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Help choosing SinglePower Amp

post #1 of 21
1/23/07 at 3:27pm
Thread Starter 
I read too much this forum ...

I have in order a mid level headphone amp and I really think I don't have choose high enough. I was not very secure to buy from singlepower when I have order this mid amp ... now my fear is gone and I begin to ask somes questions ...

- Most CD player and DAC have XLR out ...
Why only RCA input ? No advantage to have XLR input ?

- Why only 1 input ? I don't think 2 inputs is exagerated ... (dac, cd player, ...)

- Why balanced is a way more $$ than single end ? If I have balanced output for headphone, any way to connect a regular one for convenience ?

- In terms of sound quality, will be usefull to know where Extreme, Extreme Platinum is over MPX, Supra ... ?

- Why SinglePower don't have a FAQ ... ? 8-) 8-) 8-)

- If you have 1500$, 2500$, 4000$ to spend for SinglePower amp ... what you choose considering that:
- 2 sources (DAC and CDplayer (a really good one) able to output both RCA and XLR)
- 2 headphone (Senn HD650 stock cable, Beyer DT990 2005 300 ohms)

(Better to go XLR and buy external switch box and keep some money for particular tubes? Better to go RCA and ask some mod for additional input ? I
I know there no absolute verity but ... it's can help.
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post #2 of 21
1/23/07 at 3:35pm

MPX3

I must say the Singlepower MPX3 has blown me away. I don't think you go wrong with that. I use it with a pair of Sennheiser 650HD and a Marantz DV9500 universal player that was upgraded by THE Upgrade Co. One of my customers who turned me on to Singlepower has some of the higher end models and he raved about them as well.
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post #3 of 21
1/23/07 at 3:54pm
There has been so much written about SinglePower and all it's various models it's hard to know where to begin. Especially since we know so little about you and your listening habits?

For instance if you want to do a lot of tube rolling the new Extreme might offer you the most options. If you don't care about tube rolling another model might be a better fit. Also, which headphones do you want to use? If you plan on using Grados, or AKG 701's, then one of the models with higher current output would be best for you.

Suffice it to say that SP has a house sound, but each individual amp has it's own voice and it's own advantages.

- augustwest
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post #4 of 21
1/23/07 at 4:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompon View Post
I read too much this forum ...

I have in order a mid level headphone amp and I really think I don't have choose high enough. I was not very secure to buy from singlepower when I have order this mid amp ... now my fear is gone and I begin to ask somes questions ...

- Most CD player and DAC have XLR out ...
Why only RCA input ? No advantage to have XLR input ?
XLR = balanced. You can custom order a balanced version of any amp in the line (there was even a PPX3 XLR prototype floating around at meets)

Quote:
- Why only 1 input ? I don't think 2 inputs is exagerated ... (dac, cd player, ...)
My MPX3 Slam SE has two inputs . You just have to ask for it.

Quote:
- Why balanced is a way more $$ than single end ? If I have balanced output for headphone, any way to connect a regular one for convenience ?
A balanced amp is basically two identical amps in one chassis, since that's the way balanced drive works. You can add a single-ended jack to a balanced amp if you want.

Quote:
- In terms of sound quality, will be usefull to know where Extreme, Extreme Platinum is over MPX, Supra ... ?
It is my understanding that the Extremes offer more slam and a larger soundstage, whereas the traditional amps (MPX3, etc.) may offer more detail and transparency. That's very simplified and probably butchered, but its the general idea.

Quote:
- Why SinglePower don't have a FAQ ... ? 8-) 8-) 8-)
Mikhail's so busy building and coming up with new stuff that [ahnold]zere's no tiiiiime![/ahnold]

Quote:
- If you have 1500$, 2500$, 4000$ to spend for SinglePower amp ... what you choose considering that:
- 2 sources (DAC and CDplayer (a really good one) able to output both RCA and XLR)
- 2 headphone (Senn HD650 stock cable, Beyer DT990 2005 300 ohms)
$1500- single-ended Extreme Platinum, maybe MPX3 if that's how your taste goes
$2500- balanced Extreme
$4000- balanced Supra XLR, maybe Extremeified

The main point to remember is that Singlepower is basically a custom order company. Talk to Mikhail about your needs, preferences, gear, and budget, and I'm sure he'll come up with something that fits you well.
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post #5 of 21
1/24/07 at 2:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo05 View Post
XLR = balanced. You can custom order a balanced version of any amp in the line (there was even a PPX3 XLR prototype floating around at meets)



My MPX3 Slam SE has two inputs . You just have to ask for it.



A balanced amp is basically two identical amps in one chassis, since that's the way balanced drive works. You can add a single-ended jack to a balanced amp if you want.



It is my understanding that the Extremes offer more slam and a larger soundstage, whereas the traditional amps (MPX3, etc.) may offer more detail and transparency. That's very simplified and probably butchered, but its the general idea.



Mikhail's so busy building and coming up with new stuff that [ahnold]zere's no tiiiiime![/ahnold]



$1500- single-ended Extreme Platinum, maybe MPX3 if that's how your taste goes
$2500- balanced Extreme
$4000- balanced Supra XLR, maybe Extremeified

The main point to remember is that Singlepower is basically a custom order company. Talk to Mikhail about your needs, preferences, gear, and budget, and I'm sure he'll come up with something that fits you well.

XLR designs dual mono channels. Would two transformers be needed? I guess a seperate power supply and amp would keep internal noise (microphonics, vibration, RF) to a minimum?

If both (XLR & single ended) circuits are installed, would both tube sections be used for single ended or one? If one, can you select which side to get even tube wear?

