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post #76 of 5935
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bizkid
Wasnt i clear enough? They are useless to compare performance BUT it can give you a hint on its soundsignature. I hope thats clear now finally
Yes, I understand what you're saying. But I would shift your bold emphasis to read instead:

Quote:
They are useless to compare performance BUT it can give you a hint on its soundsignature.
With loudspeakers, consumers seem to demand frequency response curves to reassure them that the sound they are buying into has some sort of basis in the science of acoustics. And manufacturers are only too happy to oblige.

But in the end, it really means little, given all the other varying intangibles that factor into the final sonic result.

And I'm sure those 750s can't get to you fast enough! Should solve your headache 'tho. Just don't listen to them critically until they have a good 100 hours burn-in. You will be rewarded!
post #77 of 5935
The only thing that those graphs show, is that they will give you an idea, of how the freq response is distributed along the whole spectrum, in maybe a similar way, (and IMO not very similar neither as those graphs are not linear) but soundwise they tell you very little, the Senns has a veil that the Edition 7 does not have, in what part of the graph is that veil, is that in the graph? Also don't froget that for similar that they look, for every 3 db you are almost duplication the SPL, so the differences are not that subtle between the curves if you ask me....
post #78 of 5935
Guys! All i wanted to say is: The graph clearly shows that the Proline 750 is going to sound like a closed can (which it is!) and not much like the open 2500 variant! However it might share the same refinement, resolution and detail. Can we agree on that? Pleaseeee

Quote:
don't froget that for similar that they look, for every 3 db you are almost duplication the SPL, so the differences are not that subtle between the curves if you ask me....
Thats what i also told dexdexter just a few posts back.
post #79 of 5935
Quote:
Originally Posted by bizkid
Guys! All i wanted to say is: The graph clearly shows that the Proline 750 is going to sound like a closed can (which it is!) and not much like the open 2500 variant! However it might share the same refinement, resolution and detail. Can we agree on that? Pleaseeee



Thats what i also told dexdexter just a few posts back.
Yes we can agree, disagree or whatever you want man, just chill out....

Nobody is saying that you are wrong or right, just that those two curves are sometimes misleading in what they indeed represent, they also normalize them sometimes, and use logaritmic scales what is sometimes confusing, and in the last acception, sometimes honestly I do not trust the source as my ears tell me the opposite, but you can use them as a reference at least of what ot expect...
post #80 of 5935
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sovkiller
Yes we can agree, disagree or whatever you want man, just chill out....
No! No agreeing on Head-fi, I won't allow it!
post #81 of 5935
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sovkiller
Yes we can agree, disagree or whatever you want man, just chill out....
Good Oh and btw, the Sennheiser veil/smoothness comes from lack of resolution in upper mids, its not a function of its frequency response. But that can be an explanation too for smooth sound, try dialing out 8khz with agressive cans.
post #82 of 5935
Thread Starter 
So after all that staring at curves 'til our eyes glaze over business, it would appear that we can all agree that the PROline 750 will most likely sound different from the PROline 2500.

Picking up where I last left off:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dexdexter
Well the burn-in continues, and later this afternoon I'm gonna bring the 2500s in to Alexandre, my local hi-fi dealer, for a listening session.

He's not exactly a headphone guy (well, neither was I until just about a month ago), but as far as impressions of sound go, there's nobody that I trust more. He is scathingly blunt with his opinion, and has the uncanny ability to articulate things that I'm not able to notice.

I'll report back this evening.
It pains me to reveal that Alexandre was tied up in customer demonstrations when I rang him yesterday, but he promised to be available for a listen today.

Meanwhile, the 2500s have just passed the 150 hour mark on the run-in, so I'm thinking that they'll be just about ready for him.

Dex
post #83 of 5935
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dexdexter
So after all that staring at curves 'til our eyes glaze over business, it would appear that we can all agree that the PROline 750 will most likely sound different from the PROline 2500.

Dex
Might you be suggesting that it would be more helpful to actually listen to them instead of studying the curves? Good idea! I'm looking forward to conducting that experiment myself, and am told that a nice box from Meier Audio arrived for me today in Florida with a pair of each inside! (I had been give a false report that they had arrived earlier, but those were the DT990). It should be a great weekend. I can't wait to get up there again.
post #84 of 5935
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wmcmanus
Might you be suggesting that it would be more helpful to actually listen to them instead of studying the curves? Good idea!
Nah... that's just too crazy, even for us.
post #85 of 5935
After being very curious for a long time now, and some mishap on e-bay (a deal gone wrong, but I luckily recovered my loss) I finally managed to score some 750s!!! I got a good deal from a (semi) lokal retailer and they should arrive next week!
Can't wait to look at their graphs ....Ehhh finally hear them myself!!!!
post #86 of 5935
Proline 750s are in! And im surprised, very pleasantly surprised! I cant understand why they dont have a bigger follwoing here on head-fi.

