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Sennheiser HD650 Impressions Thread - Page 405

post #6061 of 36851

I think that you're right ac500. There is no possible way that my HD-650 can equal the HD-800 and I will not make any claims as such. Truthfully, the HD-650 is a place holder for me right now. It reintroduced me to the Sennheiser sound after many years and I like it a lot. I think the HD-650 represents a stellar value especially if you can buy it used and in mint condition.

 

I have no desire to post in the Sennheiser HD-800 appreciation threads. It's a $1,500 USD headphone and I plan to get a $816 USD Cardas Clear cable for it on top of it next year in 2013. I can afford it right now, but I don't want to think about it for a while.

 

I was told by Pigmode not to change up the rest of my audio system before or after I get the HD-800 because it developed polarizing opinions by owners. I think that I will heed his advice.

 

I am done talking about the HD-800.

 

The HD-650 is the most tonally balanced, neutral, accurate, and pleasant sounding headphone that I have owned in a very long time. I can hear changes that I make to my audio system upstream such as when I had the Audioquest Diamond 1.5 meter USB cable or when I got my Audioquest Cinnamon 1.5 meter USB cable which I am using right now to connect my System76 Bonobo Professional laptop to my audio system. The HD-650 is the most comfortable headphone that I have worn in a long time too. I can listen to my favorite music using them for several hours without fatigue. I was listening to my music all day today to stay awake during the day.

 

HD-650 represents an awesome value by today's standard. I still think that these are reference grade headphones especially with an aftermarket cable upgrade such as Cardas, ZU, Moon Audio, Jena Labs, etc. These are no longer the current top of the line reference grade headphones from Sennheiser, but they are a damned good value for the money and sound. I can see myself owning them for quite some time before I decide to upgrade to the HD-800 with Cardas Clear cable next year.

 

These HD-650 headphones have made me stop looking for another pair of headphones or earphones for a long time. I can live with them for another year before I upgrade to the HD-800 with Cardas Clear cable.

post #6062 of 36851

> HD-650 represents an awesome value by today's standard.

 

This x1000 without any doubt, especially when you get it for ~$350.

 

After experiencing several mid-high tier headphones from various brands, I have to say I'm a Sennheiser fan. IMO Sennheiser manages natural tonality, detail, and lower end liquidity that makes for an unrivaled combination I've not yet heard in a Beyer or Audio Technica or Audeze (to my ears; I have not yet been convinced the LCD2 in any way comes close to the HD800's detail, although the thick and weighty bass is nice although I'm conflicted because I often prefer the HD800 bass accuracy and transparency) etc. although I've not heard the T1. Probably never will though because Beyers don't fit my head properly.

 

On the topic of the HD800, it's polarizing IMO because its upper treble >10khz is not recessed, and slightly forward of neutral. You have to pair it with a slightly dark amp for it to be dead neutral, but even then people don't like it; some people here call the HD650 or LCD2 neutral, and that's just wrong at least to most people's ears I think (I still don't know what it is that generates different tonality perceptions for different people). For me, the HD800 is pretty much perfection. I'll probably keep my HD650 though because I treat my HD800 like glass due to the price, and because the HD650 makes anything sound good because its recessed treble covers up imperfections in treble.

 

In general though the HD800 beats the HD650 hands down across every description or comparison I have yet thought of (yes, bass too -- especially sub-bass). Soundstage, separation, and detail probably come out as the most striking improvements, literally miles better IMO -- my jaw dropped when I first heard the HD800 coming from HD650s.

 

In all fairness, the HD650 only wins in pseudo-metrics like ability to conceal flaws, which is another way of lacking detail or lacking treble presence - not to say this is bad but it's a compromise you must determine you want or not. And in all fairness, some people love dark sound signatures like the HD650 (I like it for some things), and that's fine.

 

With equalization, I have yet to find any need/genre/mood the HD800 cannot fulfill brilliantly, and much more so than the HD650, except for one thing: concealing fine details, whereas the HD800 always manages to reveal everything even with treble severely reduced. Once again, it's a compromise. Do you really want to hear everything -- perfection and imperfection -- or not? I'm the kind of audiophile who pursues high audio fidelity, so my answer to that question is yes.


