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Orthodynamic Roundup - Page 1519

post #22771 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by Creato938 View Post
 

What really scares me off headphones like that are the special amps required to run those, some of them, like the Koss and the Stax, require a really high energy output to run properly.

I'm pretty sure the headphones you're thinking of are electrostatic and electret and not orthodynamic headphones. Orthodynamic headphones, while requiring more current than standard dynamic headphones, can still be run off most any amp with a decent enough power output. Here's my current rig for an example. It's being run off a standard portable amp (granted its the 627 MICRO, which is a really powerful single-ended portable amp for its size).


Edited by BucketInABucket - 4/11/14 at 4:56pm
post #22772 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketInABucket View Post
 

I'm pretty sure the headphones you're thinking of are electrostatic and electret and not orthodynamic headphones. Orthodynamic headphones, while requiring more current than standard dynamic headphones, can still be run off most any amp with a decent enough power output. Here's my current rig for an example. It's being run off a standard portable amp (granted its the 627 MICRO, which is a really powerful single-ended portable amp for its size).

 

I always tought that orthodynamic headphones and electrostatic headphones were the same thing, just a different naming in the end of the day, are there any more accessible orthodyanic headphones?

post #22773 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by Creato938 View Post
 

 

I always tought that orthodynamic headphones and electrostatic headphones were the same thing, just a different naming in the end of the day, are there any more accessible orthodyanic headphones?

Vintage orthodynamics sometimes pop up on ebay, although if you want a good price, you gotta be patient. For a modern offering, the Fostex Tx0RP (e.g. T50RP) is the cheapest orthodynamic series available to the general public today, and many people are of the opinion that when modded they are worth far more than the stock asking price. Several companies such as Mr Speakers have taken advantage of this and set up their own T50RP modding businesses. Here is an example of a drastically modded T50RP - the Mr Speakers Alpha Dogs - that retail for far higher than the price of the stock T50RP.

post #22774 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketInABucket View Post
 

Vintage orthodynamics sometimes pop up on ebay, although if you want a good price, you gotta be patient. For a modern offering, the Fostex Tx0RP (e.g. T50RP) is the cheapest orthodynamic series available to the general public today, and many people are of the opinion that when modded they are worth far more than the stock asking price. Several companies such as Mr Speakers have taken advantage of this and set up their own T50RP modding businesses. Here is an example of a drastically modded T50RP - the Mr Speakers Alpha Dogs - that retail for far higher than the price of the stock T50RP.

 

Seems like they already sound retry nice stock, unfortunately nice headphones are not that easy to buy in Brazil, many models are not available at all here, i'll be sure start looking for Fostex around here, what about the Audeze LCD-2 and LCD-3, are they good as their price tag say?

post #22775 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by Creato938 View Post
 

 

I always tought that orthodynamic headphones and electrostatic headphones were the same thing, just a different naming in the end of the day, are there any more accessible orthodyanic headphones?


here is a great easy overview of

 

dynamic http://wiki.faust3d.com/wiki/index.php?title=Dynamic

 

isodynamic ( orthos ) http://wiki.faust3d.com/wiki/index.php?title=Isodynamic_%28aka_orthodynamic%29

 

electrostatic http://wiki.faust3d.com/wiki/index.php?title=Electrostatic

Electrets are a type of electrostatic that has a permanently charged driver,  whereas non-permanent charged electrostatics make a temporary charge from the "amp" boxes every time and are generally though of as superior  but can also be $$$)

Simply put, each type of electrostatic uses transformers in some way to boost up the input signals from your source, permanently charged driver or not.

 

Quite often the FOR SALE section in here has orthos up for sale  as well as the usual places


Edited by nick n - 4/11/14 at 5:41pm
post #22776 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by Creato938 View Post
 

I've always heard of how good orthodynamic headphones sound, but never got the chance to test one, are they really worth the price and the amount of gear necessary to run one? i'm new to this world of  orthodynamic headphones and modding.

Short answer: Yes.

 

The price doesn't have to be bad, buy fostex t50rp and any headphone amp will do like a FIIO e17. The t50rp are $129 and well headphone amps can be from $30 to (insert made up super large number). The t50rp also needs new earpads because it comes with real thin uncomfortable pads. I have quite a large collection of audio gear but day to day i use T50rp the most. Its like once you uy a pair there is no point in searching for the perfect headphone anymore because they are good enough.

 

Oh and welcome to the forum, i think you'll like it here.


