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Sennheiser HD650 Impressions Thread - Page 440

post #6586 of 36903

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin Morrow View Post

Again, all subject to debate.

 

Except it is not. What I stated are facts, they are not debatable. Wether you chose to believe in them or not is another thing. 

The existance of expectation bias is not subject to debate.

The fact that human hearing only percieves a fraction of the sound and that the brain filters out the rest is not subject to debate.

The result of this is that in order to yield valuable results you have to do proper blind testing, if you disagree with this it is because you are  either uninformed and lack sufficient understanding of human hearing or just ignorant.

 

Wether there actually exist a difference between cables is yet to be proven, and that is a fact.

 

 

post #6587 of 36903
Guys, let's please not start another flamewar about cables. I've seen enough of those.
post #6588 of 36903

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilpo View Post

Guys, let's please not start another flamewar about cables. I've seen enough of those.

 

 

I wish people would just let us discuss our HD-600/650 cables without someone trying to preach to us about how we're hearing things. It's really annoying. Then we wouldn't have this issue. Most likely all these science guys never tried a single recable in their entire life. I'm all for making my headphones sound as good as possible without spending a lot of money. DIY cable upgrades are also fun and cheap to make.

 

I don't get this non-sense about how a headphone cable needs to make a measurable difference for there to be any sort of change. Just look at the Q701 vs K702. It supposedly has the same frequency graph for some people, but sounds quite different. Most cables have effected sound clarity, how warm/bright the sound is and the soundstage size. If you don't believe a copper wire can effect soundstage size, you should try Cat 6 wire for audio. It's a quick $10 test. I used Monoprice Cat6 wire.

 

There is also an old post where someone had measurable differences for an HD-650 with copper and silver wire.

 

I can't say it enough, but it's obvious that the biggest difference between cables is how warm or bright they are. The lower capacitance wires seemed to always sound brighter and be less warm sounding. I guess this isn't enough of a difference. This is one reason I can't stand Canare wire with the HD-650. Yet, i'm hearing things. You can go to any audio forum and see dozens of posts about people having issues with their high capacitance wiring effecting the highs in their setup or studio. This would most likely be an issue with longer cable runs though.

 

I don't believe "copper is copper". I think the stock Sennheiser cables are no good and that's why I upgrade them for cheap. Stock cables are sometimes really bad. Similar to those free junk cables you get with a DVD player.

 

I have no issues with people not believing in cables. I'm not trying to preach to them and say they're wrong. I always suggest to people to use their own ears and come to their own conclusion and not just listen to everyone else. I believed cables were all the same for maybe five years and then finally did my own tests and proved myself wrong. It all started with a silver recable of the KSC75.

 

Not going to post anything else here.


Edited by tdockweiler - 4/29/12 at 11:08am
post #6589 of 36903

If there is a problem with the headphones, do I have to ship them back to Germany?

post #6590 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mando323 View Post

If there is a problem with the headphones, do I have to ship them back to Germany?

No, you can ship them back to your retailer. Repairs and warranty related things are always done through the retailer, and not directly with Sennheiser.
post #6591 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilpo View Post

Guys, let's please not start another flamewar about cables. I've seen enough of those.

Oh, I'm not. Just stating that everything, including process, is subject to debate. I'm just here to post my findings. That's all.
post #6592 of 36903

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mando323 View Post

If there is a problem with the headphones, do I have to ship them back to Germany?

 

Only if you are in Germany.

 

If there is a problem under guarantee, take them back to your dealer.

 

If out of guarantee, buy the spare part and fit it yourself - it's easy.

 

post #6593 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Willett View Post



Only if you are in Germany.

If there is a problem under guarantee, take them back to your dealer.

If out of guarantee, buy the spare part and fit it yourself - it's easy.

Or if you can't, I'm sure there is a head-fier in the same country/state willing to fix it for you as long as you pay for his expenses.
Plenty of helpful people around. smily_headphones1.gif
post #6594 of 36903

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tdockweiler View Post

 

 

 

I wish people would just let us discuss our HD-600/650 cables without someone trying to preach to us about how we're hearing things. It's really annoying. Then we wouldn't have this issue. Most likely all these science guys never tried a single recable in their entire life. I'm all for making my headphones sound as good as possible without spending a lot of money. DIY cable upgrades are also fun and cheap to make.

