turntable recommendations?

[joelongwood]

The AR XB is a later version of the AR XA, the major (only?) differences being a cueing lever (nice touch) was added, and the base is vinyl clad, not walnut.
The AR is completely manual.......you lift the arm on and off the record manually......with the XB, you can use the cuing lever for this operation. Not too difficult, actually.
I have a Technics SL-BD2, and in direct comparison to my AR XA, 1961 vintage, the amount of surface noise that is audible through the speakers is unacceptable (to my ears), probably due to the resonances created by the basically all plastic construction of the Technics.
Here's what Stereophile said in a recent issue citing the 100 most significant components of the last 40 years:
[5]: AR XA turntable
Stereophile review: Summer 1967 (Vol.2 No.5). While it was let down by a poor tonearm and cheap construction, Edgar Villchur's deceptively simple-looking turntable created the formula for almost every high-end turntable introduced in the past 40 years: belt drive and a suspended subchassis both provided low-pass filter action to isolate the stylus/groove interface from, respectively, motor- and loudspeaker-generated vibration.
I really don't think you will find a better sounding turntable for around $100.

[daycart1]

At this price point, you are not so much looking for a particular model. What you need is something in very nice condition without too much stylus wear.
If you could find one of Joelongwood's AR well preserved, that would be excellent.

[sleepkyng]

the ARxb is really great, i'd advise you to pick up that one mentioned in this thread otherwise i will

technics are great if you're a dj
but you're not.

cleaning and maintaining a record collection is also easy. you can find gold mine deals at garage sales, tag sales, flea markets, record shops etc. and it's way cheaper.

until my stuff go stolen, i had some of the best jazz records in great condition. For instance: Coltrane Blue Train is probably 12 bucks on cd
whereas i picked it up in good condition on vinyl for $4

if you're really serious about the sound of records and cleanliness i reccommend Gruv Glide.
That stuff is really the greatest cleaner ever. It is hands down the best cleaner. I found a Tom Waits "Small Change" record that had been marred with a razor and bought it for a quarter, used Gruv Glide and damn near completely restored the sound. you really hafta try that stuff to believe it. sorry to rant!

[tk_suki]

I like the input. Helping me overcome my vinyl fears, especially maintenance, and spurring my interest.

As far 2nd hand source quality. I was anticipating the turntable w/o stylus or one which would require replacement. Of course this could be part of the bargain or expense. Would be nice if stylus is in decent condition etc... but main concern would be the rest of the mechanism. Well I need to do some homework b4 I bother you folks further.

[sleepkyng]

Tk Suki,

if you're just getting started, i reccomend getting something that works almost entirely right as soon as you get it.
my first turntable was a Denon DPF-15 and it was great, it was automatic, it had a start and stop button and the only thing i did was add an Audio Technica cartridge, i forget the model, but it's the yellow one and it is the best cartridge for under $100. its only $30 and shames the lower end grados.
some people really dont like the hassel of using a turntable, ie. flipping the record over every 25 minutes, so you might as well not spend too much money to see if you really are a vinyl junkie.
but if you do love it, get ready to spend hours upon hours sifting thru junk stores and garage sales

[davei]

Originally posted by sleepkyng

the only thing i did was add an Audio Technica cartridge, i forget the model, but it's the yellow one and it is the best cartridge for under $100. its only $30 and shames the lower end grados.

This model?

http://shopping.netsuite.com/s.nl/c....it.A/id.222/.f

Can you expand on the "shames the lower end grados" bit?

[JefferyK]

Originally posted by aroon
wow this is the first time ive heard anyone warn me about the technics. ive heard of the problems with rumble due to their direct drive system but i also heard with a little work they could be solved.

what does manual turntable mean exactly? i have to set the needle myself?

Rumble isn't everything. My Technics SL-1200MKII has a rumble spec of -78 db. This is very, very good, much better than any other TT in its price range. (The AB table folks are raving about here, for example, has a rumble spec of -40 db.) Also, keep in mind that most LPs are EQd with a rumble shelf, meaning that they compensate for TT rumble.

