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Jazz is Dead (Warning: long and boring) - Page 3

post #31 of 186
What I don't understand about stuff like this is why music has to be political to not be "dead." There are plenty of musicians pushing the free-form improvisational style that defines the ethereal borders of "jazz."

Wali, what it seems to me like you might be falling into the same trap that most music lovers do. They want their music to be fresh and relevant, but still sound "like it used to." The honest truth is that in order to be fresh and relevant, the music has to change. Most of the stuff I listen to is happening to the younger crowd, exites them intellectually(though it does not promote any political action) and is usually dismissed by the old-school jazz standards crowd as not being true jazz.

One thing I seem to notice though, albums in a specific genre can only be groundbreaking for so long before a foundation is so solidly set that people can no longer accept further evolution of the medium and simply label the new offerings as "different." Traditional Jazz hit that stage a good 30+ years ago. Looking for more of the same, but somehow revolutionary better, just isn't possible. Instead we now look to phenominal artists and how well they can do with what we all know.

Just as an easy example:
Traditional Jazz:
Michael Brecker - Technical Monstermind sax player, nothing new otherwise

Afro-Smooth Jazz:
Michael Brecker(again) - He and his brother helped turn off nearly every teenage kid by pioneering the sub-genre that most people considered to be "jazz"
post #32 of 186

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Edited by holeinmywallet - 9/3/11 at 2:20pm
post #33 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by holeinmywallet
I think you are somehow mistaken in linking 'heyday' with whether the music is dead or alive....
personally... i don't think the life or death of jazz has anything to do with its mass appeal. i do believe, however, that your assessment of pop music being 99% crap also applies to current jazz. almost all mainstream jazz today is, while technically proficient (even superlative), artistically bankrupt.

i think the fringe of jazz (just as the fringe of rock/pop) is where the art and innovationis taking place. of course, that's going to be the case with just about every creative medium. it's just that jazz is already somewhat fringe, so fringe jazz is like off-off-off-off broadway. 3 people and a lintball on a dog appreciate it.
post #34 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zanth
I don't think Jazz is dead nor even close to dying, if anything it is a young late teen early twenty year old olympic athelete ready to try at another gold. There are plenty of revolutionists going right now, Chris Potter and Jason Moran just to name two off the top of my head, then of course there are the Swedes, some of the best stuff is coming from Europe.
Not only Potter and Moran,who are both brilliant,but you also have medesky martin and wood breaking new ground in jazz.Jazz isn't dead its just evolving.
post #35 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by VicAjax
personally... i don't think the life or death of jazz has anything to do with its mass appeal. i do believe, however, that your assessment of pop music being 99% crap also applies to current jazz. almost all mainstream jazz today is, while technically proficient (even superlative), artistically bankrupt.
Take a true artist like Shirley Horn and «cut and paste» her work with a «Barbie» singer and you have a major business success like the one Diana Krall is enjoying.... (Everyone knows that they are not to be invited at the same party..... )

The actual music industry strategy is incompatible with, as you said very well, the off-off-off Broadway kind of jazz.

Actually it's not that bad in itself. If we realy want to listen to great jazz there is plenty of it around us. One must put his headphones down and go out to the live display of this music. It's funny how we are, at least I am, investing big $ to get at home the digital feeling of what is essentially a living art.

Knowing that so many of these great musicians are not a music industry priority, if someone dont make the effort to go see them in action his picture of the jazz scene is incomplete.

Amicalement
post #36 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Genetic
...It's funny how we are, at least I am, investing big $ to get at home the digital feeling of what is essentially a living art.
so true... and even moreso with jazz.

Quote:
Knowing that so many of these great musicians are not a music industry priority, if someone dont make the effort to go see them in action his picture of the jazz scene is incomplete.
i'm just glad i live in a town with a good scene, and a few reliable clubs where the best out-of-towners are sure to pass through.
post #37 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by VicAjax

i'm just glad i live in a town with a good scene, and a few reliable clubs where the best out-of-towners are sure to pass through.
NYC jazz scene....is there any CD collection that can match that......I dont think so... you're so lucky.

