Smyth SVS Realiser Virtual Surround Technology for Headphones

[immtbiker]

I'm in like Flynn.

[wavoman]

banjo, maybe don't write off the beyer so quick. u certainly can personalize it the old fashioned way by listening, adjusting the parameters via the laptop, and so on. having a remote control to switch between the headphones and the speakers would make it painless, and lots of options for that.

remember it DOES have the head turn sensor, DOES compute the same transfer functions, and is shipping now without making u buy stax. I dunno ... wish we could do a bake off at a meet somewhere .. once smyth is shipping we can do that.

i agree that the in-ear mikes are way cool and that smyth is better overall, but maybe not by as much as we think. after all, the setup process is done just once at home

[wavoman]

more for eric and boze --

i did the full demo, and i believe they manually moved from one step of the calibration to the next, so "pause" is no issue. move the speaker(s), turn around, whatever. this is a fantastic feature -- finally i can get full surround sound for DVD moives without once having to build a real rear-speaker set-up -- just spill the wires across the floor, which the wife won't allow as a permanent set-up, but for one-time calibration this is super.

center speaker trick is even cuter --smyth said PUT THE SPEAKER SMACK IN FRONT of the TV screen, blocking it!

Of course you can't watch that way, but for calibration this is delicious -- when u listen with the phones the center channel will come RIGHT FROM the TV, not above or below.

Miracle!

[Edwood]

I've contacted Mike Smyth at Smyth Research about getting a small meet together at their place in Camarillo, CA.

Will update as the time gets closer, so I'd like to figure out what would be a good day (some time in the summer) to have this meet.

Visiting wouldn't be a problem - just arranging the best date is the issue.
This is our concept for a local Head-fi meet based around surround sound headphones and technologies.

1. 10-20 people
2. over a weekend - 2 days if necessary
3. we''ll supply pizza and beers
4. SVS demos (naturally)
5. demos of other surround gear if possible eg Dolby Headphone, Beyerdynamic Headzone, DTS Surround Experience, SRS, Hearo 777/888/999, multidriver headphones, whatever is out there and people bring with them and want to try out....
6. Date - in the summer - June, July, August .. to be decided

In other words, just try to thrash out what actually works/doesn't work/doesn't well so well. We're fairly confident in our own technology, and so don't have any problems in any type of A/B comparison. but we also understand that there is a fair amount of skepticism in the whole concept of surround sound with just two drivers, so we're willing to try to educate whilst demonstrating.

And it's never been done before, so that's cool also.Anyway, the whole idea sounds like it could be a real blast. So we're up for it. Is this what you had in mind? or were you thinking more of a straight SVS type demo? We're easy either way.

So who's interested?

-Ed

[lan]

Originally Posted by Edwood

So who's interested?

-Ed

*Raises hand* but I'm no where near there though.

[Edwood]

Originally Posted by lan

*Raises hand* but I'm no where near there though.

Heheh, you can always crash at my place if you fly out here.

-Ed

[wavoman]

I'm in if it's in August, and we get plenty of notice so the filghts won't be too expensive (I'm flying from Newark). I plan to buy a Beyer Headzone before then and will bring it and a laptop ... all subject to approval by the management of the household, as always.

The A-B test will give new meaning to the expression "head to head comparison"!

I gotta believe Smyth Bros have a Headzone, the similarities (after the measurment step) are remarkable.

Of course part of the issue is how SVS sounds with OUR HPs, not their Stax, so I assume others will bring plenty of great gear.

[Edwood]

Originally Posted by wavoman

I'm in if it's in August, and we get plenty of notice so the filghts won't be too expensive (I'm flying from Newark). I plan to buy a Beyer Headzone before then and will bring it and a laptop ... all subject to approval by the management of the household, as always.

The A-B test will give new meaning to the expression "head to head comparison"!

I gotta believe Smyth Bros have a Headzone, the similarities (after the measurment step) are remarkable.

Of course part of the issue is how SVS sounds with OUR HPs, not their Stax, so I assume others will bring plenty of great gear.

LOL, if you're going to be that hardcore, I might as well make it a real SoCal Head-Fi meet. Perhaps a two parter, one day at Smyth Research, the next day a regular Head-Fi meet. Or vice versa.

-Ed

[wavoman]

Hardcore? I dunno ... it's just this SVS thing has now gotten under my skin and I want to find out what's what.

I was uninformed when I gushed ... now that (with the help of this thread) I have researched the subject better, I have come up with many papers, patents, products etc. all right on point but non-Smyth.

You hit the nail on the head in an earlier post -- it's about execution. Smyth has not really done anything breathtakingly original, even the mikes in the ears, the head tracking, etc. -- all done in labs and such before, and partially in commercial products too.

But they may be the first to put it all together in one viable, for-real product, and that says a lot.

