or Connect
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › Sennheiser HD650 Impressions Thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Sennheiser HD650 Impressions Thread - Page 477

post #7141 of 36848

Ok well thanks for the reply that was extremely helpfull.

post #7142 of 36848
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholars View Post

Ok well thanks for the reply that was extremely helpfull.

 

I was kidding around! I did answer your question though. But don't worry, you'll have lots of people who will show you their EQ!

post #7143 of 36848

lol I suppose they are pretty good with flat EQ but to me they sound better with more bass < 100hz and also the lower mids boosted 2.5 - 5khz and 10-14khz. Also depends if you have the black or silver version maybe. I wish the HD650's had the sub bass of the Denon D2000's and they would be pretty much perfect.

 

How do you find the HD600 compared the the HD650? Can the HD600 be EQ'd to sound exactly the same or are there actual differences?


Edited by nicholars - 7/18/12 at 5:35am
post #7144 of 36848

Excited to get my 650's today!

This has always been the holy grail of headphones for me. I've owned HE500s, but I still look at the HD650 with envy. I've always wanted a pair. Good thing I managed to squeak in on the $339 Amazon deal before they jacked the price back up. 

 

Now I just need to worry about an amp...

 

Trying to stay under 500.

Listen to a lot of acoustic stuff, pretty much everything except for country and metal.

Source is iMac with lossless files. 

Never had a tube amp before, but they interest me. 

 

-Little Dot MKiii

-Bottlehead Crack with speedball. The problem here is this one gets pricy quick. (Never built any sort of electronic anything. not that Im opposed to trying, but I don't have any tools, so It may be easier to pay for the build.)

-Any of the Schiit stuff. Heard the Asgard, haven't heard the others. Any preferences? I hear valhalla is good and then hear Lyr is good and that Lyr is bad and Valhalla is bad just go with the Asgard... It's confusing. 

-????

 

Anything else I should be looking at?

post #7145 of 36848

I think there's consensus the Lyr is a good match for the HD650. It's telling that less than favourable impressions are often from those who have limited themselves to just the stock tubes. There are good alternatives in the price range you're in. Personally, if looking to build a budget system around the HD650, I'd look to the Crack for its renowned synergy with the HD650. If you have more demanding cans in the stable or if you plan to accommodate them in future, the Lyr is a no-brainer.

post #7146 of 36848

I don't have any other headphones at the moment, and the only route I could ever see taking again would be some orthos. Maybe some unreleased HiFi Man down the road. Maybe an LCD-2/3/4, but that would be years from now. 

 

I just want to listen to music. I've been chasing headphones for a while and just want to get something and stick with it.

 

I want to like the Crack, but It's going to be hard to justify the almost $600 dollar price for one with the speedball and the assembly for both. How hard is this thing to build and what kinds of tools would I have to buy? I dont see that information listed anywhere on their website. (or I missed it someplace.) 

post #7147 of 36848
Quote:
Originally Posted by schaaf View Post

 

I want to like the Crack, but It's going to be hard to justify the almost $600 dollar price for one with the speedball and the assembly for both. How hard is this thing to build and what kinds of tools would I have to buy? I dont see that information listed anywhere on their website. (or I missed it someplace.) 

 

Here is a link on Bottlecrack forum where they recommend some tools: http://www.bottlehead.com/smf/index.php/topic,173.0.html They say it can be a first project, with the speedball a second. I was really close to attempting it until I started reading around about soldering. I don't really have a great place for it and the initial tool investment seemed a little expensive. I decided not to though I would love a Crack/Speedball... I may get one from another headfier! 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholars View Post

How do you find the HD600 compared the the HD650? Can the HD600 be EQ'd to sound exactly the same or are there actual differences?

 

They are remarkably similar, so much that going back and forth its tough to tell which is "better;" They sound different but you can tell they are brothers. I don't know if they could be eq'd to sound alike but I think you could get close; the HD600 may be easier to EQ because it is flatter.... Like many say, I believe that the HD650 gets better the better amp you throw at it; not saying the HD600 doesn't but it seems less dependent on the quality of the amp. To use a metaphor, they are suprisingly similar for city driving (like out of an E9), just different flavors; on the highway, the HD650 gets a chance to show what it can do. 

post #7148 of 36848
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholars View Post

lol I suppose they are pretty good with flat EQ but to me they sound better with more bass < 100hz and also the lower mids boosted 2.5 - 5khz and 10-14khz. Also depends if you have the black or silver version maybe. I wish the HD650's had the sub bass of the Denon D2000's and they would be pretty much perfect.