Amicalement
post #38 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by VicAjax
i'm just glad i live in a town with a good scene, and a few reliable clubs where the best out-of-towners are sure to pass through.
Couldn't agree more--the whole "jazz is dead" debate seems kind of strange and foreign living in NY. I see great (and some mediocore) experimental and traditional jazz all the time. I've never bothered (or felt the need) to try to step back and look at current jazz in some sort of historical way--I just love going out and hearing the music.
post #39 of 186
why don't i ever make the time to go see what's out there in NYC? why do i opt instead to just play Warcraft III on the comp? Curse me!
Anyhow, perhaps it's best that jazz isn't even hinted in popular music these days. I think the last time it did was US3's "Cantaloop" - so sad I that I recognized the MC as the intro for Art Blakey's stint on some Blue Note vinyl I have lying around...i thought Diggable Planet's "Cool like dat" wasn't bad either, but Jazz as Sample is about as close as we're going to get these days...
post #40 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jahn
why don't i ever make the time to go see what's out there in NYC? why do i opt instead to just play Warcraft III on the comp? Curse me!
LOL...shame on you...Jahn.....shame on you.

To amend yourself we could declare you our official Head-Fi New York jazz correspondant*.....


Amicalement

* http://www.bigapplejazz.com/
post #41 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jahn
why don't i ever make the time to go see what's out there in NYC? why do i opt instead to just play Warcraft III on the comp? Curse me!
well, now that i have a kid, i don't get out nearly as much as i'd like. more often than not, when i do see music, i end up at tonic on the lower east side.

Quote:
Anyhow, perhaps it's best that jazz isn't even hinted in popular music these days. I think the last time it did was US3's "Cantaloop" - so sad I that I recognized the MC as the intro for Art Blakey's stint on some Blue Note vinyl I have lying around...i thought Diggable Planet's "Cool like dat" wasn't bad either, but Jazz as Sample is about as close as we're going to get these days...
i guess it depends on what you mean by "popular." but listen to stereolab's album dots and loops and you'll hear echoes of quincy jones' big band bossa nova. or tortoise, gastr del sol, dj logic (granted, that's sampled)... and i'm sure others that i haven't thought of.
post #42 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Genetic
LOL...shame on you...Jahn.....shame on you.

To amend yourself we could declare you our official Head-Fi New York jazz correspondant*.....


Amicalement

* http://www.bigapplejazz.com/

That's one handy link! I think I figured out what to do for Valentine's Day!

Iridium
(212) 582-2121 1650 Broadway (at 51st St)
Top internationally known artists often play six day runs, and Les Paul Trio every Monday. Keep in touch with Iridium for their proactive booking policy which adds many tributes and unusually compelling pairings throughout the year. Set Times at 8:00 pm, 10:00 pm and an added third set on Friday and Saturday at 11:30. Minimum cover charge: $22.50 up to $35, with a $10 drink minimum.


EDIT - BAM got reservations! but it's the Les Paul Quintet now for the past 4 years, that site is a tad out of date. And it just got the Wifely Stamp of Approval so we're good to go!
post #43 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jahn

EDIT - BAM got reservations! but it's the Les Paul Quintet now for the past 4 years, that site is a tad out of date.
Now that's the spirit!!!! You already doing good on your new assigment....

Amicalement

EDIT: I hope you realize that I do this for the fun of it. But the fact that you let go of so much interesting jazz is like me, up north, unwilling to take advantage of winter sports.
post #44 of 186
Haha no worries! But I have to say, going out on the town is getting to be few and far between what with the baby and all now. But some days you just have to bust out the romance!

Would it be extremely tacky for me to lug my LPCustom along on the date and beg Les Paul to sign it for my kid? "I swear, it's for my kid!" Yeah, right.
post #45 of 186
yikes... just checked out that website, and saw this:

Quote:
HELP SAVE TONIC!
Since 1998 Tonic has been a haven for creative music. We have helped nurture the vital community of musicians and audiences who keep this music alive. Now we are in danger of closing and ask you to help us keep Tonic alive.
Over the past few years we have suffered a series of blows: our rent has doubled since 1998, our insurance costs have tripled, we’ve been robbed, and we’ve been plagued by the expense of maintaining a building in ill repair – including the collapse of our main sewer line.
Any of these things would be challenging on their own but together they’ve taken a more serious toll and we are now facing the threat of eviction.
A number of outstanding musicians have come forward to help save Tonic and throughout February we will be holding a series of fundraising concerts. If Tonic has been an important venue to you, we ask that you please attend as many of these concerts as possible.

Those who cannot attend but would like to help, please consider making a contribution.

For Tonic to survive we will need to raise a upwards of $100,000 in the next few weeks.

Only with your support can Tonic continue playing its role in presenting this important music to its fans.

Our deepest thanks.
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