True or False: There're only 4 different drivers in Grado lineup?

[QQQ]

even so, headphones sound massively different to me based on just the materials in the enclosure.

[yep-yep] =)

[J.D.N]

Looking at the descriptions from this website:

STONEAUDIO UK | hi-fi, home cinema, multi-room, design and installation

The SR60 and SR80 are the same apart from the the SR80 has a 4 conductor connecting cable and bigger ear cushions.

The SR125 and 225 are also the same, just that the 225 has 50% increased air flow through use of a better grill and also uses closer matched drivers.

I can't find anything on the higher end cans that would suggest they use the same drivers.

[vvanrij]

My wooden cups for my 325i should arrive this week or the next, now if someone would borrow me their RS2 and RS1's I could compare

[charonme]

if they have the nerve to sell their products in Europe for 2x the US price they surely have the nerve to use the same driver (with perhaps modified housing/cups/cables) and ask different prices for them too

[lmilhan]

Other: We will likely never know for certain.

[QQQ]

Other: We will likely never know.

Hmm, it can be easily investigated. Just gotta have all Grado headphones and loads of spare time.

[xnothingpoetic]

You would need to put all of the drivers in an identical housing, and then give them to headroom/other to measure the frequency response/harmonic distortion.

That is the only way you will ever know- unless you get some crazy inside info from Grado.
Undercover time- ninja style!

[QQQ]

Having two pairs of each Grado and a pair of ears will be more than enough.

[lmilhan]

Originally Posted by QQQ

Hmm, it can be easily investigated. Just gotta have all Grado headphones and loads of spare time.

With all of the anal retentive obsessive compulsives that live here at Head-Fi, it would have been done by now if it were possible to prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Like I said, we will likely never know.

[xnothingpoetic]

Originally Posted by QQQ

Having two pairs of each Grado and a pair of ears will be more than enough.

If housing makes a difference, then you won't know if the drivers are different or not unless you have the same housing, to eliminate any variables.

The headroom graphs would prove, more concretely, if and what the differences are.

Also, headroom already has charts for many grados.

[vvanrij]

He said 2 pears of EACH grado, so that would mean he could swap the houses. I'm still open for my suggestion :P just send me your RS1's

[lmilhan]

Originally Posted by QQQ

Having two pairs of each Grado and a pair of ears will be more than enough.

That would prove absolutely nothing, and thinking it would is naive at best. Simply using one's ears would not be enough to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that the drivers are identical (or not). The only thing it would prove is just how different everyone's ears are, and it would ultimately be an exercise in futility.

It would have to be proven in a scientific manner, such as using the equipment that Headroom uses to measure Headphones for Frequency Response, and Harmonic Distortion, for example. Then you would need to make sure that you have a large enough sample size of each of the various drivers in order to achieve any results that are significantly significant (it is well known that Grado labs have been known to swap parts and pieces of different model headphones around when there are parts shortages). And finally you would need some sort of a baseline test that wouldn't taint the results. So there would need to be a way to test all of the drivers independently of their respective Headphone earcups and housings. All of which would be a large, costly and time consuming experiment.


Alternatively, I suppose you could kidnap John or Joe Grado and interrogate them until they tell you the truth. But I have a feeling they would be willing to take this particular secret to their graves. Just an F.Y.I - this method would most definitely get you some serious jail time - you've been warned.


The "Do all Grado headphones use the same drivers?" question is just another one of those Head-Fi Enigmas that we will probably never get an answer for - much in the same way that no one has ever been able to scientifically prove if "Burn in" makes any real sonic difference or not...

[vcoheda]

the RS1/RS2 sound *very* similar. i suspect the drivers are the same here. my woody 325 definitely sounds different from either of them. could still be the same driver though.

[Duggeh]

Originally Posted by QQQ

1. IGrado, SR-60, Sr-80.
2. SR-125, SR-225.
3. SR-325, RS-2, RS-1.
4. GS-1000.
And sonic differences between models with same drivers are due to enclosure differences and pads.
Is this true??

Why do you ask? And why do you divide along the lines that you do? Why not say that the iGrado to the SR-325i use the same driver, the RS-2 and RS-1 use the same driver and the PS-1 and the GS-1K use the same driver?

Originally Posted by QQQ

The question is-how massive is this tweaking, maybe it's to the point where it can't be even considered same driver anymore

Do you need to replace the handle or the head, or both, before its a different broom?

Originally Posted by charonme

if they have the nerve to sell their products in Europe for 2x the US price they surely have the nerve to use the same driver (with perhaps modified housing/cups/cables) and ask different prices for them too

Excellent, insightful, penetrative and wholly endearing first post. Welcome. ¬_¬


To add my pennyworth, the housing does make a huge difference to the sound of a driver. Such we well know from say, the Lambda vs the Sigma, or the HF-1 vs the HHF-1.

Where does this suspicion of the Grado drivers originate from? Grado drivers between models look just as similar as drivers between Sennheiser models (HD650/HD600) or even the similarities between drivers from different manufacturers (Goldring DR-100 driver, PX100 driver, Mellow MH-1 driver, KSC-75 driver).

What seems to set people off about Grado is two things, firstly this ongoing myth, goodness knows where it originally came from, that there must be some kind of same driver conspiracy at work, fuelled as it is by the fact that the drivers in Grado headphones are not as readily accessible and therefore less easily scrutinised as those from other headphones.

The Edition 9 uses the same driver as other Ultrasone models a fraction of the price. Surely then its easy enough to carve out a piece of wood to match the Edition 9 housing, slap in that driver from the cheaper model and presto, $1500 dollar headphone.

Same for the Stax 4070, DIY yourself a damped cup the same size, slap a SR-404 driver in there and bam there you go.

The point is that, irrespective of what drivers are used where and in what configurations, the sound, for people who listen to these headphones, changes, and they pay for these changes.

If grado came out and said, yes, we use the same driver for XXX and XXX and XXX, or for all of YYY. What would be the reaction? Those who love to slam them for their overseas pricing and their apparent shadiness to this point will go to town crucifying them for conning people for years, not dissimilarly to what happened when someone took apart the RA-1 amp, and throwing the irate rant about rip offs and profiteering, and I'd bet right now that most of those people either wont own a Grado product at all, or wil have perhaps previously owned a low end model.

If Grado never made such an announcement, they continue to get the squinty eye probing them, and the flapping mouth making claims which end up becoming unofficial fact just because they're flapped so often.

Lose-Lose for Grado it would seem.

[vvanrij]

Originally Posted by lmilhan

(it is well known that Grado labs have been known to swap parts and pieces of different model headphones around when there are parts shortages

Wh..wha..whaatt?? I hope this only applies for higher end to lower end (would explain why my 325i doesn't sound even close to piercing highs etc.), but I would be well #!$@&^$ if I had a sr60 driver in mine.