The "truth" about different speaker cables

[Gundogan]

Well, with 100%, you can suspect (more than a 'normal' result) something went wrong with the actual test or subject that made the subject choose one of the cables based on something other than the actual difference (or lack of).

And like I said, 100% is not needed to conclude a difference from an ABX test.

[johnwmclean]

Originally Posted by Gundogan

Well, with 100%, you can suspect (more than a 'normal' result) something went wrong with the actual test or subject that made the subject choose one of the cables based on something other than the actual difference (or lack of).

And like I said, 100% is not needed to conclude a difference from an ABX test.

Cool, I’ll take the lamp cord.

[sanderx]

Originally Posted by Gundogan

100% accuracy is not needed to determine a statistical significant difference: ABX test - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. I would find a result of 100% rather suspiscious actually

If you have a faulty cable that you can measure as being faulty and likely to give very audible differencies, why would you consider the 100% result suspicious?

If you have 2 cables, one with capacitance of 30pF/m and another with 300pF/ m then its just a matter of cable length as to when one of them runs into issues with what the amplifier can drive and audible artifacts. Its the "any distortion we can measure or calculate is lower than ever demonstrated to be audible" where abx normally comes in...

Unfortunately people have very little idea just how wrong a cabling would need to be to give likely to be audible differences.

[sanderx]

Originally Posted by johnwmclean

Cool, I’ll take the lamp cord.

Do you have any other complaints besides being unshielded that you have against lamp cords? The ones that do actually have copper conductors inside, that is.

[JaZZ]

Originally Posted by sanderx

Unfortunately people have very little idea just how wrong a cabling would need to be to give likely to be audible differences.

I don't think that's the issue. I for one am aware of the theoretical considerations about cables and the little measuring differences among them (the same applies to amps and sources, BTW). But some people – including myself – just leave theory aside and focus on the sound (in a relaxed real-world situation, nota bene).
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[Bullseye]

Originally Posted by sanderx

If you have a faulty cable that you can measure as being faulty and likely to give very audible differencies, why would you consider the 100% result suspicious?

If you have 2 cables, one with capacitance of 30pF/m and another with 300pF/ m then its just a matter of cable length as to when one of them runs into issues with what the amplifier can drive and audible artifacts. Its the "any distortion we can measure or calculate is lower than ever demonstrated to be audible" where abx normally comes in...

Unfortunately people have very little idea just how wrong a cabling would need to be to give likely to be audible differences.

It is written on the article. If I remember correctly they gave an example when unless the cable was 3 Km long you would not notice anything...

[Gundogan]

Originally Posted by sanderx

If you have a faulty cable that you can measure as being faulty and likely to give very audible differencies, why would you consider the 100% result suspicious?

If you have 2 cables, one with capacitance of 30pF/m and another with 300pF/ m then its just a matter of cable length as to when one of them runs into issues with what the amplifier can drive and audible artifacts. Its the "any distortion we can measure or calculate is lower than ever demonstrated to be audible" where abx normally comes in...

Unfortunately people have very little idea just how wrong a cabling would need to be to give likely to be audible differences.

Well, suspicious only means you might want to check the actual test for errors for example. If nothing wrong with it and the 100% result stays, its okay.
100% scores are unlikely (over a large number of subjects), but can happen ofcourse.

[sanderx]

Originally Posted by Bullseye

It is written on the article. If I remember correctly they gave an example when unless the cable was 3 Km long you would not notice anything...

You can do things to the cabling that would have effects over shorter distances. You know, if you take a knife to it or degrade the contacts etc Maybe we should start a myth that curly headphone cords degrade sound quality due to being air core inductors Which they of course are.

[DoYouRight]

lol, this is rediculous. Those who feel its ok to throw away money, let them do it. For those who understand and have known or have family members who are audiophiles who know it is bunk, we have more money for source, can upgrades than "magic cables"

[JaZZ]

Originally Posted by DoYouRight

lol, this is rediculous. Those who feel its ok to throw away money, let them do it. For those who understand and have known or have family members who are audiophiles who know it is bunk, we have more money for source, can upgrades than "magic cables"

Yes, you are in a really comfortable position, the more so if all amps and souce devices sound the same to you as well. Saves you a lot of money.
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[DoYouRight]

amps, sources sound different, though volume matching is helpful for those that are harder to distinguish. the cable thing is really not worth it, you might hear a slight difference, but it's purely random and not worth 4,000$usd for 1% difference.

[JaZZ]

Originally Posted by DoYouRight

The cable thing is really not worth it, you might hear a slight difference, but it's purely random and not worth $4,000 for 1% difference.

Thanks! Luckily I just paid ~$1500 for 0.5% difference so far.
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[ert]

I thought this was interesting (old): A Spat Among Audiophiles Over High-End Speaker Wire

I'm currently on the fence. On one hand, we have an abundance of literature that suggests there is little effect of cables on signals in the audible frequency band in addition to literature that illustrates the existence of psychosomatic/neurological effects (placebo). Combine this with the apparent lack of evidence from cable makers to support their claims and one can't help but have a healthy basis for skepticism.

On the other, there is also evidence that people perceive sensory inputs in a vast number of interesting ways, including pathologies like being able to "taste" colors. It's also suspected that early exposure to musical training changes the brain structure in ways different from non-musicians, based on observable differences in the gross anatomy of the brains of musicians and non-musicians. It's therefore possible that some people may in fact be able to perceive subtle differences in cable designs in ways that scientific theory is unable to explain.

There's a remarkable similarity between the marketing of cables and dietary supplements. Now I think I'll go admire my silver cables while drinking some Ginko Biloba tea.

[ert]

Worth a chuckle: PSW Recording Forums: Brad Blackwood => Transparent Audio, meet Dr. Zobel of Bell Labs...

[bixby]

This is great that this discussion is in the science section. And sometimes science just can't explain it.

I have a new Benchmark Dac1 that I am evaluating and threw an aftermarket power cord on it. The difference in my system was readily apparent and to the better.
I would dare anyone with a functioning set of ears to listen to it with the stock cord and the aftermarket cord and tell me they do not hear a difference!

Really! ( Seth Meyers, style ) you guys spend untold amounts on components because they sound better (different) to you. It is no different with wire. Although, I will admit the differences generally are small, but noticeable to one familiar with the sound of their own system.

Maybe science will let us know someday why a Stradivarius violin sounds different (better) than other violins. So far they only have theories. And if you don't think there is any difference since "they use the same stuff to make em", then ask a violin player.

I wish science could give us more answers............It is kind of like doctors, they "practice" medicine. I wish they had all the scientific answers. And the drug companies, there is some good science .........the side effects of most of the drugs they push is worse than the condition they are trying to treat.

Let's hope someday that science can reveal what we hear, but so ar all we have is simple ohms law. We are discovering new things every day and perhaps some day we will discover what makes us here these differences...............or not.