 

How do you find the HD600 compared the the HD650? Can the HD600 be EQ'd to sound exactly the same or are there actual differences?

 

Yeah, but the Denons gain must of their sub-bass performance by being semi-closed.  I wouldn't what my HD650 semi-closed biggrin.gif  Sure the Denons have a larger diaphragm thus have better extension as well.  But you'd barely notice it were it not for the huge bass hump combined with the enclosed back.  Doing deep bass on a fully open can seems to be limited to HE-400/6, LCD-2/3, and HD800 for the moment wink.gif  And all of the above have pretty huge diaphragms to pull it off.

 

Supposedly there are actual differences with HD650 having the edge in terms of technical performance, however supposedly they are also very close beyond the tuning.  One thing to keep in mind when we're talking about "they can be EQ'd the same" is we're not talking graphical eq where you bump x-band to a certain boost or cut.  We're talking parametric EQ....to make them effectively exactly the same you'd have to have a fairly high resolution parametric and quite a bit of skill with designing the curves biggrin.gif  Also keep in mind even the HD700 is effectively the same driver platform as HD600/HD650.  So it likely has some technological tweaks, but other than the EQ differences is probably very similar on the inside, though possibly with updated magnets.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by olor1n View Post

I think there's consensus the Lyr is a good match for the HD650. It's telling that less than favourable impressions are often from those who have limited themselves to just the stock tubes. There are good alternatives in the price range you're in. Personally, if looking to build a budget system around the HD650, I'd look to the Crack for its renowned synergy with the HD650. If you have more demanding cans in the stable or if you plan to accommodate them in future, the Lyr is a no-brainer.

 

Agreed.  Both Lyr and Crack both have excellent reputations for HD650.  I've honestly not heard any really negative impressions of Lyr+HD650.  I've seen people that definitely prefer either neutral SS sound or prever a more drippy tube sound, but haven't really seen too many that outright dislike the combination.  And as you said, the limitation of stock tubes does sway opinions....they're $10 tubes...what does one expect?  Though they're honestly decent (if noisy) tubes.  I'm surprised by them sometimes when I rotate them back in.  That's in comparison to some definitely much more expensive, but not top-of-the-line $100-per-tube tubes. 

 

Agreed, I've heard nothing but praise for Crack...and if you can self-build it's quite cheap.  If you can't self-build, then it's basically the same price as Lyr, so it's a coin toss.  If you plan on powering something low impedance as well though (any HiFiMan HE series, Audeze, AKG, etc) Lyr is the one that'll handle them all cleanly (everything except Denons/Fostex.)

 

I'm powering HE-400, HD650, and K702 on Lyr.  Crack wouldn't be as thrilled with HE-400 or K702.  But would propably be happier for my D5k which I'm currently using an O2 with since Lyr is too noisy for headphones that sensitive.

post #7149 of 36848

Have you ever compared the lyr and o2, iemcrazy?  O2 is seriously a thought for me now for a future amp purchase, but I wondered how it faired against the lyr with he-400 in particular.

post #7150 of 36848

Thanks for another informative reply IEMcrazy.... I have been messing about with EQ of the HD650 quite a lot and trying to ignore the pre conceived idea that they are slow headphones and it seems that by removing the mid bass hump and boosting the higher frequencies that it is possible to get them pretty decent sounding (in terms of speed).... Comparing them to the D2000 they are definately better headphones in a lot of ways (imaging, soundstage, overall sound quality, ear pain!)... Hmmm looks like the HD650 have won again in every area except for sub bass.... It seems like the only headphones which are going to beat the HD650 overall are the HE400.... I keep thinking that I want to swap them for other headphones then every time I go back to the HD650 I remember how nice the imaging, soundstage and overall sound quality is!


Edited by nicholars - 7/18/12 at 8:35am
post #7151 of 36848

EQ.png
 

 

This EQ for the HD650 makes them sound like a different pair of headphones! Hardly slow or mellow sounding at all compared to a flat EQ.... I see what you mean now about them being fast drivers which sound slow because of how they are voiced.


