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Orthodynamic Roundup - Page 55

post #811 of 21645
8/23/07 at 12:21am
Well, I just did the transplant.

In the original housing it felt like the sound was very congested (close soundstage). Now that they are in open housings, there is a dramatic opening of the soundstage. The bass also isn't as prominent, but the extension and detail sounds great now. I very much enjoy the whole orthodynamic experience thus far.

Also, the swap was almost a complete drop in swap due to the drivers from both headphones being around 55mm. I had to seal the edges around the drivers since there was a 1mm slack so I used some blu-tak to fill that.

another edit: the mids and highs opened up a lot and the bass got a little shy (a bit like a grado but with a way bigger soundstage), any way to boost the low end more? Seal the baffle? The baffle is open but has heavy felt covering the holes.
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post #812 of 21645
8/23/07 at 12:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by FooTemps View Post
Well, I just did the transplant.

.
oh noooooooooooooooooooooooo..... I want to listen to the stock YH-100

Anyway, where will the QP drivers go now, into the Accura's?
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post #813 of 21645
8/23/07 at 12:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioCats View Post
oh noooooooooooooooooooooooo..... I want to listen to the stock YH-100

Anyway, where will the QP drivers go now, into the Accura's?
Actually kev, it's a 100% reversible mod! beautiful huh?

Yeah, I'll probably put the QP drivers in the Accuras now...

wtf did you do with the accura drivers though?
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post #814 of 21645
8/23/07 at 12:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by FooTemps View Post
another edit: the mids and highs opened up a lot and the bass got a little shy (a bit like a grado but with a way bigger soundstage), any way to boost the low end more? Seal the baffle? The baffle is open but has heavy felt covering the holes.
Try putting a layer of felt over the back of the driver.

If you don't have any felt, go to a fabric store and ask for the cheapest felt they have. Try the remnant bin, because 1/6th of a yard is plenty for many headphones.

Or, if you don't have any felt right now, you could try taping over the baffle holes from the inside, or something.

The name of the game is backwave control. Since these drivers are dipoles, they have more backwave than a moving coil driver. So, we need to either slow it down or block it.

The unfortunate thing is that backwave and 'soundstage' are inextricably connected.

So, for all we know, the answer may be adding more felt over the felt already covering the baffle. add it on the inside.

The qp55x gives us a lot of opportunity to fiddle with it. You could try slowing the backwave by putting a layer of felt between the two layers of foam for example.
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post #815 of 21645
8/23/07 at 1:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by FooTemps View Post

wtf did you do with the accura drivers though?
good question dude, they are so big there isn't any foster phone for them, I haven't use them....
The only thing I can think of is get two pieces of exotic wood, each 3"x1"x18" long, bore 6 holes in each wood stick and install 6 accura drivers and wire the drivers in parallel (5 ohm), then you get a pair of "AcouSticks" as desk top PC speakers..... need to work with a powered subwoofer though.

AcouStick, is a Cool stick!


To boost the bass, try 45x housing & pleather pads.....
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post #816 of 21645
8/23/07 at 1:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj View Post
If you don't have any felt, go to a fabric store and ask for the cheapest felt they have. Try the remnant bin, because 1/6th of a yard is plenty for many headphones.
Michael's sells 12"x12" sheets of cheap felt, ie thin, for 50 cents.
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post #817 of 21645
8/23/07 at 1:41am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by swt61
On to damping. I opened the cups back up and cut some smaller diameter pieces of foam to go directly on the White material on the back of the driver housing. I then placed the larger two pieces on top and closed the cups up. Very springy now, I have to apply a small amount of pressure to the baffle to seat it.

The results for the extra foam piece are very good. I guess I didn't have enough pressure where I needed it before.

I'm listening to Alison Krauss "A Hundred Miles Or More" with the results quite clearly evident. The treble seems very similar which is a good thing, but this seems to have helped with the mids a good deal. I wasn't expecting that. The bass is pretty similar, but I didn't think I'd achieve much there. The bass is certainly livable though, just not as deep as the YH-100. But with the mids in their rightful place I'm feeling what you must have been refering to with your "relaxed" description.
Glad to hear that the SQ improved with a bit more pressure on the diaper.

It bears repeating: one's job as the dampista is to make sure no air can leave the back of the driver (hereinafter known as the dampee) without going through the damping layer. One also has to make sure the damping layer can't flap, or compress and then spring back, as the pressure changes with the audio. So the spring, whether it's fishfoam or eggcrate, must be firm. A good rule of thumb is swt61's comment that it took a slight squeezing force to make the two earcup halves mate-- that sounds just about right.

Steve, the T20v2 and T40v1 earcups are pretty much identical, although the earpads are very different. In both cases, though, the earpads are circular. The Mk II versions of T20 and T40 and the T50RP all have squared-off baffles and earpads. So your T40 could very well be an early sample, as nikongod claimed. I haven't noticed any variations in earcup design, graphics or shape within the 1987--2007 generation models. I think there's a date code molded to the inside of the earcup-- see if you can decipher it next time you're inside. We'll compare.