Edited by bootdsc - 4/11/14 at 5:52pm
post #22777 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick n View Post
 


here is a great easy overview of

 

dynamic http://wiki.faust3d.com/wiki/index.php?title=Dynamic

 

isodynamic ( orthos ) http://wiki.faust3d.com/wiki/index.php?title=Isodynamic_%28aka_orthodynamic%29

 

electrostatic http://wiki.faust3d.com/wiki/index.php?title=Electrostatic

Electrets are a type of electrostatic that has a permanently charged driver,  whereas non-permanent charged electrostatics make a temporary charge from the "amp" boxes every time and are generally though of as superior  but can also be $$$)

Simply put, each type of electrostatic uses transformers in some way to boost up the input signals from your source, permanently charged driver or not.

 

Quite often the FOR SALE section in here has orthos up for sale  as well as the usual places

 Interesting how they share the same principle, but work completely different from one type to another, dynamic headphones are the most common type out there for sure, maybe for production costs and low power required to drive them, but othodynamics and electrostatic ones are amazing how they work, really interesting to see different implementation of the same idea, but requiring really different gear to drive and different power output required, seems like orthos are harder to produce, but way more simple to drive.

post #22778 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by Creato938 View Post
 

 Interesting how they share the same principle, but work completely different from one type to another, dynamic headphones are the most common type out there for sure, maybe for production costs and low power required to drive them, but othodynamics and electrostatic ones are amazing how they work, really interesting to see different implementation of the same idea, but requiring really different gear to drive and different power output required, seems like orthos are harder to produce, but way more simple to drive.

Yes it is cool hey.

Think of the ortho as essentially a flattened dynamic voice coil( that normally in a dynamic rides up and down AROUND A MAGNET ) spread out evenly on top of the diaphragm., and held between opposing magnets.

 

there are some other electrical properties on orthos that make them interesting also.

 

They are not subject to the impedance variation ( minor or otherwise ) like dynamics are. Basically some stuff because of the way dynamics are designed can throw out of whack some frequency ranges a bit depending on some things, but orthos have basically a completely flat impedance curve, and are not subject to that .

 

then the Ortho's sonic wavefront that is thrown at your ear is flat vs the dynamic's cone throw which is ( can be ) uneven if designed wrong, heck let's say it is uneven shall we.

 

Orthos are sort of like the middle point between dynamics and stats, can be made to have the speed of stats but with nice tactile bass levels and still keep the speed. Anyhow i could go on but then I leave myself vulnerable to the criticisms of the meticulatists.

 

you could start with one of the GrandDaddies of the orthos, the Yamaha HP-1 ( or HP-2/ HP-3 /HP-50--not mono --- )

HP-1/another variant the YH-1 and it's ilk are pretty easy to open and readily available, and will need some slight modding after you get used to the stock sound.  So long as your source/amp can drive them.( post a query for suggestions for more easily driven orthos )

 

This gets you used to the stock sound... and then toying around with understanding how the front and complimentary sonic backwaves work ( cancelling the frontwaves, tunings etc ), which is the whole point of this thread, don't let it intimidate you, everything can be found in here with asking or especially searching within this thread ( look at the top of this page you will see "search this thread/forum "

 

so basically don't be scared, or intimidated, and best of all have fun  because there are so many variations even within tuning one headphone. it's all a learning process, and especially a  fun ride.

we all have to start somewhere.

 

 

PS i would recommend reading this entire thread, yep a few pages a night , you will get SO MUCH MORE than simply asking at the end. Might even make you an expert after you finish reading...

PPS ignore my early lame postings i find them embarassing, then again it is always a learning process.


Edited by nick n - 4/11/14 at 10:22pm
post #22779 of 23474

Bucket your pm did not arise in my inbox BTW.  Now you need to hit up an HP-1 or similar to compare. I heard from secondhand impressions i trust that the russkies are a bit bass heavy in comparison, but you got those before I wised up and bit on them. Lucky you.

post #22780 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick n View Post
 

Yes it is cool hey.

Think of the ortho as essentially a flattened dynamic voice coil spred out evenly on top of the diaphragm., and held between opposing magnets.

 

there are some other electrical properties on orthos that make them interesting also.

 

They are not subject to the impedance variation ( minor or otherwise ) like dynamics are. Basically some stuff because of the way dynamics are designed can throw out of whack some frequency ranges a bit depending on some things, but orthos have basically a completely flat impedance curve, and are not subject to that .

 

then the Ortho's sonic wavefront that is thrown at your ear is flat vs the dynamic's cone throw which is ( can be ) uneven if designed wrong, heck let's say it is uneven shall we.

 

Orthos are sort of like the middle point between dynamics and stats, can be made to have the speed of stats but with nice tactile bass levels and still keep the speed. Anyhow i could go on but then I leave myself vulnerable to the criticisms of the meticulatists.

