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Sennheiser HD650 Impressions Thread - Page 438

post #6556 of 36888

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by matti620 View Post

 

 


Have you ever thought about trying a double blind test for the cable after some time you get used to its sound? I've always been curious about it.

 

Honestly, I'm not a big fan of double blind tests. I've done it a few times with amps, and passed, but not with cables. Both me, and anyone who tried it, always gets nervous and think it's not worth it. I I hear something, I'll post about it.

post #6557 of 36888

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilpo View Post

Double blind testing with headphone cables is pretty much impossible.
For good double blind testing you need very fast switching, because our audio memory is only accurate for a second or so. This is not possible with headphones without using a switchbox, but I don't see how on earth you'd be able to use a switchbox with headphones without physically taping it to your head. And even then the signal passes through the switchbox, meaning you first have to extensively prove the transparency of the switchbox.
Changing it with longer times in between the cables will most likely not produce very good results either, since it will make it very difficult to compare the probably small effects the cable has on the sound.

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilpo View Post


That would only work if the people are unfamiliar with the public opinions on the cable, and the price tag of the cable.
Otherwise these two factors will heavily bias your perception of sound quality.

 

 

Perfect statements. Exactly my thoughts.

post #6558 of 36888

People express strong and clear opinions about hi-fi cables and how they improve sound, and since I'm not going to spend a few hundred dollars on one, I was wondering if it really has any merit.

post #6559 of 36888
Quote:
Originally Posted by matti620 View Post

People express strong and clear opinions about hi-fi cables and how they improve sound, and since I'm not going to spend a few hundred dollars on one, I was wondering if it really has any merit.

Some will tell you it does nothing to the sound, others will tell you it is almost necessary to buy (or build) aftermarket cables.

Discussing which side is right will only lead to heated discussions and is a classic cause of derailed threads.

In short, scientific evidence suggest there is probably no audible difference, whereas anecdotal evidence suggests the opposite. Which of the two you believe is entirely up to yourself.
post #6560 of 36888
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilpo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by matti620 View Post

People express strong and clear opinions about hi-fi cables and how they improve sound, and since I'm not going to spend a few hundred dollars on one, I was wondering if it really has any merit.

Some will tell you it does nothing to the sound, others will tell you it is almost necessary to buy (or build) aftermarket cables.

Discussing which side is right will only lead to heated discussions and is a classic cause of derailed threads.

In short, scientific evidence suggest there is probably no audible difference, whereas anecdotal evidence suggests the opposite. Which of the two you believe is entirely up to yourself.

Again, perfectly put Tilpo. Thing is, I wouldn't post cable impressions of I didn't hear anything. I've A/B'd stock vs. aftermarket cables hundreds of time (literally) and hear a difference. I don't think it's as blown up as everyone makes it out to be, but it certainly isn't nothing.
post #6561 of 36888
Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin Morrow View Post

Again, perfectly put Tilpo. Thing is, I wouldn't post cable impressions of I didn't hear anything. I've A/B'd stock vs. aftermarket cables hundreds of time (literally) and hear a difference. I don't think it's as blown up as everyone makes it out to be, but it certainly isn't nothing.

However, you certainly shouldn't underestimate the power of expectation bias on sighted listening tests.

I'm not saying there is no difference, but it's the most likely scientific explanation why people consistently claim differences when measurements and ABX show the opposite.
post #6562 of 36888

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin Morrow View Post

 

 

Just so everyone who reads this knows, these are my impressions, and cables, IMHO, do make a difference, and other people may disagree, which is fine. Just a disclaimer. So, my impressions are as follows...

 

The SPC HD650 cable from Toxic Cables is a fantastic sounding cable (so far) for the money. In a nutshell, it combines the warmth and lushness of copper with the speed and sparkle of silver. The SPC cable has a ever so slightly deeper and wider soundstage, tighter bass response with more depth extension, better instrumental separation, and more notably, a much more sparklier and extended treble presentation.

 


Very similar to my impressions of the ALO SXC (silver plated copper) on the Q701 and other headphones. On my Q701 it seems to slightly remove some warmth (which I didn't like), but I converted it for use on my DJ100 and it's now amazing. I don't even know the retail value since I got it in on a trade. Maybe $150? I'm the only one dumb enough to use SPC on a $65 headphone!

 

I bet ANY silver plated copper would be perfect for the HD-650/650. Another cheap DIY option would be a low capacitance wire such as Belden 1192A or the thinner version.

 

The ALO SXC on my Q701 didn't make the Q701's treble any more extended or sparkly. It actually made it smoother sounding, which is bizarre. Different results on different headphones I guess.

