won't find that many upgrading between Stax amps (BHSE aside).


On the plus side, there aren't a crowd of amps for Stax and they are all fairly well differentiated so people don't run into issues with comparing amps like dynamic setups.

Edited by RiStaR - 7/23/13 at 10:26am
post #23793 of 24765
I'm sorry, you guys lost me. What does this have to do with STAX?


The Stax thread is usually more off-topic than it is on-topic. tongue.gif


Also, spritzer, I might be interested in buying your jerry-rigged Egmont amp, but I'd like to know more about it before I decide since it's such an oddity. Since you own both, how does it compare to the SRD-X?

Edited by Tus-Chan - 7/23/13 at 12:27pm
post #23794 of 24765

What happens if you use an energiser with a STAX setup? Will it retain the same sound signature of the power amp?

post #23795 of 24765

What happens if you use an energiser with a STAX setup? Will it retain the same sound signature of the power amp?


Yeah, pretty much, in my experience at least. My SRD-X is pretty much colorless in any way as far as I can tell, though it's kinda limited in power.

post #23796 of 24765
Some prick snagged a a broken Sigma deal from under my nose. I'm coming for you...
post #23797 of 24765

Try go read up on how to win an auction on ebay if you aren't an experienced bidder, then things like that most likely won't happen. 

post #23798 of 24765
This is not through eBay.
post #23799 of 24765
Originally Posted by miceblue View Post

What happens if you use an energiser with a STAX setup? Will it retain the same sound signature of the power amp?

You won't necessarily be able to tell, since your amp/energizer/headphones/speakers etc. all act in conjunction with one another.


Power amps do make the headphones sound quite different.  My current favorite setup is a 50 watt SET Wavac MD 572 with a Stax SRD 7 upgraded with Dyna Z565 trannies through a Stax 3n that has had its drivers replaced with 5n drivers, normal bias.


The older Stax 3n/5n have the reputation for being very monitor like in terms of extreme detail, but with low, dry, well defined bass.


With the bigger amp, there is absolutely no bass deficit, the bass is still fast but has real clout and impact competitive with my Ultrasone Ed8 dynamic headphones.  It's the best headphone set up I have ever heard.

post #23800 of 24765
I think my SR-5 scales better with more prominent lows through my SRD-7sb mk2 hooked up to a 85watt x 2 hybrid class a tube integrated amp.
post #23801 of 24765
Originally Posted by M-13 View Post

You make a good point. Why even have a DAC at all??? It's 2013. All computer sound cards can do a simple conversion of digital to analog using just a tiny fraction of the CPUs power. All properly designed DACs and amps sound the same. If you think I'm wrong please do a thorough scientific study doing ABX blind testing with alteast 10,000 subjects and make sure you get it published in a peer-reviewed journal for electrical engineers. Otherwise I'm right and people are just foolin themselves. (BTW I won't be paying for these tests. You need to do them out of your own pocket for my own pleasure.)

Your words in God's ear ;-)


The critical stage is the line stage of the DAC. Class-A silicon or good NOS tubes will do the job nicely. Fuggedabout the rest ...

post #23802 of 24765
Originally Posted by yawg View Post
Your words in God's ear ;-)


Yes, almost everything I write on Head-Fi is only worthy of God's ear. It's too brilliant for stupid mortal men.

post #23803 of 24765
Originally Posted by RiStaR View Post

Actually, the 202s don't improve all that much with better amps (I went from the 252 to the KGSSHV). There's a bit more control, but I can't say it's a lot better. All that said, the 202 is one of my favorites and I go back to it often even with my 007 for a different flavour (headstage is smaller but that intimacy sometimes work with certain music).


What don't you like about it, though? Also, what's your source? That probably is a big variable.

I came back to the headphone world after playing around with IEMs. So I'm not too clear with other dynamic phones. I only vaguely remember the HD800/LCD2 from memory. It's not that I don't like the 202s. But after receiving my system, I had to ask a: "Is that it?" I don't feel the Stax magic. Maybe I'm being a little too picky for something that is only a basic Stax.


Right now I'm feeding the 252 from a Cirrus Logic Flagship DAC chip. 

Originally Posted by Chris J View Post


Interesting. Personally I prefer my SRS-2170 system over my AKG Q701 & Beyer DT880/600 Ohm, etc and various associated headphone amps. I find the SRS-2170 system to be very engaging, detailed, very nautural sounding and non-fatiguing. Let's just say all my dynamic 'phones are currently gathering dust....! :-(

Engaging...sort of

Detailed-> I find IEMs easier to concnetrate on the details

Non fatiguing-> I felt fatigued after 1 hour somehow... violins, cymbals, high pitched vocals become more shrill like than musical. 


I find all this strange. That I would feel that this relatively neutral headphone would sound bright to me when the KAEDE I use (which is apparently treble knives) sounds fine.

post #23804 of 24765

Sounds like plainly the stat sound isn't for you, guess you're more used to the coloured sound of your IEM's. That said, I absolutely hated my 202's when I got them, unengaging, lifeless piece of crap that I wanted to throw at the walls. Eventually I was going to sell it off for $100 (not typo), but I figured lets try some more amp's, sources and throw various music at them and see what they excel at. Fast forward almost a year now that I have owned them and my opinions/impressions are completely opposite as the sound has grown on me. 


Anyway back to troubleshooting this piece of crap SRM-1 amp, got the crap DVM replaced and measured various points this time. 


Here's a final picture.



It's weird how the first transistors of both TO-5 and TO-66 types measure half the voltage of the last 2 transistors. I honestly can't figure out from my limited experience what the heck is wrong with this amp, unless the pairs of transistors are all suppose to emit the same output voltage?


Then there's bias measurement from the jack of 38vdc....??

Edited by DefQon - 7/23/13 at 9:04pm
post #23805 of 24765

Hi.  Just got in my SR-507s to replace my SR-404LEs.  Not as big a difference as I thought and there is something that I like about the 404le but I would still concede that the 507s are "better".


But,,, I think I want to replace my amp.  I have the SRM-006t.  I have been trying to negotiate buying a SRM-007ii but that may fall through due to my being in Canada.

Anyone have a suggestion whether this is the amp to go for or should I try the 727 or 717?  They're all close to the same price in used and that's about my budget.



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