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Sennheiser HD650 Impressions Thread - Page 172

post #2566 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by attenuated 3db View Post

Quote:

Originally Posted by funkymonkcp View Post

 

I am sure I will get used to the sound. When I got my UE-11's I thought they sounded somewhat lifeless and flat compared to the Westone 3's I got a month prior but now I can't listen to any other IEM's but my UE-11's.

 

The Radio Shack SPL meter was the one I was looking at. I was researching how to measure the SPL of headphones and I saw some guy on here put cardboard over the headphones and put a hole in the middle for the SPL meter. How do you take your readings?
 

I have the new HD650 because I just bought them new and see the white inside them. I was looking at after market cables but I can't ever see paying $400-600 on a cable. If you recommend a specific one, let me know, send me a link or something and I will check it out. I would have to demo one somewhere to see if it makes a real improvement. I'll reserve bass judgment till I get more hours on the 650's.

Quote:

Originally Posted by olor1n View Post


I'd suggest you give your ears time to adjust first. You may just be used to exaggerated bass and may find yourself hearing other things as bloated instead after some time with the HD650 (like what jasonb has experienced and what I've found myself as well).

 

Fwiw, I prefer a warmer presentation so I choose to colour the sound towards this spectrum by employing the Moon hdam in my dac. The copper cable balances the resulting congestion through the refinement it brings so what I'm left with is great synergy for my taste. Again, I DON'T ADVOCATE SPENDING BIG BUCKS if you want to see what a cable may do for you. If you want to go down this path make sure you are mostly happy with your existing chain to begin with (as funds may be better spent addressing those deficiencies first).

 

The cable I got was custom made by a prominent Head-Fi DIYer. I think it sounds great and for a small fraction of the cost of boutique cables. I'm not going to disclose who made it though, as I was unhappy with other aspects of the transaction.

 

Before spending any money on aftermarket cables to address a specific perceived deficiency in only one area of the HD650s ability to suit your own personal musical tastes (i.e., an enjoyment of good bass reproduction, which means different things to different people), I would take a look at this no-cost tutorial first:

 

http://www.head-fi.org/wiki/tutorial-on-how-to-equalize-headphones

 

I don't know whether people realize it or not, but fancy cables, tube or op-amp "rolling" (which includes substituting various A-gd HDAMs) are all just various ways to equalize in different ways the signal that is ultimately presented to your ears.  But they all cost something in terms of additional equipment or components.  Playing with equalization via free software, as the tutorial explains, might easily satisfy whatever dissatisfaction you have with the HD650's low end, but do it in a deliberate, scientific fashion aimed specifically at measuring and correcting (to your tastes) the lower frequencies.  Doesn't cost a penny, and it makes more sense, IMHO, than the semi-random substitution of active components like tubes or op-amps or cables (which aren't even active components) to achieve a specific "sonic signature" (an expression of audiophile jargon that I have never really cared for, but what the heck, I'm running out of synonyms for various things at this point in this post). redface.gif

 

FWIW - I love my HD650s low, mid and high-frequency response without any software EQ or other significant tweaks.  Good amplification is a necessity, but the all-tube headphone output of my inexpensive Maverick Audio A1 integrated amplifier does a great job driving the 650s to my ears, although I've never been able to personally compare it to any other headphone amplifier in the remote region of the world where I reside.

 

Well I had a chance to demo the Moon Audio Silver Dragon V2 for the HD650. Well, I was wrong thinking cables couldn't make much a difference. Wow, the HD650's sound perfect to me now. I can listen to them longer without being burnt out so quickly and they sound just a whole lot more exciting and lively. I also got a silver dragon for my UE-11's. Not as big of a difference as the HD650's. However, I just got these cables today and Drew recommends burning in for 100 hours for best sound. Can't wait to hear how they sound.
 

 

post #2567 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by funkymonkcp View Post

 

However, I just got these cables today and Drew recommends burning in for 100 hours for best sound. Can't wait to hear how they sound.
 

Just as there are different religions in the world, there are different viewpoints on the notion that a cable can be "burned in:"

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t15688.html

Do the electrons find their favorite paths from one end of the wire to the other with repeated practice, or what? Mrspeakers, you own Sennheiser 650s with your Burson 160D; can you explain the phenomenon of cable burn-in to us from your educational and professional perspective? popcorn.gif
post #2568 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by attenuated 3db View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by funkymonkcp View Post

 

However, I just got these cables today and Drew recommends burning in for 100 hours for best sound. Can't wait to hear how they sound.
 

