Orthodynamic Roundup - Page 1420

Curious. Since I am about to acquire a YH-3 and T20 RP as soon as I can get one of my evil minions down to the PO box to pick em up, I am really interested here. I would have thought that software EQing would have introduced some artifacting along the line somewhere. If that is not the case, as you measured, the  and android eq program is going to be very high on my list of "must haves"

 As an afterthought, if in fact this can be achieved by software then it should also be repeatable via a simple (sic) hardware solution along the lines of the device etymotic uses to EQ ER4P's to ER4S spec. This would be a slick way to go as it would leave the phones untouched for resale. Time to start digging around for the old mic's I think.
 

I also did a manual EQ thing. http://www.head-fi.org/t/111193/orthodynamic-roundup/20505#post_8727076 (raw graphs). Same idea - first mod the phones with felt until the sound is decent, then measure the response, remove the mods, and manually EQ the stock configuration until it measures the same as the modded one in frequency response. In the end, it didn't take too much effort to match the responses, and the decay measured much the same too.

I wondered what the point of doing physical modding was when the same could be done with EQ. But I did kinda think the sound was a slight bit more harsh with the EQd version - whether this was real or imagined I don't know. The benefit was that you lost no soundstage since you didn't need to put any extra material into the cups. (Though this raises the question of where the soundstage is if not in the frequency response or decay.)

I wonder if the harshness could be caused by the software delay EQing causes? It could in fact be a very mild artifact?  Really it should not be that hard to smooth out.

 Be a neat idea if everyone could standardize on an eq program and have an online library of settings for various headphones.
 

Hey all,

noticed that the HP-3's (or YH-3's) have been mentioned a few times lately. I recently picked up a pair. Overpaid, but they're in great shape. I've been wanting a pair of Orthos for portable/traveling use. I use a 4th gen. iPod with a LOD running into an AMB Labs mini^3. The AMB drives the vintage Yamahas to adequate volume although I can't really crank it. And, the battery life suffers, but I probably should get a new battery soon. I Also have a great pair of YH-2's that have been modded to great success. I'm just too paranoid to take those out of the house.

The reason for my post is I wanted to share my modding efforts so far on the HP-3's and maybe get some advice for further improvement. (sorry, I didn't take pictures)

• Out of the box (yes, they came with orig. box) they sounded good, but with muddy bass and rolled off treble. Sounds about par with what I've read. I don't think they're the bass heavy one. I also don't feel they're bass light either. Except for the muddiness the bass was just about right for my tastes. Serial 840747.
• The first mod I did was re-cable. Used a mint stock Sennheiser HD600 cable I had laying around. Older version that is slightly thinner and has 1/8" plug. Cut the length to half which is just about right for bus and train riding. Immediately noticed the headphones were a lot less dark. Bass was still muddy, but better. Treble rolled off about the same. What really jumped out was the improvement in the mids (reason for not seeming as dark?). While not profound, it was a significant improvement.
• Next step was some damping experiments. I suspected the muddy bass was due in part to the stock foam damping. Took that out. Replaced with open celled aquarium filter foam that I also used in my YH-2's. But, first I cut approx. 1/4" strips of thick craft felt and lined the perimeter of the cup to dampen the vent holes. If you can picture standing the felt strip on edge and creating a circle. I cut the foam disc slightly over-sized and used that to hold the felt ring in place. Put them back together. Immediately noticed much improved bass with greater sense of space. However, the treble had a harshness that I didn't like.
• Next I kept the above in place, but added a thin craft felt doughnut between the foam and the back of the driver. Back together. Bass got even tighter and had good extension. Harshness to the treble was gone. But now the treble had a hollow/ nasally/ honky quality.
• Next I added a reflex dot (cabinet door bumper) into the concave depression of the cup pivot. I suspected this cavity was causing a weird resonant node. This did eliminate the weirdness in the treble region. Now it's still rolled of, but does sound pretty natural otherwise.

