Help with correct signal path, please

[davidc2]

At the moment I have a NAD C545BEE cd player feeding an Asus Xonar Essence STX sound card using analogue RCA phono cables. The Essence then feeds a Graham Slee Novo headphone amp which in turn passes on the line out signal to my active desk/subwoofer speakers. All analogue cables. This set up lets me listen to the cd player and web radio broadcasts very easily as everything goes through the Xonar and the Novo and on to the speakers.

Now I want to try a digital approach and have bought a DACMagic dac box and will use SPDIF coaxial cables. My question is what is the right order to chain these components up to get the best out of them? The Xonar card has a SPIDF out (PCM or 5.1, I'll use the PCM), the NAD has a SPDIF and Optical outs and the DACMagic has a load of connections including diigital in and out and an analogue phono out.

What should my signal path be?

Thanks for any help with this.

[roadcykler]

Originally Posted by davidc2

At the moment I have a NAD C545BEE cd player feeding an Asus Xonar Essence STX sound card using analogue RCA phono cables. The Essence then feeds a Graham Slee Novo headphone amp which in turn passes on the line out signal to my active desk/subwoofer speakers. All analogue cables. This set up lets me listen to the cd player and web radio broadcasts very easily as everything goes through the Xonar and the Novo and on to the speakers.

Now I want to try a digital approach and have bought a DACMagic dac box and will use SPDIF coaxial cables. My question is what is the right order to chain these components up to get the best out of them? The Xonar card has a SPIDF out (PCM or 5.1, I'll use the PCM), the NAD has a SPDIF and Optical outs and the DACMagic has a load of connections including diigital in and out and an analogue phono out.

What should my signal path be?

Thanks for any help with this.

Crap, I was hoping there would be an answer. I searched and found this because I have a similar question because I don't know the proper chain from PC to headphones. PC>DAC>amp>headphones or vice versa? I guess I pretty much just outed myself as a severe PC as source noob. Eh, whatayagonnado?

[twylight]

PC-DAC-AMP-phones

or PC - DAC - splitters- AMPS-speakers/phones

[El_Doug]

PC -> DACMagic via SPDIF
CDP -> DACMagic via SPDIF
DACMagic -> Headphone Amp via RCA


seems simple enough

[davidc2]

OK. I have tried STX>viaSPDIFCoax>DACMagic and in parallel CDP>viaSPDIF coax > to DACMagic, then DACMagic >via analogue RCA phono> GS Novo headphone amp>via analogue RCA phono > Active speakers (Razer Mako).

Bad news.

1 - the sound of both sources and particularly the CDP is glassy, a little more sibilant and harsh at the top end and generally confused. Choosing different DACMagic filters made no difference to the basic sound.

2. I was not able to record from the pc sources (internet radio etc) at all because despite a fun packed hour or two of experimenting with different Control Panel>Sound settings for Recording and Playback it was impossible to record from the SPDIF digital out of the Xonar STX.

So I have gone back to the way it was before with a DACMagic sitting doing nothing. Sound is more transparent again and warmer.

I just don't have the technical knowledge to understand what is going on.

Am I right that when I use the CDP's (NAD) digital SPDIF out I am effectively using the CDP as, and only as, a transport? If this is so, why was the sound inferior using the DACMagic as the DAC?

Similarly, when I use the Xonar STX's SPDIF digital out am I bypassing it's own DAC? I thought I was and that there again, the DACMagic would prove at least as effective if not superior.

I am quite ready to believe I am doing something simple wrong but I can't see what at the moment. I even avoided optical cables because I have read that coax gives a warmer SQ. In toto, the set up was pretty disappointing. I find it hard to see how the DAC in a £130 sound card can outperform my £260 DACMagic. There must be some pilot error in there.

Anyone have any ideas?

And to add insult to injury the Asus beta W7 drivers don't have any wave out at all so recording from the net (or anywhere else on my pc) is impossible. I have gone back to the Vista drivers which work with W7 (build 7100) fine and still have Wave Out.

Grateful for any light in my darkness.

[Currawong]

There is a DAC in your CD player, so it can output analogue. There is also a DAC in your sound card and in the DAC Magic. The logic is quite simple: you are using the DAC of whatever device is outputting an analogue signal. Any device outputting a digital signal is not using its DAC, if it has one. This means your conclusions are correct.

I'd give your DAC Magic 50 hours of use to see if the sound improves. Some components change during the initial period of their use and sound less good when new.

[cbbw]

"What should my signal path be?" As simple as possible if quality is your goal.

"in parallel CDP>viaSPDIF coax > to DACMagic" Not sure what the statement 'in parallel' means here.

As El_Doug said, simplify the system to only the essentials, then listen. No extra splitters, amps or sound card.

Later you can see what effect the extras are having.

[davidc2]

Well, I gave it another go and reinstalled everything for digital use as before. This time the sound is markedly more transparent and clearer, and more mellow with little glassiness at the top end. I have no idea why - I used the same connections and cables as before. I did use the phase invert function a couple of times but I don't suppose that could have any effect over the overall sound of the system - both cds and internet radio. I wonder if I have accidentally found a better combination of settings in the sound card driver.

So that's good news and I'll live with this etup for a while and see if the DACMagic changes at all with use.

"In parallel" is my non-tecnical way of trying to say that I was using both digital inputs on the DACMagic.

Thanks for the help and advice.

[twylight]

I hate to say it but I would format the box and try again - sounds like you have been touching stuff in various settings...

I also like to hard set my spdif output to 44.1/16 (which all my music is in)

Computer ->spdif out -> dac magic -> rca out ->amp ->headphones should be excellent sound

Better than the built in DAC? I had to spend $600 on a DAC before it really started to show me new stuff in music. I've played with about 10 DACs under $300 and they all essentially were the same, simply not as detailed as the nicer ones - some were warm, some were bassy, but all were muddy after stepping up the food chain a little more on NOS DACs...

You should be able to use both inputs with no drama...I have heard different reports on how COAX/SPDIF/USB sound...but on my rigs they sound identical (short distance, blue jeans cables)

[davidc2]

Thanks. There's no way I am going to reformat my hard drive just for this! - if that is what you are suggesting. Perhaps you meant something else. If I felt it necessary I might uninstall and reinstall my sc driver but it's working ok now I think - it's just the combination of settings that are not straightforward. As I mentioned in one of my posts, my big concern now is that Asus have dropped the Wave Out in their W7 64 bit beta driver. This is crucial to listening to material on the internet.

[twylight]

Ya I am suggesting a full format. If not use a driver cleaner, smoke all the audio stuff and start over - like a video card swap.