We need the big bake-off.

Taking measurements with a KEMAR head dummy (Knowles Electronics) and a great speaker set-up would work for me, I don't need to customize to my speaker system and exact hearing ... why would I care? ... I just want spatial 2 and 5 channel sound from HPs. I am not trying to re-create anything (except the original source).

Yes we need some way to adjust and personalize the DSP effectively; maybe Beyer Headzone gives us that and maybe the Sony DS8000 doesn't, and of course we need the head-tracking, which eveyone has, it turns out.

I have already looked up hotels in Camarillo, and have driving directions from LAX. Now I have to talk the wife into letting me buy the Headzone.

[Edwood]

LOL, save your money for the SVS box.

-Ed

[wavoman]

Seriously, how will we A-B if no one has a BD Headzone? Do the Smyth's cop to having one?

I can always sell it on eBay!

Also seriously -- using my laptop to adjust the DSP sounds cool.

[nicolasb]

Originally Posted by wavoman

Taking measurements with a KEMAR head dummy (Knowles Electronics) and a great speaker set-up would work for me, I don't need to customize to my speaker system and exact hearing ... why would I care? ... I just want spatial 2 and 5 channel sound from HPs. I am not trying to re-create anything (except the original source).

You may not care about recreating a specific speaker system, but you certainly should care about tuning the system to your own ears. SVS's ability to be customised for an individual user's ears is precisely the reason why it sounds better than its rivals. If it is customised to someone else's ears it cannot possibly sound anywhere near as good.

It is unfortunate, but unavoidable, that it is impossible to reproduce the effect of your ears without also reproducing the effect of the listening room and speakers that you callibrate with.

Originally Posted by bozebuttons

I asked this question on sunday ,The answer is yes you can set the system up un a 2 channel system. First you calibrate facing the front speakers & then turn around with your back to the speakers to calibrate as if you had rear speakers,it also works in a center channel somehow,even if you don't have one.

That would completely screw up the simulated room acoustics, though. If you play a stereo signal over your front speakers while facing towards the back of the room, it doesn't sound the same as it would if you play the same sound over your back speakers while facing forward. You're in a different position relative to the speakers (maybe), and the speakers are definitely in a different position relative to the walls and any and all sound-reflecting or sound-diffusing materials in the listening room.

[Erik Garci]

Originally Posted by nicolasb

That would completely screw up the simulated room acoustics, though. If you play a stereo signal over your front speakers while facing towards the back of the room, it doesn't sound the same as it would if you play the same sound over your back speakers while facing forward.

Obviously it doesn't sound the same, but I don't think it would "screw up" anything. As I understand it, the SVS box simulates the room acoustics for each speaker channel independently, so adding virtual back speakers by turning around would not cause any degradation to the virtual front speakers. In other words, the SVS box would still simulate the virtual front speakers just as well as if you did not add any back speakers.

[909]

Originally Posted by Edwood

I've contacted Mike Smyth at Smyth Research about getting a small meet together at their place in Camarillo, CA.

Will update as the time gets closer, so I'd like to figure out what would be a good day (some time in the summer) to have this meet.

Visiting wouldn't be a problem - just arranging the best date is the issue.
This is our concept for a local Head-fi meet based around surround sound headphones and technologies.

1. 10-20 people
2. over a weekend - 2 days if necessary
3. we''ll supply pizza and beers
4. SVS demos (naturally)
5. demos of other surround gear if possible eg Dolby Headphone, Beyerdynamic Headzone, DTS Surround Experience, SRS, Hearo 777/888/999, multidriver headphones, whatever is out there and people bring with them and want to try out....
6. Date - in the summer - June, July, August .. to be decided

In other words, just try to thrash out what actually works/doesn't work/doesn't well so well. We're fairly confident in our own technology, and so don't have any problems in any type of A/B comparison. but we also understand that there is a fair amount of skepticism in the whole concept of surround sound with just two drivers, so we're willing to try to educate whilst demonstrating.

And it's never been done before, so that's cool also.Anyway, the whole idea sounds like it could be a real blast. So we're up for it. Is this what you had in mind? or were you thinking more of a straight SVS type demo? We're easy either way.

So who's interested?

-Ed

got my field trip permission slip signed!

probably could even bring two or three friends...

can we do this soon? i am very eager to hear it.

[Edwood]

One thing I want to try with the Smyth SVS is to turn off all the EQ they had with the system trying to match the sound quality of the speakers they had there. It made the K1000's and Triple.Fi's sound extremely shrill and bright.

I want the surround effects, but I don't want the overall tone and frequency response of the sound changed, as my goal is not to match the overall performance of my speakers, I want the surround sound virtual speaker location effects. My headphones sound a lot better than my speakers. I really am curious what they would sound like in surround sound.

-Ed