 

you could start with one of the GrandDaddies of the orthos, the Yamaha HP-1 ( or HP-2/ HP-3 /HP-50--not mono --- )

HP-1/another variant the YH-1 and it's ilk are pretty easy to open and readily available, and will need some slight modding after you get used to the stock sound.  So long as your source/amp can drive them.( post a query for suggestions for more easily driven orthos )

 

This gets you used to the stock sound... and then toying around with understanding how the front and complimentary sonic backwaves work ( cancelling the frontwaves, tunings etc ), which is the whole point of this thread, don't let it intimidate you, everything can be found in here with asking or especially searching within this thread ( look at the top of this page you will see "search this thread/forum "

 

so basically don't be scared, or intimidated, and best of all have fun  because there are so many variations even within tuning one headphone. it's all a learning process, and especially a  fun ride.

we all have to start somewhere.

 

 

PS i would recommend reading this entire thread, yep a few pages a night , you will get SO MUCH MORE than simply asking at the end. Might even make you an expert after you finish reading...

PPS ignore my early lame postings i find them embarassing, then again it is always a learning process.

 what Nick said.

Once you hear the ortho sound its either you like it or dont.  Some people prefer dynamic because their used to their sound signature.  I have gone from many top dynamic from Sony SA5K, Beyer DT990,D7000 and AT 3000ANV.  Now I listen mostly to my LFF Paradox and Don's modded RP-18.  Both modded orthos.  Like Nick said start with a good stock ortho like the HP-1 or YH-1 and go from there.

post #22781 of 23474

Ohh you scored Don's NAD huh, arrrgh. I haven;t seen any up at all for a while, months and months. And feel free to call me out /question on anything I might say or have said or tried or done, that's also part of this thread, but it's all friendly..mostly


Edited by nick n - 4/11/14 at 10:57pm
post #22782 of 23474

How much are NAD RP going for? some old ebay bids I saw were expensive than Hifiman series

post #22783 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by MuZo2 View Post
 

How much are NAD RP going for? some old ebay bids I saw were expensive than Hifiman series

I sold my mylar RP18 on these forums for about $415. I had gotten them off eBay for about $500.

 

They go for quite a lot when they do show up, that's for sure.

post #22784 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick n View Post
 

Bucket your pm did not arise in my inbox BTW.  Now you need to hit up an HP-1 or similar to compare. I heard from secondhand impressions i trust that the russkies are a bit bass heavy in comparison, but you got those before I wised up and bit on them. Lucky you.

Hmm, I'll resend the PM then. Edit: can't send you a PM for some reason; it works for everyone else but just not you! :(

 

You are right there, the TDS-5M have a surprising amount of bass to my ears. Still not a whole lot to but certainly a good amount for a vintage.


Edited by BucketInABucket - 4/12/14 at 2:16am
post #22785 of 23474
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick n View Post
 

Yes it is cool hey.

Think of the ortho as essentially a flattened dynamic voice coil( that normally in a dynamic rides up and down AROUND A MAGNET ) spread out evenly on top of the diaphragm., and held between opposing magnets.

 

there are some other electrical properties on orthos that make them interesting also.

 

They are not subject to the impedance variation ( minor or otherwise ) like dynamics are. Basically some stuff because of the way dynamics are designed can throw out of whack some frequency ranges a bit depending on some things, but orthos have basically a completely flat impedance curve, and are not subject to that .

 

then the Ortho's sonic wavefront that is thrown at your ear is flat vs the dynamic's cone throw which is ( can be ) uneven if designed wrong, heck let's say it is uneven shall we.

 

Orthos are sort of like the middle point between dynamics and stats, can be made to have the speed of stats but with nice tactile bass levels and still keep the speed. Anyhow i could go on but then I leave myself vulnerable to the criticisms of the meticulatists.

 

you could start with one of the GrandDaddies of the orthos, the Yamaha HP-1 ( or HP-2/ HP-3 /HP-50--not mono --- )

HP-1/another variant the YH-1 and it's ilk are pretty easy to open and readily available, and will need some slight modding after you get used to the stock sound.  So long as your source/amp can drive them.( post a query for suggestions for more easily driven orthos )

 

This gets you used to the stock sound... and then toying around with understanding how the front and complimentary sonic backwaves work ( cancelling the frontwaves, tunings etc ), which is the whole point of this thread, don't let it intimidate you, everything can be found in here with asking or especially searching within this thread ( look at the top of this page you will see "search this thread/forum "

 

so basically don't be scared, or intimidated, and best of all have fun  because there are so many variations even within tuning one headphone. it's all a learning process, and especially a  fun ride.

we all have to start somewhere.

 

 

PS i would recommend reading this entire thread, yep a few pages a night , you will get SO MUCH MORE than simply asking at the end. Might even make you an expert after you finish reading...

PPS ignore my early lame postings i find them embarassing, then again it is always a learning process.

 

it's pretty interesting seeing though this point, what's the development story behind orthos? i always heard that Sennheiser invented them, seems like a pretty big jump in technology to produce them.

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