To me, wow and flutter is more important. Wow and flutter can be very distracting: It makes the sound waver. The wow and flutter specs for Technics TTs (even the budget SL-BD20 and SL-BD22) are very, very good, much better than all of the $500 and under Music Hall and Project TTs.

People who dismiss the SL-1200MKII as a DJ table need to acquaint themselves with its history: The SL-1200 was developed as an affordable audiophile table in the early '70s. DJs started using it because the motor is extremely durable. To capitalize on DJ interest, Technics began adding DJ-friendly functions. But the basic table is the same after all of these years.

With a wide frequency cartridge that tracks well, you can get very good sound from a Technics TT. Also, you can get upgrade mods for the SL series from www.kabusa.com.

My only complaint about my SL-1200MKII is the mediocre bass response. But this may be caused by my phono stage (an NAD PP-2). Or by the records: LPs don't do bass well in general, due to the RIAA curve.

Here's a good TT term glossary:

http://www.compassnet.com/concept/Glossary/Glossary.htm

Jeffery

[JefferyK]

Originally posted by davei
This model?

http://shopping.netsuite.com/s.nl/c....it.A/id.222/.f

Can you expand on the "shames the lower end grados" bit?

I'll take a stab...

The Grado Black has a wider frequency range than the AT cartridge at the link above, so it will get more sound out of the records. But Grado cartridges, especially the lower-end ones, are notorious for tracking poorly, especially on TTs where you can't tweak the VTF. AT cartridges track flawlessly in factory-set TTs. Personally, I'd recommend an AT cartridge with a better frequency range.

Jeffery

[aroon]

Originally posted by JefferyK
Rumble isn't everything. My Technics SL-1200MKII has a rumble spec of -78 db. This is very, very good, much better than any other TT in its price range. (The AB table folks are raving about here, for example, has a rumble spec of -40 db.) Also, keep in mind that most LPs are EQd with a rumble shelf, meaning that they compensate for TT rumble.

To me, wow and flutter is more important. Wow and flutter can be very distracting: It makes the sound waver. The wow and flutter specs for Technics TTs (even the budget SL-BD20 and SL-BD22) are very, very good, much better than all of the $500 and under Music Hall and Project TTs.

People who dismiss the SL-1200MKII as a DJ table need to acquaint themselves with its history: The SL-1200 was developed as an affordable audiophile table in the early '70s. DJs started using it because the motor is extremely durable. To capitalize on DJ interest, Technics began adding DJ-friendly functions. But the basic table is the same after all of these years.

With a wide frequency cartridge that tracks well, you can get very good sound from a Technics TT. Also, you can get upgrade mods for the SL series from www.kabusa.com.

My only complaint about my SL-1200MKII is the mediocre bass response. But this may be caused by my phono stage (an NAD PP-2). Or by the records: LPs don't do bass well in general, due to the RIAA curve.

Here's a good TT term glossary:

http://www.compassnet.com/concept/Glossary/Glossary.htm

Jeffery

ooo, thanks for the info. this basically resparks my fire for a technics. ive been looking at the sl-1300s and that pretty much looks like the turntable for me. its a lot like the 1200 cept...cheaper heh.

[sleepkyng]

Yeah that's the cartridge

i know the specs aren't as good, but really try A/B with the lower end grados (green/black), i think you'll be really impressed.

especially for a beginner, it's a great cartridge.

as for the technics, i do know that the
SL-1200MKII is a great player, but can you find it for $75?
and the tonearm on the ARxb is crap but it's a great TT to mod.

I'm not saying the ARxb is god's answer for the best TT, but it's a helluva bargain. Also, i think buying an ARxb is a good idea because they have a great resale value, you can always sell one of those for around $100 when or if you want to upgrade (this is not saying that you can't sell a SL-1200MKII)

until i get my sumiko blue point, i've been using the Audio-Technica 71ELC which has been doing fine for me. you can them for about 30 bucks here
this is a great place to get cartridges
http://www.garage-a-records.com/cart.html