Wadia iTransport iPod Dock Gets Bit-Perfect Digital from iPods!

[morphsci]

Originally Posted by townes

I consider the iTransport to be an extremely innovative product. It's like the missing link between the iPod world and the high-end/hi-fi world. Now I can combine the advantages of the iPod, i.e. the user interface (screen, menu, clickwheel) and its portability with the sound quality of my hi-fi rigs.

I will transcode my favourite tracks (ca 6000 out of 25000) from FLAC to apple lossless (that's an easy batch job for the PC) No need to worry about Rockbox compatibility. I will buy a second 6gen 160GB iPod. The first iPod then contains around 5000 tracks (ALAC), the second an additional 1000 plus ca 200 classical CDs.

I will be in the market for two iTransports: the first one will be an additional source to my main rig (aside the laptop with external hd and aside the SACD player). All three sources then connected to a Weiss DAC1 (using a Neutrik 70 to 110 Ohm adapter for the iTransport).

With the second iTransport I can build a bedroom rig: iTransport --> Neutrik adapter again --> Lavry Blue (which I have already) --> STAX SRM-727 and Omega 2. The convenient user interface makes the iPod an ideal source for a bedroom rig. For the main rig: I guess my wife will use the iPod as the only source - she isn't keen at all to use Winamp/Foobar on the Laptop, loves the simlicity of the iPod.

And ... no, I don't want a Squeezbox - I try to avoid a WLAN (keeping electronic pollution reasonable low), ethernet cables across the rooms, doesn't make them nicer too. My DACs are better by far than any Squeezbox

Congratulations to Wadia and hats off!

I guess my only point is that for some of us this is not such a revolutionary product as we can accomplish the same thing in other ways for less money. So lets see, 2 160Gb ipods and 2 i-transports, gives you 320GB of storage for two systems for $1400 unless you want the same music on both ipods and then you only have 160GB. Two SB3's are $600, a Linksys NAS200 is $125, 2 internal 500GB SATA drives are $240 and two external 500GB drives are $320 for $1285. That gives me 2TB of storage and simultaneous access to all of the music from anywhere on the network. Plus I do not have to keep more than one database. The problem with more than one database is not the extra storage but the extra work in keep more than one up to date for me. So I am not dissing your choice, merely reiterating that others may not share your enthusiasm for this product.

Originally Posted by ZephyrSapphire

iPod sharing. Friends bringing over iPod. Don't tell me your friends don't bring over their iPods.

Uhh.. no, my friends usually just bring over some nice scotch Probably because I am slightly older than you.

[jp11801]

Originally Posted by truejoker

there is something that i miss or don't understand ' it say that it have analog output , if so it mast be a DAC in it , doesn't it ?

there is no dac in it is just passes the analog signal from the doc to the analog rcas

[morphsci]

Originally Posted by truejoker

there is something that i miss or don't understand ' it say that it have analog output , if so it mast be a DAC in it , doesn't it ?

Please look at post #66 before you start an (another) arguement

[IvanBarista]

NO More CDs even for Audiophile at home.

[HeadphoneAddict]

Originally Posted by tyrion

Mac Mini/500gb drive/Duet (or pick you DAC) = $1100. It's more than the iTransport with the same DAC but you get 340gb, an excellent, tiny footprint computer. Yes it needs a monitor but if you download Salling Clicker you can completely control iTunes without a monitor. It works great. For an office rig, I would use my computer, external drive and Duet (as an example) = $700
You get 340 gb more and the Duet + iTransport + $850. I guess I could be missing something but I don't get this either.

I forgot about Salling Clicker. I have two licenses, one for the Macbook and one for the iMac, then read the license agreement that one person can put the same s/n (license) on more than one Mac in their home.

This works great with my PDA phone to control my Mac via bluetooth. And, they have a version for regular java phones too, if you don't have a Palm or windows mobile phone.

[tyrion]

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict

I forgot about Salling Clicker. I have two licenses, one for the Macbook and one for the iMac, then read the license agreement that one person can put the same s/n (license) on more than one Mac in their home.

This works great with my PDA phone to control my Mac via bluetooth. And, they have a version for regular java phones too, if you don't have a Palm or windows mobile phone.

I use it with my Samsung Blackjack and it works great. You can use it free for a while but you need to restart it after a certain number of clicks.

[johnsonad]

Originally Posted by jp11801

off course you know the squeeze box has a digital out so for $299 (sb3) you could get to the same place instead of buying another ipod and 2x the wadias. I understand the coolness factor but the squeeze box gets you there is a smaller form factor and the new slim server duet does it with a very cool remote interface.

Originally Posted by jamato8

I just realized this will, could make, transports a thing of the past and so goes all of their problems. No more 3 or 4 thousand dollar transport and the worry about reclocking and jitter problems initiated from the transport. It would be nice to have optical out also and so easy to do.

they are sweeeeeet!

[rodentmacbeastie]

OK, I know everybody is going crazy about this "innovative product!" My I2S hack must be easier and less intrusive than I originally thought. With some othe suggestions in this thread I have realized that the iPod must have I2S and clock output, not spdif. Why would apple convert the signal in the computer to spdif and then back to I2S? It would make the insides tighter and degrade the signal and most important to Apple, cost them more money!