I'm thinking Platinum XLR w/upgraded power supply. Then you are getting into Supra XLR premium price range.

So many options, so little time (and money). Is it a good investment spending 3-5K for an amp to listen with a $200-300 headphone? I think your putting a lot of money in a underused amp. But I have little experience in this.
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post #6 of 21
1/24/07 at 2:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Camper View Post
XLR designs dual mono channels. Would two transformers be needed? I guess a seperate power supply and amp would keep internal noise (microphonics, vibration, RF) to a minimum?
XLR != dual mono. An XLR dual mono design would be four mono channels (dual mono is just a way of saying L and R channels are separated).

You do not need two transformers, I suppose I should say the power supply remains the same but you double up the signal portion of the amp.

Quote:
If both (XLR & single ended) circuits are installed, would both tube sections be used for single ended or one? If one, can you select which side to get even tube wear?
I think all tubes are used for the single-ended output (I think I asked Mikhail at the Boston meet this summer where he had a Supra XLR configured like this), but I'm not sure.

Quote:
So many options, so little time (and money). Is it a good investment spending 3-5K for an amp to listen with a $200-300 headphone? I think your putting a lot of money in a underused amp. But I have little experience in this.
The HD650 goes for ~$260 used, and people love them with $10k SDS-XLRs Of course, that doesn't take into account the cost of a recable, but it still makes a point.
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post #7 of 21
1/24/07 at 9:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo05 View Post
You do not need two transformers, I suppose I should say the power supply remains the same but you double up the signal portion of the amp.
My new amp Supra Extreme XLR is the first XLR amp Mikhail has used 2 transformers on and judgeing by the results Mikhail has reported to me (it is on its way to me now) he will be building more this way. PS Mikhail took the photo Sorry about the quality.
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post #8 of 21
1/24/07 at 10:22am

MPX3

The MPX3/6SN7 did not drive my K701's well. Unfortunately, I ended up selling both the amp and the headphones before trying out another headphone.
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post #9 of 21
1/24/07 at 10:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by pataburd View Post
The MPX3/6SN7 did not drive my K701's well. Unfortunately, I ended up selling both the amp and the headphones before trying out another headphone.
The low impedance K701 work far better with more powerful output tubes, such as the 5687 and 6BL7GT/A.
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post #10 of 21
1/24/07 at 3:12pm
Thread Starter 
Cool!

Supra Extreme XLR .. what is the difference with Supra XLR ?

What options you got ?

(seem he took his photo with a digital video camera or cell phone!) hehehe
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post #11 of 21
1/24/07 at 3:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo05 View Post
The low impedance K701 work far better with more powerful output tubes, such as the 5687 and 6BL7GT/A.
I second that. My HD595 (50 ohm) doesn't sound as good with the MPX3 as with the HeadAmp GS-1. Actually, it doesn't sound good at all. Perhaps due to a deliberate HD650 tuning of the amp.

It seems the 12,6SN7GT tube has a greater chance to show what it is capable of with high impedance headphones than low one’s: The story about high impedance phones needing powerful voltage swings while high current output is important to low impedance phones.
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post #12 of 21
1/24/07 at 3:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pompon View Post
Cool!

Supra Extreme XLR .. what is the difference with Supra XLR ?
It can switch between the traditional Supra circuit and the Extreme circuit, which is why there's two different transformers on the amp. I've heard the Supra XLR at a meet this summer, and it was by far my favorite (and there was the ES-1, B-52, and Headroom Balanced Home w/ Max modules there too). I can't imagine this beast....I've said it before, these power tubes are getting very very very dangerous to my wallet...
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post #13 of 21
1/26/07 at 1:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo05 View Post
The HD650 goes for ~$260 used, and people love them with $10k SDS-XLRs Of course, that doesn't take into account the cost of a recable, but it still makes a point.
A 10K amp should be able to make a soup can sound great. Does the 650s use that amp to its full potential? Would you buy a 25K amp for a 1K speaker?

Markmaxx,
By the looks of that beast, I can see why so many people want to hear it. You have a special creation there. Perhaps a stacked Plitron for the upgrade This is a fun hobby isn't it?
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post #14 of 21
1/26/07 at 2:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Camper View Post
A 10K amp should be able to make a soup can sound great. Does the 650s use that amp to its full potential? Would you buy a 25K amp for a 1K speaker?
Headphones != speakers, first off.

Secondly, the 650s scale like no other can I know of. Seriously. A well-driven balanced HD650 is in the top tier- this is taken from the impressions of others on the forum who have top gear and exposure to a lot of top headphones.
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post #15 of 21
1/28/07 at 5:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo05 View Post
Headphones != speakers, first off.

Secondly, the 650s scale like no other can I know of. Seriously. A well-driven balanced HD650 is in the top tier- this is taken from the impressions of others on the forum who have top gear and exposure to a lot of top headphones.
The speaker reference was just an analogy to the cost/value investment. Change the word to HP if it makes you sensitive. A 40:1 ratio of amp to HP?

The point is if the cans can't perform to the amps capabity, you are wasting your money putting more into the amp (unless you are looking to upgrade the cans to take advantage of the investment). If any cans at this price range can perform to the $10k amp level of performance, I've (and the vendor) underestimated their value. Why would you spend $ks on high end cans? Will the amp make the 650s sound their best, I would hope so. Will the 650s make the amp sound its best?

This is not a slight to the 650s or any other <$500 can. I feel that the investment in the other components won't improve the cans more than they can perform.

If any Senn fan took my statement to slight the HP, that was not my intent. I apologize. And they may be the best HP at this price range. That was not the ?
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