UPDATED 2/22 REVIEW 13 USB DAC amp - Predator, Pico, 2/3MOVE, D10 D3 D2 Viper/Boa D1, Lyrix, MicroAmp, Vivid V1, Nuforce, XM5

[manuel74]

Hi HeadphoneAddict,
so have you tried the D10 with HD800 ?
Do you find it good ?

bye
Manuel

[DoYouRight]

those phones are notorious for lean bass, so are all AKG's. There is no REAL way to change that, some very expensive amps can try. But you might want to try a pair of beyer DT880s

[aamefford]

Originally Posted by V-DiV

I ordered a Pico DAC/amp yesterday. Can't wait to take it "on the road" with my ESW10JPNs to get back the sound that I am missing playing music straight out of my MacBook Pro. Thanks again for all of the reviews and advice.

A fine, fine choice! That is my preferred set up as well.

[HeadphoneAddict]

Originally Posted by hesselh

Hi, i am struggling what dac/amp combi to buy for my AKG k271 Mkii. The akg is somewhat "lean" in the bass department. If i look at size i like the nuforce icon mobile, but will it work with my AKG?
The ibasso looks like the winner, and probably also sounds as one, but my wife will kill me if i spend 275 again on a "gadget" :-)
Oh one more thing, i will hook it up to macbook pro and ipod 5.5g (thats why i think i need the dac)

Please advise,

Hessel

I do NOT think the Nuforce would be the best match for those. The D2 Boa is more likely the better choice for it's warmer sound signature and bass, and wont cost as much as the D10. The iBasso T4 would probably also sound good with the AKG, is smaller and flatter like the Nuforce, but it lacks a DAC. I think the D2 boa sounds a little better than the T4 anyway, but I mention it as an option - even though it is for IEM it can actually do a decent job with some full size phones (better with AKG701, RS-1 and ESW10JPN than Denon D2000 which need more current).

[hesselh]

Thanks for the advise, i will take a serious look at the D2 boa and have some serious thoughts about spending €100 more on the D10 otherwise it will keep resonating in my head... :-)
I love this forum, and most of all comforting that i am not alone in this headphone madness.

[HeadphoneAddict]

Originally Posted by manuel74

Hi HeadphoneAddict,
so have you tried the D10 with HD800 ?
Do you find it good ?

bye
Manuel

I find the D10 with AD744 output-bypassed class-A biased opamps and EL8201 buffers to sound fantastic with my HD800. The opamps cost about $65 from Hiflight if you PM him. The sense of space and depth and detail is great, and it sounds very transparent yet musical, even with USB instead of optical.

The only issue is volume levels. It will not play nearly as loud as the Amphora, 3MOVE or Vivid V1, which means some people wont be happy. At normal listening levels between medium and loud volumes, the volume knob is at 2:30 to 3:00 o'clock in high gain, with some slight soft clipping starting after that depending on the recording (could be clipping at 4 o'clock, or clean all the way to 5 o'clock). So, how loud it goes definitely depends on the recording. With infected mushroom "Dancing with the Kadafi" it clips after 3 o'clock and is not loud enough to jam to, but with Batman Begins soundtrack 3 o'clock is fairly loud and clean. I can also get it to play more than loud enough with most of my Jazz recordings (Tord Gustavson Trio or Eva Cassidy "Live at Blues Alley" for example).

[LevA]

Hi HeadphoneAddict,

I'm about to order topkit from hi-flight but want to get your idea. which would be a better option for esw10's? original topkit (743/8616) or Class A 743/8616 or the AD744 OBCA with with EL8201 ??
I mainly want it for clasical and jazz music. so looking for nice soundstage and depth - I don't like too upfront sound, I prefer some distance from the music. At the moment happy with the orginal sound signiture but anything to improve it would be nice.

thanks for all your help.

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict

I find the D10 with AD744 output-bypassed class-A biased opamps and EL8201 buffers to sound fantastic with my HD800. The opamps cost about $65 from Hiflight if you PM him. The sense of space and depth and detail is great, and it sounds very transparent yet musical, even with USB instead of optical.

The only issue is volume levels. It will not play nearly as loud as the Amphora, 3MOVE or Vivid V1, which means some people wont be happy. At normal listening levels between medium and loud volumes, the volume knob is at 2:30 to 3:00 o'clock in high gain, with some slight soft clipping starting after that depending on the recording (could be clipping at 4 o'clock, or clean all the way to 5 o'clock). So, how loud it goes definitely depends on the recording. With infected mushroom "Dancing with the Kadafi" it clips after 3 o'clock and is not loud enough to jam to, but with Batman Begins soundtrack 3 o'clock is fairly loud and clean. I can also get it to play more than loud enough with most of my Jazz recordings (Tord Gustavson Trio or Eva Cassidy "Live at Blues Alley" for example).

[manuel74]

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict

The only issue is volume levels. It will not play nearly as loud as the Amphora, 3MOVE or Vivid V1, which means some people wont be happy. At normal listening levels between medium and loud volumes, the volume knob is at 2:30 to 3:00 o'clock in high gain, with some slight soft clipping starting after that depending on the recording (could be clipping at 4 o'clock, or clean all the way to 5 o'clock). So, how loud it goes definitely depends on the recording. With infected mushroom "Dancing with the Kadafi" it clips after 3 o'clock and is not loud enough to jam to, but with Batman Begins soundtrack 3 o'clock is fairly loud and clean. I can also get it to play more than loud enough with most of my Jazz recordings (Tord Gustavson Trio or Eva Cassidy "Live at Blues Alley" for example).