But first some pics:





Ok it looks a little pale compared to the W5000

The sound however, is very nice, i didnt expect that much from it by reading impressions here. First thing i noticed is a very pleasant and relaxed distant vocal projection, its not pinpointable as on the W5000 but it works in a great way nonetheless. Also vocals are clear, and that has something to say when you hear them next to the W5000! AD2000 didnt have such clear vocals.
It seems to be able to draw a line between too much resolution which becomes problematic with average pop recordings, and just enough to make vocals clear and shiny without becoming annoying. Great r&d work on this can for sure!

It cant match the W5000 in clarity & detail (which can have mentioned downsides) but especially in soundstage the AT is superior, it offers a wider sound, more height and much better instrument seperation. But for the price i paid the 750 is THE unquestionable A900/W1000 killer. And its also somewhat portable which i needed. Especially it sounds alot more refined compared to the A900 for the same price, AND its portable, wonderful!

The bass can be a little overpowering and has a one-note flavour similar to the A900, but i dont have problems adjusting to that.
Also it acts strange on a few songs for whatever reasons. Songs that just sound fine on the W5000 appear harsh in vocals on the Ultrasone, or imagining is off center while it sounds fine on the W5000 again. But this is in the minority, maybe 1-2% of what i have.


What a bargain for 160€ These are easily worth the retail price imho.. Oh and they sound very nice out of my nano and notebook.
For me personally they are more my type of sound, i find them more involving than the AD2000 for example.
post #87 of 5935
Quote:
Originally Posted by bizkid
Proline 750s are in! And im surprised, very pleasantly surprised! I cant understand why they dont have a bigger follwoing here on head-fi.

But first some pics:





Ok it looks a little pale compared to the W5000

The sound however, is very nice, i didnt expect that much from it by reading impressions here. First thing i noticed is a very pleasant and relaxed distant vocal projection, its not pinpointable as on the W5000 but it works in a great way nonetheless. Also vocals are clear, and that has something to say when you hear them next to the W5000! AD2000 didnt have such clear vocals.
It seems to be able to draw a line between too much resolution which becomes problematic with average pop recordings, and just enough to make vocals clear and shiny without becoming annoying. Great r&d work on this can for sure!

It cant match the W5000 in clarity & detail (which can have mentioned downsides) but especially in soundstage the AT is superior, it offers a wider sound, more height and much better instrument seperation. But for the price i paid the 750 is THE unquestionable A900/W1000 killer. And its also somewhat portable which i needed. Especially it sounds alot more refined compared to the A900 for the same price, AND its portable, wonderful!

The bass can be a little overpowering and has a one-note flavour similar to the A900, but i dont have problems adjusting to that.
Also it acts strange on a few songs for whatever reasons. Songs that just sound fine on the W5000 appear harsh in vocals on the Ultrasone, or imagining is off center while it sounds fine on the W5000 again. But this is in the minority, maybe 1-2% of what i have.


What a bargain for 160€ These are easily worth the retail price imho.. Oh and they sound very nice out of my nano and notebook.
For me personally they are more my type of sound, i find them more involving than the AD2000 for example.
Give it time, and you will love it...about the one note bass, that will change and laso that is a reflection of what you have upstairs, but that will improve for sure a litle overtime...once you get used to them...Also keep in mind that AT tune the amps for their headphones, so you may or may not like the result with them using different headphones....
post #88 of 5935
Yup it didnt sound very good out of the HA5000 (even though its pretty neutral and not tuned to a specific eg. "warm" flavor ), so all mentioned comparisons where unamped for both cans while comparing.
post #89 of 5935
Quote:
Originally Posted by bizkid
Proline 750s are in! And im surprised, very pleasantly surprised! I cant understand why they dont have a bigger follwoing here on head-fi.......
Glad to hear that you like your new 750s. Now remember to pay special attention to the s-logic surround sound feature. I realize that at first it one may just dismiss the whole thing as some kind of marketing BS but given the proper recording I swear the s-logic does have an effect.

The way I describe the effect is that the music appears to originate more from in front of your head, the way music from a pair of speakers would, rather than from directly between your ears. The sound still goes left to right but now has more of a front to back component to it. The effect is rather subtle and takes a while to kick in but once you hear it you'll recognize it. Other headphones do not have this effect, even really good phones (Sennheiser HD650, AKG K701, Beyerdynamic DT880).
post #90 of 5935
Yup thats what i first noticed when i put on the phones and mentioned it above (its what i meant with vocal projection). However it comes short especially in height, but you would need a can like the W5000 to learn how soundstage height can work in headphones.
Still its a great can, no question about that.
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