So with a little thought, I have concluded that all this thing is is a dock with an I2S to spdif receiver and an analog bypass. If this truly is the case, a DIY solution should be simple and cheap! Also, if this is the case, take 1 iPod, add 1 Twisted Pear opus DAC and you have the recipe for a simple to make iPod DAC that will cost $200 less and you will have your iPod Transport to DAC with NO spdif conversion. That should give you better sound than doing it the Wadia way! So how then is this a good deal? You can buy an I2S to SPDIF converter for cheap and save $300. Why does Wadia only charge $350? Because they would feel guilty taking more money! Why is $350 too much in my opinion? Because $100 of that probably goes directly to Apple so Wadia can say it is an official iPod device!


If this makes sense to you, post your opinions. I have been looking for the pin layout to the iPod to confirm.

[Vinnie R.]

So with a little thought, I have concluded that all this thing is is a dock with an I2S to spdif receiver and an analog bypass. If this truly is the case, a DIY solution should be simple and cheap!

No, I don't believe this is how it is. The I2S signal is what is fed into the INTERNAL dac of the iPod.

I am pretty sure that the Wadia gets its digital info from the USB port of the iPod's dock. I am also pretty sure that there is no I2S on the dock connector.

I do understand why you would like to tap I2S and feed it directly to your external dac... this is a beautiful thing and much better than SPDIF, but you need to tap the three I2S lines inside of the iPod, drill your hole and make a connector. I2S lines are also delicate to impedance issues, so if they are not kept very short and sweet, the gains of going I2S direct to dac can be reduced.

Also, all I have to say from reading this long thread is that jp11801 is a freakin' SAINT! "there must be a dac in the Wadia unit if there is an alalog output!" I love it! : I am waiting for him to SNAP like a twig

Vinnie

[agile_one]

Originally Posted by Vinnie R.

...
Also, all I have to say from reading this long thread is that jp11801 is a freakin' SAINT! "there must be a dac in the Wadia unit if there is an analog output!" I love it! : I am waiting for him to SNAP like a twig

Vinnie

You got that right, Vinnie. I, too have been waiting for reports of jp's head exploding.

[poo]

Originally Posted by Vinnie R.

No, I don't believe this is how it is. The I2S signal is what is fed into the INTERNAL dac of the iPod.

I am pretty sure that the Wadia gets its digital info from the USB port of the iPod's dock. I am also pretty sure that there is no I2S on the dock connector.

I do understand why you would like to tap I2S and feed it directly to your external dac... this is a beautiful thing and much better than SPDIF, but you need to tap the three I2S lines inside of the iPod, drill your hole and make a connector. I2S lines are also delicate to impedance issues, so if they are not kept very short and sweet, the gains of going I2S direct to dac can be reduced.

Also, all I have to say from reading this long thread is that jp11801 is a freakin' SAINT! "there must be a dac in the Wadia unit if there is an alalog output!" I love it! : I am waiting for him to SNAP like a twig

Vinnie

Blah blah blah... just hurry up and make a portable one already Vinnie!

[johnsonad]

Originally Posted by poo

Blah blah blah... just hurry up and make a portable one already Vinnie!

x2

[rodentmacbeastie]

Thanks Vinnie,

That is what I had originally thought a few posts earlier. Now that I hear it from you I am satisfied that this would be the course of action. Having such a well respected modder confirm my original thought makes me gitty! OK, I guesses that impedance would be a problem... So would you think some thin, solid core wires kept to less than four inches from board to board would suffice? What sort of a connector would you suggest? Would there be enough room to mount a jack or would I be looking at wires just to the outside of the case, then a plug, then to the DAC a jack with the DAC board mounted as close as possible? And finally, how hard is it to find the l/r clock, mclock, and is it the DIN leads? I figure I should take the time to ask when there is someone here that has opened more than one of these.

David

[guzziguy]

Originally Posted by agile_one

You got that right, Vinnie. I, too have been waiting for reports of jp's head exploding.

I've heard that this thread made his hair fall out!!

[Jalo]

From Stereophiles: "I thought it was impossible to bypass the iPod's DAC. "So did we," said Wadia president John W. Schaffer. "Then we discovered the little-known fact that Apple had a process called 'authentication' that allowed mobile electronics companies to bypass the iPod's internal DAC."

"Authentication" refers to Apple's authentication chip, which essentially tells the iPod that it's okay to output raw digital audio or video data to the chip-enhanced component. The authentication chips are only available in Apple products or from products made by Apple-licensed third-party developers"

Am I the only one that read this or am I missing something. It seems the above quote is pretty clear that there is a proprietory chip that Apple can license to a third party to decode the digital signal or allow the raw digital signal to come out of the ipod. It would seem once the digital signal is out of the ipod, the rest is history. Anyone can then convert the digital signal into spdif, optical, usb, or thread it into a dac and upconvert it into high level analogue signals. It seems like it is saying that either the digital signal is already being piped out of the ipod in a coded manner or the authentication chip will signal or unlock the ipod in a way that it will sent the digital signal out.