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Anyone get Frustrated with K1000's-I am thinking of using my K701's most of the time!

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
I have been using the Grace M902 with the K1000's and K701's.

I find the K1000's VERY frustrating. Sometime they sound amazing transparant and "there". sometimes they sound thin sucked out or bright. Sometimes there is too little bass, while sometimes the midbass is over-emphasized-sometimes its just right.

Every angle of the "ear speakers" produce a different sount. Every position on my head, produces a significantly different sound. Whether I have the temple pads fully in or extended, changes the sound.

I find myself constantly twaeking the headphone position. When its perfect, its heaven, but the work to get there distracts me from the music.

I find the 701's much more simple. Just put them on and listen. They have a more "organic" and fuller sound. If the K1000's are positioned right, they out do the K701's, but the 701's are far more constant.

Are there any headphoens that have the transparancy/openness of the K1000's and are more listen and forget it?

I am not a tube guy, but would be open to changing amps, if that would make the K1000's more setup and forget it.

My prior rack only had 5" between the shelves so many amps were ruled out because of their dimensions and/or need for ventilation. My new rack will have 8"? between shelves.

Am I better off with something like electrostatics? However, I cant afford the omega II system. Alternatively, would I be better off in focusing in on the K701's?

I listen about 5-7 hours a week at most and often ledd.

Any thoughts? Have you had similar experiences with K1000, frustrations?
post #2 of 18
Yes, I know what you're talking about. But I think there's one factor you're leaving out: the quality of the recording. The K-1000 forgives nothing, and when bass seems thin, it could be the sound engineer did not do his job very well.

If you're thinking about using a tube amp, I've been taking a hard look at Millett's SRPP ECC99 amp he designed specifically for the K-1000. He's a good designer. You can find details here:

http://www.pmillett.com/ecc99_srpp_headphone_amp.htm

All the parts can be pretty reasonable, except the Sowter transformers which are about $90 each and have to be ordered from England.
post #3 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Erik
Yes, I know what you're talking about. But I think there's one factor you're leaving out: the quality of the recording. The K-1000 forgives nothing, and when bass seems thin, it could be the sound engineer did not do his job very well.

If you're thinking about using a tube amp, I've been taking a hard look at Millett's SRPP ECC99 amp he designed specifically for the K-1000. He's a good designer. You can find details here:

http://www.pmillett.com/ecc99_srpp_headphone_amp.htm

All the parts can be pretty reasonable, except the Sowter transformers which are about $90 each and have to be ordered from England.
Thanks

Maybe you missed something. Even within the same LP or CD, I find that every change in headphone angle or position on my head (even when the angle is constant) produces different sound.

I need a solid state amp. I am visually impaired and getting into tubes would be very difficult for me, let alone DIY.

Jay
post #4 of 18
I have sold the superlative K1000 and keeping the simple 701 with a beast of integrated full tubey amp as the Leben CS-600 and... no more frustrated...

Best!
Nicola
post #5 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaybar
I have been using the Grace M902 with the K1000's and K701's.

I find the K1000's VERY frustrating. Sometime they sound amazing transparant and "there". sometimes they sound thin sucked out or bright. Sometimes there is too little bass, while sometimes the midbass is over-emphasized-sometimes its just right.

Every angle of the "ear speakers" produce a different sount. Every position on my head, produces a significantly different sound. Whether I have the temple pads fully in or extended, changes the sound.

I find myself constantly twaeking the headphone position. When its perfect, its heaven, but the work to get there distracts me from the music.

I find the 701's much more simple. Just put them on and listen. They have a more "organic" and fuller sound. If the K1000's are positioned right, they out do the K701's, but the 701's are far more constant.

Are there any headphoens that have the transparancy/openness of the K1000's and are more listen and forget it?

I am not a tube guy, but would be open to changing amps, if that would make the K1000's more setup and forget it.

My prior rack only had 5" between the shelves so many amps were ruled out because of their dimensions and/or need for ventilation. My new rack will have 8"? between shelves.

Am I better off with something like electrostatics? However, I cant afford the omega II system. Alternatively, would I be better off in focusing in on the K701's?

I listen about 5-7 hours a week at most and often ledd.

Any thoughts? Have you had similar experiences with K1000, frustrations?
I got very frustrated with my K1000s for the same reasons, and they sat in my closet unused for five years. Then I read a review on 6moons.com which changed my mind completely.

It recommended a cable upgrade (Stefan AudioArts Equinox hardwire upgrade) and matching the K1000s to a particular amplifier, the FirstWatt F1 by Nelson Pass. The combination is spectacular! I love my K1000s!

Although I have the K701s and HD650s, the K1000s are my favorites by far!
post #6 of 18
If you are visually impaired, I think you might be better off with your 701 or equivalent (Senn600/650). It won't match the K1000, but would make your life easier and you wouldn't need to mess with the earspeaker angles.

No - there's nothing out there quite like the K1000's.

You can get it recabled and use a better amp - I hear the Grace is not the best match.

Or like I mentioned, just be happy with your 701's. You won't acheive the same level as K1000 IMHO, but you will have an easier time without messing with everything every time you put them on. I myself keep them the same angle all the time.