Edited by nicholars - 7/18/12 at 8:55am
post #7152 of 36848
Quote:
Originally Posted by schaaf View Post

 

I want to like the Crack, but It's going to be hard to justify the almost $600 dollar price for one with the speedball and the assembly for both. How hard is this thing to build and what kinds of tools would I have to buy? I dont see that information listed anywhere on their website. (or I missed it someplace.) 

 

I had almost none experience with soldering but it was really simple. It didn't take me two nights as some have said but it was worth it. The tools I used were $50 at much, instead of  ~ $150 you have to pay for a built Crack.


Edited by aroldan - 7/18/12 at 9:30am
post #7153 of 36848
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMRaven View Post

Have you ever compared the lyr and o2, iemcrazy?  O2 is seriously a thought for me now for a future amp purchase, but I wondered how it faired against the lyr with he-400 in particular.

 

Yes, I have actually.   Specifically speaking of HE-400, I will say that O2 performs quite admirably with them.  My personal preference is still for the Lyr...the tube sonics still agree with me, and HE-400 indeed shows the differences.  I won't deny that to be my preference, but for someone that favors a more neutral SS tone, the O2 does very very well with those headphones.  I can see how someone may prefer that sound with them, as they pick up a bit more of an accurate, sharp, detail oriented presentation more like what I imagine HE-400 + silver cable would be versus the stock HE-400.   While not my preference, O2 is certainly not a bad choice for HE-400.

 

For HD650, I would recommend it only for those who love a truly analytical sound however.  HD650 is capable of being surprisingly analytical on an analytical amp...and O2 produces that effect very well.  I would not often by choice listen to HD650 on the O2.   I could see myself sometimes doing so with HE-400 despite my preference for Lyr.

 

My D5k's however live on the O2.  The combination is fantastic.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholars View Post

Thanks for another informative reply IEMcrazy.... I have been messing about with EQ of the HD650 quite a lot and trying to ignore the pre conceived idea that they are slow headphones and it seems that by removing the mid bass hump and boosting the higher frequencies that it is possible to get them pretty decent sounding (in terms of speed).... Comparing them to the D2000 they are definately better headphones in a lot of ways (imaging, soundstage, overall sound quality, ear pain!)... Hmmm looks like the HD650 have won again in every area except for sub bass.... It seems like the only headphones which are going to beat the HD650 overall are the HE400.... I keep thinking that I want to swap them for other headphones then every time I go back to the HD650 I remember how nice the imaging, soundstage and overall sound quality is!

 

Glad to hear some experimenting was able to show you the interesting nature of preconceived notions and psychoacoustics with the HD650! It's an interesting headphone in that regard, and you've got it in one...the only area HD650 truly has a defficiency in is sub-bass.  And it costs quite a lot to get all of what HD650 does PLUS that sub-bass performance.  Like LCD-2 kind of money wink.gif

 

I wouldn't say HE-400 "beats" HD650 at all.  In fact HE-400 and HD650 are great compliments to each other and both are my primary two headphones that compete for head-time.  HE-400 is excellent in many areas including bass, tone, etc.  HD650 is excellent in its timbre and tonality.  Overall I'd argue that, if your rig is tuned around HD650, HD650 is still the better performer on a technical level of the two.  But I'm more comfortable saying they're both excellent equals.  If I had to choose only one to keep it would be HD650, however, it would be a VERY painful struggle to pull either away from me.  They both get about 60/40 head-time for me with HD650 60% of the time, HE-400 40%....or maybe 55/35 with the other 10% being split between K702 and D5k.

post #7154 of 36848

That's enough for me.  Put my order in for an O2.  If I like it over my otl tube amp for the HE-400 than that's good.  If I don't like it, then at least it'll have a high resell value and at least I know what an amp with zero coloration sounds like.  Mostly hoping I can get that extra bass extension that I think I'm missing out with my current little dot.

post #7155 of 36848

Are the HE 400 brighter/more sibilant than the HD650?.. How about the D2000?

 

At the moment I have Denon D2000 and HD650 and although I cannot really afford it at the moment I think I might just keep both for now because they are such a nice combination, the HD650 for all the things i have said previously and the D2000 for the sweet sub bass and exciting sound... The only problem I have with the D2000 is the fact that they actually physically hurt my ears and give me tinnitus.... they have very sharp treble and siblance at times! They are alright for short bursts on certain genres but as an all rounder for music, films and games the HD650 definately wins.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Headphones (full-size)
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › Sennheiser HD650 Impressions Thread