Edited by ac500 - 3/11/12 at 6:41pm
post #6063 of 36851

If all goes according to plan with my purchase of the Cardas headphone replacement cable for my Sennheiser HD-650 headphones this week, then I should get them delivered to my home by this Wednesday. I will post my listening impressions and I will post a mini review. I am really anticipating the Cardas cable. It is a very important upgrade for me because I have so much Cardas Golden Reference cabling my my audio system now. I think that it will be a perfect match for me. I love the Cardas sound so much. I am not expecting a night and day difference, but I know what to listen for since I used to own the Sennheiser HD-600 with the older Cardas blue smurf cable years ago. This is a must have upgrade for me and I can get them for $100 USD which is affordable for me since I spent so much money on my audio system over the past several years.

 

I am going to hope that I can sell my Moon Audio Blue Dragon cable pretty soon. I have to get rid of this cable. It does not sound right to my ears in my audio system. The bass is off and I am expecting a warmer mid range. Treble is good, but not great. I should be able to sell it to another Head-Fi member though.

post #6064 of 36851

has anyone  made the upgrade to this cable i'm considering this  worth  it?

 

http://www.musicdirect.com/p-3724-cardas-hd650-upgrade-cable.aspx

post #6065 of 36851

I had a DIY Mogami replacement headphone cable made up for my Sennheiser HD650 reference headphone. This was when I had the Audio-GD Fun digital to analogue converter/headphone amplification system from the People's Republic of China. The Mogami replacement headphone cable was of the garden hose variety and I was amazed at the difference it made over the stock Sennheiser HD650 headphone cable. I subsequently upgraded to the Double Helix Cables Molecule headphone cable for my Sennheiser HD650 reference headphone. The Double Helix Cables Molecule headphone cable looks nice with its soft nylon multifilament sheathing and Double Helix Cables branded heat shrink. However, there is no sonic improvement over the stock Sennheiser HD650 headphone cable that I can perceive. There are times I think I hear a difference but I would not wage a penny on being able to ABX these headphone cables.

 

I am generally a cable agnostic, but I do own some nice cables that have made some noticeable improvements in my system. For example, the Furutech Formula 2 USB cable solved the occasional drop out I experienced when generic usb cables were used to connect my Apple MacBook to the Audio-GD Fun digital to analogue converter from the People's Republic of China. The Q-audio replacement headphone cable for the Audez'e LCD-2 revision 2 planar magnetic headphone is also worth the expense for me for its weightlessness and flexibility.

 

I play Apple Lossless Audio Codec files from my current model 13" Apple MacBook Pro i5 laptop. The aforementioned Furutech Formula 2 USB cable is used to connect my 13" Apple MacBook Pro i5 laptop to the Schiit Bifrost digital to analogue converter from the United States of America. From there, Blue Jeans Cables LC-1 RCA interconnects are employed to send audio to my Schiit Lyr headphone amplification device from the United States of America. The vacuum tubes installed in the Schiit Lyr headphone amplification device at this very moment are Lorenz branded vacuum tubes from the Stuttgart factory in Germany. I go between these and Amperex vacuum tubes from the Herleen factory in Holland for the slight difference in sonic signatures.

 

I like the sound of the Sennheiser HD650 reference headphone very much.

post #6066 of 36851

to be  clear so your answer would be   no it's not  worth it?

post #6067 of 36851

Could you please elaborate? Do you say this not counting detail as sound signature? If so then I get it, no SS change but more quality.

I'm confused confused.gif
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by olor1n View Post

I had a DIY Mogami replacement headphone cable made up for my Sennheiser HD650 reference headphone. This was when I had the Audio-GD Fun digital to analogue converter/headphone amplification system from the People's Republic of China. The Mogami replacement headphone cable was of the garden hose variety and I was amazed at the difference it made over the stock Sennheiser HD650 headphone cable. I subsequently upgraded to the Double Helix Cables Molecule headphone cable for my Sennheiser HD650 reference headphone. The Double Helix Cables Molecule headphone cable looks nice with its soft nylon multifilament sheathing and Double Helix Cables branded heat shrink. However, there is no sonic improvement over the stock Sennheiser HD650 headphone cable that I can perceive. There are times I think I hear a difference but I would not wage a penny on being able to ABX these headphone cables.