The problem of volume levels probably is due to output power specs of only 100mw at 32 ohm (see this message), considering that HD800 is 300 ohm the output power drop in a considerable manner...
For V1 I've seen 100 mw at 300 ohm from your review, and for Pico is 200 mw at 300 ohm (see this message).
Do you think the situation could be better with other opamp in D10 ?

I cannot find any data about mw output of the Predator, have you tried it with HD800 ? Do you find the volume level to be higher ?

thanks
Manuel

[HeadphoneAddict]

Originally Posted by LevA

Hi HeadphoneAddict,

I'm about to order topkit from hi-flight but want to get your idea. which would be a better option for esw10's? original topkit (743/8616) or Class A 743/8616 or the AD744 OBCA with with EL8201 ??
I mainly want it for clasical and jazz music. so looking for nice soundstage and depth - I don't like too upfront sound, I prefer some distance from the music. At the moment happy with the orginal sound signiture but anything to improve it would be nice.

thanks for all your help.

The AD744OBCA/EL8201.

Originally Posted by manuel74

The problem of volume levels probably is due to output power specs of only 100mw at 32 ohm (see this message), considering that HD800 is 300 ohm the output power drop in a considerable manner...
For V1 I've seen 100 mw at 300 ohm from your review, and for Pico is 200 mw at 300 ohm (see this message).
Do you think the situation could be better with other opamp in D10 ?

I cannot find any data about mw output of the Predator, have you tried it with HD800 ? Do you find the volume level to be higher ?

thanks
Manuel

RSA claims 250ma output with Predator, but doesn't specify the impedance. You can bump the D10 power with different buffers, but the best sounding setups don't boost the power.

[LevA]

HeadphoneAddict,

thanks for your help..It shall be AD744OBCA/EL8201 then.

[PatLogan]

Dear Larry,
I've just bought the D10, it's on at ist burn-in stage...
I opened it to roll opamps and I have some questions for you:
1. I guess we can put the opamps up-side down, can you confirm me this ?
2. I guess the buffer is the item I encircled with a red row:

Didn't find any topic that explains how to roll buffer and amps...
I believe I will buy the AD744OBCA/EL8201 kit and will make some comparison with several amps, this item sounds really interesting. I'll compare it to the DacMagic too (that's for end August).
Cheers,
Patrice

[wuwhere]

Originally Posted by PatLogan

Dear Larry,
I've just bought the D10, it's on at ist burn-in stage...
I opened it to roll opamps and I have some questions for you:
1. I guess we can put the opamps up-side down, can you confirm me this ?
2. I guess the buffer is the item I encircled with a red row:

Didn't find any topic that explains how to roll buffer and amps...
I believe I will buy the AD744OBCA/EL8201 kit and will make some comparison with several amps, this item sounds really interesting. I'll compare it to the DacMagic too (that's for end August).
Cheers,
Patrice

The one you circled in red is the opamp. The two little ICs above that are the buffers.

[HeadphoneAddict]

Originally Posted by PatLogan

Dear Larry,
I've just bought the D10, it's on at ist burn-in stage...
I opened it to roll opamps and I have some questions for you:
1. I guess we can put the opamps up-side down, can you confirm me this ?
2. I guess the buffer is the item I encircled with a red row:

Didn't find any topic that explains how to roll buffer and amps...
I believe I will buy the AD744OBCA/EL8201 kit and will make some comparison with several amps, this item sounds really interesting. I'll compare it to the DacMagic too (that's for end August).
Cheers,
Patrice

Question 2 was answered already. It uses two dual channel buffers and one dual channel opamp for the main amp. The main amp opamp can be two single channel opamps on an adapter board (like the AD744 or AD743).

Don't know what you mean by upside down in Q#1. The opamps must be aligned in only one direction. In the photo, pin #1 of the opamp is to the left and farthest corner away from the observer's position.

[PatLogan]

Thank you both for your answers.

So I assume that on the D10, the amp is made of 2 buffers and one opamp and that you can either have one dual channel OR two single channel on an adapter board on one opamp IC... (but they would look the same, for a novice like me I guess...) is there a tutorial anywhere on that matter?

Then, they provide us with alternate buffers in the box where we have 6 items? I didn't have any doc to explain what it is and what to do with it...

Concerning Q1, I wanted to know if I have to pay attention on the position of the IC. I mean, as they are perfectly symmetrical, we have 2 solutions to position them (180 rotation). Is there something to know about it? Is there a tutorial anywhere on how to change these items?

Hope this is not to technical for this thread and my english is understandable...

Cheers,

Pat

[HeadphoneAddict]

Originally Posted by PatLogan

Thank you both for your answers.

So I assume that on the D10, the amp is made of 2 buffers and one opamp and that you can either have one dual channel OR two single channel on an adapter board on one opamp IC... (but they would look the same, for a novice like me I guess...) is there a tutorial anywhere on that matter?

Then, they provide us with alternate buffers in the box where we have 6 items? I didn't have any doc to explain what it is and what to do with it...

Concerning Q1, I wanted to know if I have to pay attention on the position of the IC. I mean, as they are perfectly symmetrical, we have 2 solutions to position them (180 rotation). Is there something to know about it? Is there a tutorial anywhere on how to change these items?

Hope this is not to technical for this thread and my english is understandable...

Cheers,

Pat

There is a u-shaped indentation, either physical or painted on, at the end where pin one resides. Sometimes the solder pad around where pin 1 enters the opamp board is square, instead of round like the other pins.