So here I stand. Pretty happy with the sound. Very close to my YH-2's with the exception of the rolled off treble. Don't appear to have sacrificed too much efficiency so still viable as portables. Not sure why the YH-2's don't have as rolled off treble since they appear to be nearly identical drivers. Seems like they should be closer cousins?

Now what I'm thinking is that maybe the reason the treble is slightly distant and rolled off is that the small cup size and untreated plastic surface is reflecting the treble frequencies back and cancelling part of itself out. I asked myself, why would it only do that on the upper registers? I imagined that since the higher frequencies travel faster it is catching up with itself. My idea for a solution is to treat the inside of the cup with an acoustical damping compound. Thinking something like painting "Plasti-dip" on the surface. Since this would be irreversible I thought I would ask experienced Ortho modders if I am barking up the wrong tree?

I had great success using a similar substance on the cups of my Fostex T50rp's. They sound freaking fantastic with lots of shimmer and detail to the high frequencies with excellent mids and realistic bass. None of that hollow/honky quality they had stock.

Thoughts on my plan? Other ideas how to improve the treble of the HP-3?

-Dogwan

WOW! 48 hours later and not one post since mine.

Did I say something wrong?

So unusual for this thread.

Lol. That happens to me too--when I post no one posts after me for like days or never. I often wonder if I've shocked them into silence or if what I've said just has no answer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dogwan 

WOW! 48 hours later and not one post since mine.

 

Did I say something wrong?

 

So unusual for this thread.

March break. Everyone is busy trying to repo their headphones from the kid who commandeered them for the duration.

Purrin has been up to his shenanigans again and kindly brings to us the NAD RP18 measurements. 

The 5K dip is an artifact; he thinks it might be caused by a little ringing. Now we all have affirmation why Wualta likes the T50v1 

..dB

Curiously, the CSD plot for the RP 18 looks not much better than that of the HP-50S measured by purrin. If at all better.

RP18 with O2 pads certainly had really hard hitting big bass but apart from that it did not offer better resolution/definition than the yamaha models. 

I still think among vintage orthos yamaha HP1 is the one to beat. 

The RP18 achieves what few of the vintage orthos do - soundstage. I love my HP50 but the lack of comfort keeps me from using it too often. The RP18 with the right pads ( not O2 ) is very linear and open sounding. I find them to be very enjoyable and if they belonged to me, would default to them for daily use. 

..dB

Quote:

Originally Posted by oyster 

RP18 with O2 pads certainly had really hard hitting big bass but apart from that it did not offer better resolution/definition than the yamaha models. 

I still think among vintage orthos yamaha HP1 is the one to beat. 

I am now using Hifiman pads (Don/RD ganged up on me and made me switch )  with the RP18 and what Don said above is correct - they sound very open & linear now. Not as much  bass as with O2 pads but I do not miss that at all.We should probably set up another meet so you could listen to them yourself.

My yhe50 transplant has also come along very nicely & you would probably be interested in that one too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dBel84 

The RP18 achieves what few of the vintage orthos do - soundstage. I love my HP50 but the lack of comfort keeps me from using it too often. The RP18 with the right pads ( not O2 ) is very linear and open sounding. I find them to be very enjoyable and if they belonged to me, would default to them for daily use. 

 

..dB

For soundstage , yes definitely it sounds grand compared to the very stereo sounding yamahas but the pair i heard did not have linear FR.

The HP50 that Gurubhai gave me sounds so good that i sold HE400 in 2 weeks (Yamahas totally crushed it) & after having heard his HP1 have no urge for getting LCD2 now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gurubhai 

I am now using Hifiman pads (Don/RD ganged up on me and made me switch )  with the RP18 and what Don said above is correct - they sound very open & linear now. Not as much  bass as with O2 pads but I do not miss that at all.We should probably set up another meet so you could listen to them yourself.

My yhe50 transplant has also come along very nicely & you would probably be interested in that one too.

Sure bro. How about next weekend? 

My YHE50 transplant turned out to be a big FAIL!

Having realized i won't be able to do them justice, I'll bring along the drivers & you can make them your test subject