Personally, with the K1000's you get what's recorded and if it's a bad recording - it sounds bad - while it seems that the 701 sounds good on all recording, which usually means it glosses over the sound a little (I'm gonna get flack for that one).
post #7 of 18
Rob, have you personally heard the K 701's? I disagree pretty strongly that they gloss over the details as I was formerly one of those people who thought mp3's sounded good. Well I am a CD guy now. Hehe. I honestly have not heard the k1000's myself, and judging by what I read they are quite a treat. All in all, I'm just saying that the K 701's are pretty revealing in their own light.
post #8 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by AzNyCans
Rob, have you personally heard the K 701's? I disagree pretty strongly that they gloss over the details as I was formerly one of those people who thought mp3's sounded good. Well I am a CD guy now. Hehe. I honestly have not heard the k1000's myself, and judging by what I read they are quite a treat. All in all, I'm just saying that the K 701's are pretty revealing in their own light.
Opposite here. I was one of those people who thought CD quality would destroy mp3 quality. Then after I got a pretty damn revealing system I found out this wasn't the case.

My whole collection is in mp3s now
post #9 of 18
Jay,

I used to have the Grace 901 that has the same amp as the 902. I had the same impression of the K1000 as you when it was driven by the 901. The problem is that the 901/902 doesn't have enough current to get the most out of the K1000 drivers. Yes, the 901/902 can drive the K1000 to loud volume levels but it will not have much bass and it will sound lean and fatiguing. If you want the open sound of the K1000's but want it to sound warmer and have rock solid bass then you must get a speaker based amp that can provide a lot of current.

The F1 is one of many good amps that will work well with the K1000's. I'm using the Portal Panache integrated amp (rumored to be designed by Nelson Pass as well) with great results. A regular headphone amp such as the Grace 902, GS1, Singlepower, Dynahi, Raptor etc; etc, can't compete when it comes to delivering current compared to a regular stereo amp such as the F1, Panache, Krell, Mark Levinson, Bryston, Simaudio, etc; etc. The amp does not need to be balanced, it just needs to deliver a lot of current. When you feed the K1000's an abundance of current you will be rewarded with greater warmth, much deeper bass, larger soundstage and great dynamics. The difference will astound you. I know it did this for me. I also tried my Mark Levinson integrated amp and I had the same great results. I tried a very good tube headphone amp, the Raptor, but it sounded lean because it doesn't have the ability to supply enough current. The Raptor is a great tube amp and I love its sound with all my other headphones. AKG designed the K1000's to be driven off the speaker taps of a stereo power amp and that is how it should be used.
post #10 of 18
I haven't heard the 701's. I was ready to buy them (got caught up in the excitement), but I heard a lot of "it makes everything sound good" type of statements and that usually means to me that it doesn't reveal the good and bad recordings just the way they are recorded. BUT - I haven't heard them, so I'm not giving a review. I just got that red flag warning, and that's why I didn't go for it.

Also, most of the comparisons are with the Senn 650's (the Senn 600's are better to my ears). Other than a few oddballs who compare it to the Sony R10, K1000, and Senn HE90 - If they sounded even close to those, I'd already own them...
post #11 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaybar
Every angle of the "ear speakers" produce a different sound. Every position on my head, produces a significantly different sound. Whether I have the temple pads fully in or extended, changes the sound.

I find myself constantly tweaking the headphone position. When its perfect, its heaven, but the work to get there distracts me from the music.
Too much "work"? Oh c'mon! It only takes a few seconds at the start of a new recording to dial it in. I only wish all head-mounted listening devices were this tweakable. It is the lack of tweakability that is the weakness of normal headphones, IMO.
post #12 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by robm321
I haven't heard the 701's. I was ready to buy them (got caught up in the excitement), but I heard a lot of "it makes everything sound good" type of statements and that usually means to me that it doesn't reveal the good and bad recordings just the way they are recorded. BUT - I haven't heard them, so I'm not giving a review. I just got that red flag warning, and that's why I didn't go for it.

Also, most of the comparisons are with the Senn 650's (the Senn 600's are better to my ears). Other than a few oddballs who compare it to the Sony R10, K1000, and Senn HE90 - If they sounded even close to those, I'd already own them...
The K701s can compare to the K1000s
They're not as revealing as the K1000s but they've got the K1000s beat in other areas(Versatility, Amp requirements, Comfort just to name the 3 biggies that come to mind). This is from an owner of both who doesn't get the new toy infatuation.
post #13 of 18
For K1000 users:There is an amp, the same one Mr.canman was using to drive his k1000 on ebay UK.

is it called the pass aleph 3 or something?
post #14 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoRedwings19
For K1000 users:There is an amp, the same one Mr.canman was using to drive his k1000 on ebay UK.

is it called the pass aleph 3 or something?
I can't use most of the amps that are suggested because my circumstances require portable amps.

I'm looking foward to my portable headcode
post #15 of 18
I have them positioned so they are almost touching my ears. It is very consistent.
K1000 are very revealing and shows any brightness in your system, even external EMI/RFI if shileded power cords aren't used. Does it make K1000 bad? NO! Fix the problems and you will be rewarded with warmth. However, this is expensive and is only worth it if you listen many hours per day.

I would start with upgrading the cable to Stefan AudioArt Hardwired and get a good solid-state amp.
QuickSilver Contact Enhancer is also great if you want to tune down the brightness and reveal more detail, remember to paste it on the fuses as well because K1000 will show it! I liked it so much I ordered the improved QuickSilver GOLD version. BTW, the GOLD version is 15% cheaper until april 1, so be quick. Edit: They have extended it to may 1 now.
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