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Orthodynamic Roundup - Page 95

post #1411 of 19957
Thread Starter 

welcome back, orthodynamicisti

Good to be back and once again have news of the great wide world. At the moment the SEARCH function is pretty much useless and many (all?) of the links I've placed in this thread that refer to relevant topics or data in other threads will, as of this writing, take you instead to random places, so if the brave folks who have given us this website can't straighten this out, and they'd have to be crazy to even try, I'll be going back to re-establish those links, so as they say, please be patient. I do want this thread to contain, amidst the party hats and confetti and red rubber noses, an informal yet useful and up-to-date reference, sprawling as it may be.

Some minor news:

Another Sansui SS-100, the headphone that we now know to've been an OEM Fostex T30/T50 mixture and a model for the Soviet Amfiton TDS-15, came up at auction as a Best Offer and ended up going for around $205. Yikes. A German ECR-500, not strictly an Orthodynamic of course, went for a stunning 349 Euros. Doppelyeichs. In other electret news, I now have documentary "proof", in the form of a 1982 Audio-Technica catalog, specifying that the ATH-8 (aka Signet TK33) was indeed a back-electret design just like the Toshiba line.

Ericj and I found independently the hard way that the only isodynamic sold under the various Pacific Stereo brands (Concept, Quadraflex, etc.) was almost certainly the Concept CE-H. Don't ask us how we know.

Anyone made any interesting discoveries? I've discovered that while writing about the T40 I was thinking of the T50RP (!) (and good God, why?) in post 1409, which I've gone back and corrected.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
Whaaaa?! Looks pretty solid to me
And of course it is. Thanks for catching that. Your idea of grinding/drilling out the vents might give us an interesting tweak to try. Theoretically, it would allow the driver to operate in something more like free air, thus tilting the response away from the treble and toward the bass. How much, and whether it would be audible, remains to be found out. My opinion is that the effect would be small.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
By the way, I went by fostex's web store looking for a fresh pair of T20 pads...
Yes, if I haven't mentioned this before, Fostex's online parts store is back up, and though you can't get things like T50 drivers or earpads, you can get cords and earpads for the more recent stuff.

LiteCommerce online store builder - Fostex Headphones

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Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #1412 of 19957
So anyway, i damped my T20v2 based on your recommendations in a post i don't have handy . . .

The flim-flam chamois I can find locally seems to be thinner and denser than what you used. It's nigh impermeable, and Too Much, so i ended up using my black superfelt. I wonder a bit if i should use two layers of it, since the stuff you used was thicker.

so anyway, what you'd suggested was a self-adhesive 18mm reflex dot, fake chamois, 24mm reflex dot (quarter?), and the stock foam.

The results are good - bass is all there and the midrange is unencumbered, but it feels a bit sharp in the treble for me. I may reduce the size of the forward reflex dot.

I got my fake chamois at supertarget for something like $4. I noted that they have three grades of PVA towels now, ranging from $5 to $8. I have no idea what the differences are. One of them is packed wet, like my PVA towel of unknown origin was.

I may go looking for a mock chamois more similar to the material you used, unless you think the superfelt is adequately similar.
post #1413 of 19957
Well all that I discovered in the last little bit was that the P.W.B. Dyna-x when blocking the back wave and adding a bit of dampening to the driver did what one would predict.

"Out the box" they were overly bright and thin sounding but a bit sealing the baffle where they were open thickened things right up. A little felt on the back of the driver and better felt on the out side of the cup helped things as well. I could add a bit of a dot and bring up the top but I'm happy with how these sound right now.

With a tiny bit of blue tac and felt these went from the bottom of the pile to the top.
post #1414 of 19957
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
I wonder a bit if i should use two layers of it, since the stuff you used was thicker.
Nah, probbly not. I have deep respect for that felt. It's Mitey-Dence(TM).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
so anyway, what you'd suggested was a self-adhesive 18mm reflex dot, fake chamois, 24mm reflex dot (quarter?), and the stock foam.
24mm reflex disc, (it's a disc if it's behind the damping layer, a dot if it's on the driver itself) but if things are too bright you can probably remove it altogether. Yeah, your memory of the procedure sounds about right.

Here's that post describing the T20v2 mods.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
The results are good - bass is all there and the midrange is unencumbered, but it feels a bit sharp in the treble for me. I may reduce the size of the forward reflex dot.
That might do the job also. I was shooting for a real 'stattish sound, and I didn't want the AKG contingent to say they weren't getting their RDA of Vitamin Top Octave. Glad to hear you got good results.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
I noted that they [Super Target] have three grades of PVA towels now, ranging from $5 to $8.
In the Automotive dept.? I'll take a look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
I may go looking for a mock chamois more similar to the material you used, unless you think the superfelt is adequately similar.
No, I think you've hit about the same point I did, maybe even a little more damping. If you're feeling ambitious you can try swapping the felt for the dollar-store fake chamois and see what effect it has.

I remember having a heck of a time trying to damp the thing enough to get that midrange hump down. Dang! I said to myself, several times. EDIT/UPDATE: One way around this problem would be to glue the damping layer firmly to the back magnet, which maximizes a given materials damping ability. Of course, this falls into the category of not-easily-reversible mods.

.