 




Just as there are different religions in the world, there are different viewpoints on the notion that a cable can be "burned in:"

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t15688.html

Do the electrons find their favorite paths from one end of the wire to the other with repeated practice, or what? Mrspeakers, you own Sennheiser 650s with your Burson 160D; can you explain the phenomenon of cable burn-in to us from your educational and professional perspective? popcorn.gif

I don't know if cables burn in but I am curious to see if there is a difference after the recommended 100 hours.




 

 

post #2569 of 36903
If someone could actually prove cable burn-in is real they should get a Nobel prize in Physics. This is the ultimate in placebo effect. Cables can create real differences, because they are essentially LCR filter circuits. But the LCR values do not change over time, at least not time measured in less than years.

Ear burn in more likely...

This is a bit OT so a different thread would be a good call...
post #2570 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrspeakers View Post

If someone could actually prove cable burn-in is real they should get a Nobel prize in Physics. This is the ultimate in placebo effect. Cables can create real differences, because they are essentially LCR filter circuits. But the LCR values do not change over time, at least not time measured in less than years.

Ear burn in more likely...

This is a bit OT so a different thread would be a good call...


Psychoacoustics play the biggest role yes, but IME, there is a bit of truth to actual cable burn-in as well.

 

I'm not going to comment more on it though because this has the potential to become another cable-centered debate that the science forum is filled with.

post #2571 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by sphinxvc View Post

@olor1n       Enjoying the contrast.  I like the touch of smoothness it adds, makes sub-par recordings sound good.  I never did get that last op-amp I was waiting for, it got lost in the mail.  But I've arranged for more and I should have 5 new ones by the first weekend of March.  



Did you resolve the issue you had with the optical input? You should really play around with setting the Audio Midi output to 96/24. Discussions I've had with members in the NFB-12 thread have confirmed my own experience with how the WM8741 treats this upscaled signal (most noticeable is the improvement in soundstage).


Edited by olor1n - 2/25/11 at 4:00pm
post #2572 of 36903

Quote:

Originally Posted by olor1n View Post

Did you resolve the issue you had with the optical input? You should really play around with setting the Audio Midi output to 92/24. Discussions I've had with members in the NFB-12 thread have confirmed my own experience with how the WM8741 treats this upscaled signal (most noticeable is the improvement in soundstage).


Yes, I had one faulty cable I tested with and then it turned out my Macbook had a faulty optical out as well so no 92/24 for me until I invest in a hiface.  My DIR9001 is going to waste.  

post #2573 of 36903


Quote:

Originally Posted by funkymonkcp View Post



 

Well I had a chance to demo the Moon Audio Silver Dragon V2 for the HD650. Well, I was wrong thinking cables couldn't make much a difference. Wow, the HD650's sound perfect to me now. I can listen to them longer without being burnt out so quickly and they sound just a whole lot more exciting and lively. I also got a silver dragon for my UE-11's. Not as big of a difference as the HD650's. However, I just got these cables today and Drew recommends burning in for 100 hours for best sound. Can't wait to hear how they sound.
 

 

 

That's good to hear!  I'm looking into getting a Blue Dragon V3 cable myself.  Plus my E9 comes tomorrow.  I'm so excited!  I've listened to these 650's for almost 6 hours straight tonight.  

 

 

I think I'm starting to get obsessed with this stuff.

 

post #2574 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiwikat View Post

 

That's good to hear!  I'm looking into getting a Blue Dragon V3 cable myself.  Plus my E9 comes tomorrow.  I'm so excited!  I've listened to these 650's for almost 6 hours straight tonight.  

 

 

I think I'm starting to get obsessed with this stuff.

 


A better dac would be of more benefit to you than the Blue Dragon.

post #2575 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by olor1n View Post




A better dac would be of more benefit to you than the Blue Dragon.



Any affordable recommendations?  I like the E7 because I can strap it to my ipod and it works great with my thinkpad.  I've heard the E7/E9 combo is a great bang:buck ratio.  My "serious" listening is just FLAC files from normal CD's.  Would a better DAC make much of a difference when playing from those types of source files?  Eventually I'll invest in some better gear but that won't be for a while as I've got a lot of "life" things coming up soon.  I'm hoping the E7/E9 will suffice for now.  Recabling my HD25's made a huge difference so I thought recabling the HD650's would also make a big difference.  I am still a noob though...

post #2576 of 36903

I'm not saying a cable isn't worth considering. I was a bit of a sceptic myself until I heard the difference my upocc copper made to the soundstage and bass presentation. It just seems like a backwards approach to be spending that much on a cable now when the bottleneck in your setup is clearly the E7 (great when you haven't heard anything else, but ultimately congested and lacking resolution).

post #2577 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Strummer View Post





