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HD580 <-> HD600 Comparison?

post #1 of 43
Thread Starter 
yup. the upgrade bug is biting again....

i have been using the HD580 for nearly a year now. i listen to 100% classical. i'd say chamber/orchestral 50%/50%. the HD580 is very sweet and very musical for chamber and instrumental piece, however, i find it a bit too lean for orchestral. the separation is there, the clarity is there, but the dynamics and atmosphere is lacking. i hear bass, but the bass that i hear don't seem to contribute to the big picture, i feel like i am not sitting in front of the music, but instead the orchestra is around 50 meters away. and then occasionally, i feel the bass drum, but then the cellos and double basses never has an impact.

i wonder whether anyone can tell me if i upgrade to the HD600 will increase my enjoyment.

strange that after the more i upgrade the electronics, the more i realize that something is missing. perhaps it is not the HD580? the only really weak component i have is the interconnect between the P3A and the EMP. just a cheapo cable i pulled out from the bottom of the drawer.

here is my setup:

CEC TL-1 transport ->
DH labs AES digital cable ->
PT P3A D/A ->
cheapo RCA cable ->
Earmax Pro with upgraded NOS tubes ->
post #2 of 43
Well, there are a few things you could try before switching headphones. Defininitely get some high-quality interconnects, you might be surprised just how much is probably getting cut off by the cheap cables. You could also add a Clou cable to the 580s, w/ your level of equipment the cables changes could make a noticeable improvement.

But as for your dissatisfaction about being way out in the audience... I highly doubt getting the 600s will get you much closer. The 580s/600s are going to be somewhat laidback, no matter what other equipment you've got. Sounds more like you should think about the Grado RS-1, if upgrading the cables doesn't do the trick.
post #3 of 43
Sounds more like you should think about the Grado RS-1, if upgrading the cables doesn't do the trick.
I agree with dhwilkin. If you're tired of sitting way back in the audience with your Senns, the Grado RS-1 will definitely move you much closer to the action. In some cases, you may find yourself in the middle of it.
post #4 of 43
yeah, I don't think that an upgrade would cause the dramatic improvements you're after.
The 580 sound and the 600 sound are very similar.

I find the 580 a little bit more in-your-face and slightly harsher/more aggressive. The 600s however are very smooth, which I don't find necessarily better but just different.
It took me hours to decide which one I liked better actually.
Maybe Grado is really the way to go for you...


post #5 of 43
I would first try the cable upgrade. Even if you still think the 580s are lacking after the cable upgrade, and you end up getting the Grados, you may still want to do a cable upgrade regardless.
post #6 of 43
Thread Starter 
i don't have any good quality cables lying around, but i do have one digital interconnect that came with my TL-1. not neccessarily a high quality cable, but it is rather thick and looks like somewhat better quality than the ones that comes with CD players.

since i only have one of it, i plugged it into the right channel, and instantly i am getting more bass response from my right side. i am still unable to tell if it is giving me more engaging sound as i only have one channel...

anyway, i will go out and shop for some better interconnect this coming weekend. and then out goes the piece of crap Monster cables i had. (i know i know, but that was the old days...)

i already have a set of Clou red ordered. but headroom is back ordered on it.
post #7 of 43
Thread Starter 
oh, and i am trying to lean away from Grados. my ears grows outwards and don't work very well with Grado ergonomics. i listen for many long hours at work and the RS-1 will be very uncomfortable...
post #8 of 43
Hmm.. ever heard the CD3000 ?
post #9 of 43
Redwood, you took the words right out of my mouth!
post #10 of 43
Redwoood said...

Hmm.. ever heard the CD3000 ?
If you can't stand the Grado egronomics, the CD3000 would be the only other (reasonably affordable) option. Well, I suppose maybe a tweaked DT931, but that could be a hassle...
post #11 of 43
Tomcat has the Earmax I think and loves the BeyerDT770/990 series and would probably call the Senns lean in comparison as well.
post #12 of 43
So how exactly do the 770/990 compare to the 600s or CD3000s in terms of clarity and instrument separation?
post #13 of 43
Thread Starter 
Originally posted by Redwoood
Hmm.. ever heard the CD3000 ?
guys, stop tempting me.

i have been sitting here for the last couple of hours, listening to my system with the PoS monster cable on the left, and the swapped in digital cable on my right as an interconnect.

i was listening to Beethoven's Missa Solemnis, a mass with lots of orchestral and vocal going on at the same time.

what a strange feeling. there are more things happening on the right side than the left side!! and it is very obviously so as well. i can hear things extending further to the right than the left, and also a more engaging sound.

to make sure that's not my imagination, i swapped the two cables, and surely the right side is gone and there are now more things happening on the left.

i am going to trash and burn all my monster cables.

---> <---
post #14 of 43
how much r the Clou red and where to get em?

i dont believe in the cable hype though
just curious
post #15 of 43
"Tomcat has the Earmax I think and loves the BeyerDT770/990 series and would probably call the Senns lean in comparison as well."

TimD is right: That's exactly how I perceive the Senns and the Beyers. Getting the HD 600 would not help at all, I think. The HD 600 sound even leaner than the HD 580, with less bass extension and impact, but a tad more and less controlled upper bass.

The Sony CD 3000's bass is rather flabby compared to the Beyers. The Beyers are really deep, controlled and have great impact. This is especially true for the Beyer 770 Pro (250 Ohms). I listen to maybe 50 % orchestral music as well, and just love how the 770s portray orchestral sounds. This is indeed difficult, because of the large dynamic range of an orchestra and its extremely complex harmonic structure. The 770 Pros manage to portray events throughout the frequency range as a believable and homogenous whole. I'd say the inability of many headphones to properly react to the dynamic changes evenly throughout the frequency range is responsible for this strangely lean, bodyless and artificial hi-fi sound of so many of them. This might not be so much an issue of frequency response (because that is usually measured with a non-musical steady signal) but of dynamic behaviour in the time domain.

The open 990s are great headphones but the 770s are even better at conveying the full emotional impact of orchestral music. With the 770s orchestral sections simply play in unison, with their entries perceivable at the exact same time. And thus, the 770s have bass impact to spare. Their timing in the bass is better than that of most speakers, let alone headphones. As TimD has said: I just love 'em.

I have never heard the RS Grados, but even the supposedly smooth and forgiving RS-1s might be more fatiguing and less musical than the Beyer 770/990 Pros. The Beyers are just very easy on the ears. On mine at least. And since a lot of people perceive the HD 600's bass as deeper and more convincing than that of the RS-1s, I'd assume that the Beyers are easily better than the RS-1 in that area.
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