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post #1415 of 19957
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JadeEast
Well I discovered that the P.W.B. Dyna-x, when blocking the back wave and adding a bit of dampening to the driver, did what one would predict.
Yay predictability! It's boring but useful. And it also means we're on the right track.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JadeEast
..they were overly bright and thin sounding but a bit [of] sealing the baffle where open thickened things right up. A little felt on the back of the driver and better felt on the outside of the cup helped things as well. I could add a bit of a dot and bring up the top but I'm happy with how these sound right now.
Excellent! Makes you wonder why ol' PWB didn't do those things himself.

I like the term "thickened".


Quote:
Originally Posted by JadeEast
With a tiny bit of blue tac and felt these went from the bottom of the pile to the top.
The whole point of this thread, right there. Gain an understanding of the driver and the effects of the enclosure and suddenly you have control of the sound.

Any photos of the modded finality?

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post #1416 of 19957

Omgwtfbbq!?

Sometimes, a Bellini-framed Yamaha gets dropped. And if you're lucky (YES! Lucky!) it ends up looking like this:



If you're unlucky, the earcup breaks clean off. So, yes, this is the lucky result. But what to do?!

I was recently the victorious bidder for the World's Cheapest YH-1, and this is how it arrived.

I've fixed this once before, and promised wualta that I'd write up instructions on how to fix it. So, here goes an attempt to explain how.

Usually, it's just off by one click or so. This one was off by three.

Start by removing the baffle and taking out the driver, foam rubber, and felt bits.

You'll notice that by fiddling with the earcup you can get it so that the 'cup' side of the socket is shifted to one side mostly, and you can get the bottom tooth out from the wrong channel. It'll look something like this:



What you have to do is get the tip of a very thin blade wedged under the tooth that can't quite make it out of the channel and sort of half-pry it out, letting the edge blade act like a ramp for the tooth.

Be gentle, and eventually you'll be successful.
post #1417 of 19957
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
(YES! Lucky!)
The man does not exaggerate.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
But what to do?!
That YH-1 looks like it needs to be put in traction! But the strut wasn't cracked? it was only the cup with its dodgy little locating tooth/pawl that came adrift? Lucky devil!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
World's Cheapest YH-1
Certainly the cheapest at online auction in the last 2 years or so. It's been hell out there, and now, finally, we're seeing a drop in prices.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
I've fixed this once before, and promised wualta that I'd write up instructions on how to fix it. So, here goes an attempt to explain how.
Eventually, many Orthodynamicisti will drop their beloved Orthos and find themselves in this same predicament. Here's the fix, thanks to the determination of a determined fellow HFer. Three cheers!
post #1418 of 19957
Quote:
Originally Posted by wualta View Post
That YH-1 looks like it needs to be put in traction! But the strut wasn't cracked? it was only the cup with its dodgy little locating tooth/pawl that came adrift? Lucky devil!
Yup - the strut is fine.

From the bend in the cable, I'm guessing that the previous owner lived with the severely tweaked cup for a very long time.

This wasn't stuck as bad as the YH-100 i fixed was, though. THAT thing was pretty well wedged - but the principle of repair remains the same.

So i forget, what was the recommended HP/YH-1 mod? I've started with cheap felt behind the driver and behind the stock foam - the patch on the driver being driver-sized and the patch behind the foam being cup-sized.

Funny thing, by the way, the felt lining the vents in the YH-1 is thinner and fiddlier than the felt that lines a YH-2.
post #1419 of 19957
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
So what was the recommended HP/YH-1 mod? I've started with cheap felt behind the driver and behind the stock foam - the patch on the driver being driver-sized and the patch behind the foam being cup-sized.
Sounds like a good start to me. Tweak the damping with varying sizes of reflex discs, tweak the treble with dots. Not much you can do about the bass except make sure the vent damping strips are in right and see to it that the driver is sealed to the baffle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericj
the felt lining the vents in the YH-1 is thinner and fiddlier than the felt that lines a YH-2.
Yes, I was looking at your photo of the YH-2's interior yesterday and noticed the extra layers of extra-thick felt surrounding the driver.
post #1420 of 19957
So a noob othdynamic prospect, are those Yamaha HP1's worth listening to? How do they compare to your conventional dynamic cans? Normally I would read an entire thread, but um, 142 pages is a bit much, lol.
post #1421 of 19957
Yes, they're worth listening to.

They're more detailed and less colored than most dynamics.
post #1422 of 19957
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by oicdn
So a noob orthodynamic prospect...
Aha. Are you hinting that you've recently acquired an HP-1, perchance...?


Quote:
Originally Posted by oicdn
um, 142 pages is a bit much, lol.
Can't blame you, really. We do tend to go on about it. A one-post overview is here.
post #1423 of 19957
Yup....I'm on the verge of snagging some up, and am wondering if I should really drop the coin.

So, out of a Hornet, it should sound pretty sweet eh? I'm really wanting to give these a listen, I'm just a little hesitant at pulling the trigger without much to read on them.
post #1424 of 19957
Got a quick question, what are the differences between the HP-1 and HP-2 as well as YH-1 and YH-2? What are the differences between ALL of them? Are they all essentially the same phone just different variations/colors?

FWIW, I won these:
Yamaha HP-2 Headphones !!! Highly Sought After !!! - (eBay item 170172316491 end time Dec-02-07 13:03:10 PST)
post #1425 of 19957
the HP and YH lines are identical where their suffix numbers are identical.

The -2 has a smaller driver and thus isn't as good at bass.
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