The story of this B22 is kind of curious. It started last year when I began buying all the parts necessary for building a 4 channel beta for myself, but I ran out of minerals to keep buying what I needed (I need to stop playing and watching so much Starcraft), since I haven't had a steady paying job for quite a long time. But in Christmas I convinced a friend to buy a LCD-2 (so I could try them... mwahaha) and when he got them he didn't like them that much out of his Luxman amp, and since he knew I was stuck with the Beta and wanted to try the LCD's with it to see if he will keep them, he decided to ask me to finish building the beta and sell it to him (since he also knows that I really can use any extra money these days). But he asked me to build a 3-channel so he didn't need to recable or reterminate his headphoness. He will come for his amp (and his LCD's that I borrowed since January) next month probably.

 

But whenever I build myself one, it will be a 4 channel one (I simply love the XLR connectors, they  look cool) or maybe even I will go crazy with a 5 channel one (so to be able to use it in 4 channel and 3 channel modes, I believe it is possible but I haven't really looked into that), although that won't happen until 4th quarter of 2012 at the earliest frown.gif. I didn't get the chance to hear the 701 with the beta since I sold them a long time ago, but I sold them to a friend, so I might ask him to let me try the combination just to hear it, and compare it to the 650.

 



I would love to hear your impressions of the Beta 22 VS your Lehmann Black Cube, because we both have this amplifier.  Does it match the impressions of Headpfonia as in the BCL is analytical and the B22 more organic and natural?

 

My next DIY project, when I get around to it is to build a balanced B22 from the Glass Jar kit...but I was thinking of eliminating the volume pot and using the B22 as a pure amplifier block and a pre-amp to take over switching and volume control duties...because I have this unshakable belief that it's not hi-end till I can control the volume from my couch :P.  Do you see this working out and not degrade sound quality?  After all the the best speaker amps need a pre-amp.

 

FWIW, I never truly enjoyed the BCL and HD650 pairing, it exacerbated and brought out the HD650s slightly grained top end...it was too bright for the HD650.  Yet I felt it paired well with the HD800 highlighting the HD800s smooth and precise treble.  The HD650 always seem to match organic and natural sounding amplifiers, not analytical ones from my experience.

post #2578 of 36903

Woohoo! My HD650 are out for delivery, cannot wait to start burning the set in tonight!

 

I've already decided on a Schiit Valhalla as my amp, but that won't be until May.

post #2579 of 36903
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiwikat View Post





Any affordable recommendations?  I like the E7 because I can strap it to my ipod and it works great with my thinkpad.  I've heard the E7/E9 combo is a great bang:buck ratio.  My "serious" listening is just FLAC files from normal CD's.  Would a better DAC make much of a difference when playing from those types of source files?  Eventually I'll invest in some better gear but that won't be for a while as I've got a lot of "life" things coming up soon.  I'm hoping the E7/E9 will suffice for now.  Recabling my HD25's made a huge difference so I thought recabling the HD650's would also make a big difference.  I am still a noob though...


Good Golly (as Donald Rumsfeld might say), there are so many options it is hard to tell you where to begin. If you are wedded to the notion of something you can strap to your iPod and take anywhere, Head-Fi legendary reviewer "Skylab" loves his Ray Samuels P-51 Mustang:

http://www.raysamuelsaudio.com/products/p-51

(Personally, I prefer the Ray Samuels SR-71A Blackbird, but that's just because I like modern, high-altitude, supersonic reconnaissance aircraft more than the vintage WWII fighter birds)

In an even-more-affordable-than-the-E7, strap-to-your-iPod vein, the NuFoce icon mobile is popular:

http://www.nuforce.com/hp/products/Iconmobile/index.php

I am becoming convinced that the FiiO products (although quite good) have more market share than they would have otherwise if it weren't for the fact that the Amazon.com website "recommends" them so aggressively.
post #2580 of 36903
Hey Now,

I just got a Blue Dragon cable and re-terminated it with a 4-pin XLR. Now I know I changed two things (balanced and new cable), but I could hear a distinct improvement over the stock cable. It was quite noticeable, for the good. I'm really enjoying it. I haven't tried the HD650s with my other set ups, but it doesn't exhibit any veil through this set up >>

iMac > Fidelia > M2Tech Hiface > Balanced Opus DAC > A-GD Balanced Roc

I felt I had a decent set up for the HD650s and a headphone cable seemed like the next best thing to try out, got a good deal on Head-fi. It made a difference. This coming from a guy who re-cabled his Fostex T40v1s with ethernet Cat6 cable 8^), which sounds very good for a $5 cable.

--
Finest kind,
Chris
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