 

I remember using Mogami and Canare on my old HD-650 and only recently did I figure out why I didn't like that match.

 

If someone wants to try a cool experiment, try making a HD-650 cable out of Cat6. It'll blow away any of this expensive stuff. The Double Helix, ALO etc. Too bad it might be impossible to use Cat6/5 for headphone use.

 

Lately i've been liking the new Cardas interconnect Cable I got for $40 shipped. I might buy one for my HD-600 or Q701. Too bad bulk Cardas wire is too hard to find in DIY versions.

 

Right now I use the Double Helix wire with my HD-600 and love it. Seems to bring forward the upper mids and help with the sub-bass. Really clears up the sound too somewhat. I imagine i'd like the ALO SXC a bit more though on the HD-600/650, but it's more expensive. I actually hate the DHC wire on any other headphones. Sounded awful on my HD-598, but good with the HD-600.

post #6563 of 36888

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by matti620 View Post

I'm a new owner of a used HD650. I tried to use the Foobar equalizer to compensate for the hump in the frequency response:

 

equalizer.png

 

The HD650 frequency response according to HeadRoom:

graphCompare.php.png

 

While it adds noise it also uncovers the dark nature of the headphones.  Are HD800 or Hifiman 6 the only flat headphones out there?

 

 

You should ignore the HeadRoom response - it's only really useful for comparing headphones that HeadRoom measure all the same way and helps to explain their characteristics.

 

As Headphones are designed to sit on the head over the ears, the headphones are designed to give you the correct sound in your ears, not out of the capsule.

 

Also it depends on how they are measured - if you measure them on a flat plate, as many do, the plate will affect the sound measured as it is not a soft curved head.

 

 

 

post #6564 of 36888

Why not just buy some silver from here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pure-Silver-9999-Stranded-Wire-29AWG-Teflon-Audio-Cable-/110536892795?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19bc83217b#ht_13302wt_802 and get on with it?

 

I mean if you get your hands dirty, might as well go full monty.


Edited by RudeWolf - 4/28/12 at 11:49pm
post #6565 of 36888

Not sure which Cardas wire you're looking for but here's a link..

http://www.takefiveaudio.com/mall/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=86&cat=Cardas

 

If you look at the Star Quad cryo treated and calculate what it would take to make a 10 foot DIY cable..$101 for the cable, $19 for the Senn plugs (all cryo treated), sleeving, shrink tubing and finally a decent plug, you're probably at $150 plus shipping plus your time assuming you already have a good solder gun and Cardas solder, etc.

given all that trouble, Toxic cable seems like a bargain (assuming the wire is at least as good)..

You can get the Mogami quad cryo for $2 a foot.. That may be worth an experiment. OTOH, used cables seem to be the best buy :)

Just thinking out load.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tdockweiler View Post

 

Lately i've been liking the new Cardas interconnect Cable I got for $40 shipped. I might buy one for my HD-600 or Q701. Too bad bulk Cardas wire is too hard to find in DIY versions.

 

 

 

 

post #6566 of 36888

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by roBernd View Post

 

 

feel at ease, all newer HD650 share the hd580 print.

NONE of the HD580 have it printed on their membrane at all.

 

This has been dealt with in several threads for years (and years to come)

 

if you hear a differance to another HD650 (your friends HD650 e.g) this is largely due to the changed screen in fron of the driver.

Yours is silver~ish, while the older ones have a black acoustic silk screen.

 

The older once are more bassy and veiled.

The newer ones are more neutral in mids and bass and have more treble.

 

 

I just purchased those headphones! At the moment I have a HD555's without an amp. I'm purchasing a Asus Essence STX but I am wondering if my A/V receiver would be enough to drive the headphones. I own an Onkyo RC-260.

post #6567 of 36888

Wouldn't the length of the wire matter a lot more than the material?

Will reducing its length from 2 meters to 1 improve the sound?

post #6568 of 36888

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by matti620 View Post

Wouldn't the length of the wire matter a lot more than the material?

Will reducing its length from 2 meters to 1 improve the sound?

 

I don't think so, no.

post #6569 of 36888

The more I listen to this SPC cable by Toxic, the more resolved it becomes, even more so that the usual silver plated copper cables.

post #6570 of 36888
The toxic cable was on my short list until I stumbled across a TWag v2 on the for sale forum and snapped it up. As stated on an earlier post, the silver cable made the most noticeable and welcome change of any cable upgrade for the HD650. Sennheiser should ship the Hd650 with a silver cable as stock and they would find it would attract a whole new set of admirers. They could call it the Hd675. biggrin.gif
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