 

I am generally a cable agnostic, but I do own some nice cables that have made some noticeable improvements in my system. For example, the Furutech Formula 2 USB cable solved the occasional drop out I experienced when generic usb cables were used to connect my Apple MacBook to the Audio-GD Fun digital to analogue converter from the People's Republic of China. The Q-audio replacement headphone cable for the Audez'e LCD-2 revision 2 planar magnetic headphone is also worth the expense for me for its weightlessness and flexibility.

 

I play Apple Lossless Audio Codec files from my current model 13" Apple MacBook Pro i5 laptop. The aforementioned Furutech Formula 2 USB cable is used to connect my 13" Apple MacBook Pro i5 laptop to the Schiit Bifrost digital to analogue converter from the United States of America. From there, Blue Jeans Cables LC-1 RCA interconnects are employed to send audio to my Schiit Lyr headphone amplification device from the United States of America. The vacuum tubes installed in the Schiit Lyr headphone amplification device at this very moment are Lorenz branded vacuum tubes from the Stuttgart factory in Germany. I go between these and Amperex vacuum tubes from the Herleen factory in Holland for the slight difference in sonic signatures.

 

I like the sound of the Sennheiser HD650 reference headphone very much.



 

post #6068 of 36851

facepalm.jpg

post #6069 of 36851
Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin Morrow View Post


Exactly, you need to focus on a DAC & amp combo over anything else, and that includes recabling. Recabling does very little, if anything at all, to improve the sound.


 

I completely agree you on this. So would you recommend that I drop $500-1000 for a dac/amp upgrade before grabbing the hd 650 since I already do have a dac/amp?


Edited by killerfrenzi - 3/11/12 at 8:15pm
post #6070 of 36851
Quote:
Originally Posted by killerfrenzi View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin Morrow View Post


Exactly, you need to focus on a DAC & amp combo over anything else, and that includes recabling. Recabling does very little, if anything at all, to improve the sound.


I completely agree you on this. So would you recommend that I drop $500-1000 for the dac and amps before grabbing the hd 650?



facepalm.jpg

post #6071 of 36851

And on that day, several facepalms were given.

post #6072 of 36851

@ killerfrenzi - get the HD650 first. If you like its sound signature, then by all means build a system around it (like I have done). Cables come last.

post #6073 of 36851
Quote:
Originally Posted by olor1n View Post



facepalm.jpg



bro, I edited my post. wasn't sure if they meant "get an amp/dac" or "get a better amp/dac"

post #6074 of 36851
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluzeboy View Post

to be  clear so your answer would be   no it's not  worth it?



The best thing to do is try it and listen with your own ears. Better yet, build one yourself using a cheaper wire. If you hear no difference, stop there. This is what I did. With cables, people will be split 50/50 on if it improves anything. I wouldn't suggest any fancy pants cables until you have a good DAC/AMP. I'd probably never buy a $150+ cable. I don't care how good it is..I do wish there was a Cardas vs DHC comparison out there.

 

I'm surprised to hear of someone hearing a difference with Mogami, but not the DHC. Supposedly the DHC is dead neutral, but I don't know about that.

It's nice on my HD-600. I think the Canare and Mogami made the HD-650 too warm. Probably because of the Starquad wire I used.

I don't own the HD-650 any more, but had it several times. Going to give it another try now that I upgraded my DAC and cable.

 

For any headphone it's best to find a wire that's a good match for it, same with amps/dacs. I learned this the hard way..


Edited by tdockweiler - 3/11/12 at 8:43pm
post #6075 of 36851

I see, you were talking about two separate cables..oops, my bad! redface.gif
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by olor1n View Post

facepalm.jpg



 

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