 

I don't get this non-sense about how a headphone cable needs to make a measurable difference for there to be any sort of change. Just look at the Q701 vs K702. It supposedly has the same frequency graph for some people, but sounds quite different. Most cables have effected sound clarity, how warm/bright the sound is and the soundstage size. If you don't believe a copper wire can effect soundstage size, you should try Cat 6 wire for audio. It's a quick $10 test. I used Monoprice Cat6 wire.

 

There is also an old post where someone had measurable differences for an HD-650 with copper and silver wire.

 

I can't say it enough, but it's obvious that the biggest difference between cables is how warm or bright they are. The lower capacitance wires seemed to always sound brighter and be less warm sounding. I guess this isn't enough of a difference. This is one reason I can't stand Canare wire with the HD-650. Yet, i'm hearing things. You can go to any audio forum and see dozens of posts about people having issues with their high capacitance wiring effecting the highs in their setup or studio. This would most likely be an issue with longer cable runs though.

 

I don't believe "copper is copper". I think the stock Sennheiser cables are no good and that's why I upgrade them for cheap. Stock cables are sometimes really bad. Similar to those free junk cables you get with a DVD player.

 

I have no issues with people not believing in cables. I'm not trying to preach to them and say they're wrong. I always suggest to people to use their own ears and come to their own conclusion and not just listen to everyone else. I believed cables were all the same for maybe five years and then finally did my own tests and proved myself wrong. It all started with a silver recable of the KSC75.

 

Not going to post anything else here.

 

 

The problem with people preaching about cables and what they are not understanding is that no one is arguing that you are not in fact hearing a difference (on the contrary; not hearing a difference would be strange), what's being argued is why

Unless you can isolate the cable as the sole cause, which for scientific reasons only is possible with a blind test done under certain conditions, what you are essentially doing is making people spend money on placebo effects.

post #6595 of 36903

how does the sr-71b perform with the hd650?

post #6596 of 36903

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellygoose View Post

 

 

 

The problem with people preaching about cables and what they are not understanding is that no one is arguing that you are not in fact hearing a difference (on the contrary; not hearing a difference would be strange), what's being argued is why

Unless you can isolate the cable as the sole cause, which for scientific reasons only is possible with a blind test done under certain conditions, what you are essentially doing is making people spend money on placebo effects.

 

Let's not start a flame and argument war. This thread is entitled "Sennhesier HD650 Appreciation Thread." So let's appreciate the headphone and the accessories in relation. If there are cables we like that may sound different, we'll discuss it here. No need to get into science and why, so let's stop.

post #6597 of 36903

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin Morrow View Post


Oh, I'm not. Just stating that everything, including process, is subject to debate. I'm just here to post my findings. That's all.

 

 

There are many things not subject to debate. You don't debate theories(in the sense you are implying), they are called theories because they make accurate descriptions about reality and have so far never been wrong. Refuting a theory is not something you do on an internet forum, even less without any evidence supporting your claim.

Expectation bias is real, it is not debatable. The same goes for what we know about human hearing. If you have a hypothesis as to why headphone cables bypasses these phenomena, nothing is stopping you from testing or at least sharing it.

 

post #6598 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin Morrow View Post



Let's not start a flame and argument war. This thread is entitled "Sennhesier HD650 Appreciation Thread." So let's appreciate the headphone and the accessories in relation. If there are cables we like that may sound different, we'll discuss it here. No need to get into science and why, so let's stop.

I agree. Although the scientific aspects may be both interesting and relevant, they only lead to heated discussions without any actual merit due to the large difference in peoples opinions. Therefore let this be the last post regarding the cable debate in this thread.
post #6599 of 36903

Alright, going back to our beloved headphone.. how do you people clean the pads? So far i've just been using my hands to kind of brush them but I don't think it will suffice forever. Anyone tried actually washing them ?

post #6600 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellygoose View Post

Alright, going back to our beloved headphone.. how do you people clean the pads? So far i've just been using my hands to kind of brush them but I don't think it will suffice forever. Anyone tried actually washing them ?

I believe some people have been washing them at low temperatures with good results.

Alternatively a lot of people buy new pads. I believe they are only about $30 or so, which is definitely useful after a year or two of being worn.
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