Of course the similarity of the earcups makes it difficult to tell a good T20 or T40 from the tinny-sounding Mk II, so refer back to this post to make sure you don't get the wrong version.

.
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post #818 of 21645
8/23/07 at 1:48am
Seems to me that ear pads and coupling to the head have a big impact on the low-end of the orthos as well as the dampening of the back. Not sure what the design of the MB donor body and pads are like but the front of the can certainly has a large effect on the sound as well.

Speaking of open backs I thought that the 2 pro-30s I have would be the same but no. One has more venting that the other, the ear cap on one blocks completely the inner vents and on the other they are exposed. I prefer the more vented ones of course. It appears that they are slightly different versions, the drivers have different lettering on the back possibly just different production runs.
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post #819 of 21645
8/23/07 at 1:54am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FooTemps View Post
..the mids and highs opened up a lot and the bass got a little shy, any way to boost the low end more? Seal the baffle? The baffle is open but has heavy felt covering the holes.
Yep, it's the old K501 controversy all over again. I'd try sealing the baffle and anywhere else the backwave could possibly leak into the earcup.

Try stuffing the cup loosely with fluffy fiberglass insulation. Wear gloves and a respirator.

It might be necessary to find some flatter, wider earpads (more like the T20v2), though I don't know of a candidate offhand. The idea here is to limit the volume of air the diaphragm has to move.
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post #820 of 21645
8/23/07 at 2:20am
well after some experimentation...

Felt disk between the foam: I think the felt was too dense, the backwave actually bounced back enough to just start canceling out the bass.

Felt disk right behind the driver: even worse, completely sucked out the bass

I am going to either seal the baffle completely or add another layer of felt behind the ports. The sound is enjoyable, but even more bass would make me happier since I just discovered I am a bit of a basshead.
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post #821 of 21645
8/23/07 at 2:30am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JadeEast View Post
Seems to me that ear pads and coupling to the head have a big impact on the low-end of the orthos...
They certainly do. Plus the acoustic.. shall we say permeability of the earpads. Open, porous ones let backwave in and let bass leak out-- fine if you're trying to tame a driver whose bass output just won't quit, not so fine otherwise. Also closeness of ear to driver. Examine your Pro 30s.

Also try replacing the foam on the back inside of the earcup with felt, with foam filling to hold the felt in place.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JadeEast View Post
Speaking of open backs I thought that the 2 pro-30s I have would be the same but no. One has more venting that the other, the ear cap on one blocks completely the inner vents and on the other they are exposed.
Nifty! Any closeup photos of this?


Quote:
Originally Posted by JadeEast View Post
I prefer the more vented ones of course. It appears that they are slightly different versions, the drivers have different lettering on the back possibly just different production runs.
Well, ya never know. Could be a date code, could be factory codes.. Do they sound very different?
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post #822 of 21645
8/23/07 at 3:54am
Version one seems a bit more even across the board version but much more leaning towards an analytical thinness. Version two seems more extended in both directions but maybe has a bit of a midrange dip, certainly sounds more weighty and has a slightly wider more open head-stage.

They both have just a bit of felt added no dots at this point not sure if the small amount of venting would account for as much difference as I am hearing.
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post #823 of 21645
8/23/07 at 10:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by FooTemps View Post
well after some experimentation...

Felt disk between the foam: I think the felt was too dense, the backwave actually bounced back enough to just start canceling out the bass.

Felt disk right behind the driver: even worse, completely sucked out the bass

I am going to either seal the baffle completely or add another layer of felt behind the ports. The sound is enjoyable, but even more bass would make me happier since I just discovered I am a bit of a basshead.
To reinforce what Walt and JadeEast were just saying, try some pleather Beyerdynamic pads on your QP55X housing before too much tinkering with the damping. It should make a huge difference. Also if you have any Equation Audio RP-21 pads try them. They're thinner putting your ear closer to the driver, which seems to help. The velour is just not ideal for Orthos it seems.
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post #824 of 21645
8/23/07 at 10:48am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JadeEast View Post
Version one seems a bit more even across the board version but much more leaning towards an analytical thinness. Version two seems more extended in both directions but maybe has a bit of a midrange dip, certainly sounds more weighty and has a slightly wider more open head-stage.
Hmm. Very interesting. Now that you mention it, I recall going from one Radio Shack store to another trying various Pro 30s, convinced I was hearing slight differences. You're gonna hafta take one for the team and open these babies up and take photos!
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post #825 of 21645
8/23/07 at 10:57am
Is there supposed to be no baffle venting in an ortho phone? I noticed the Fostex T40 has a solid baffle design, and the Yamaha's don't even really have a baffle to speak off (seems that the driver is about as big as the housing). Also, since the damping material is right on the back of the driver to slow down the air coming in/out, does housing style (open/closed) still make a difference?

I got a pair of SFI ortho mid-range coming, but they are way too big (3"x3" square) to put in the QP housings......Kind of forcing me to woody the Accura's for them.
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