UPDATED 2/22 REVIEW 13 USB DAC amp - Predator, Pico, 2/3MOVE, D10 D3 D2 Viper/Boa D1, Lyrix, MicroAmp, Vivid V1, Nuforce, XM5

[HeadphoneAddict]

UPDATE #5, 3/26/08 1:00AM - 2MOVE and MODIFIED D2 UPDATE

I just spent the last 9-10 hours with all the amps, and a well burned in 2MOVE from Skylab. I first listened them all with the ALO modded HFI-780, but my current sinus infection must be boosting the vampire wire 780's bass a bit too much vs 7-10 days ago. So, I switched to my APS re-cabled RS-1 for more detail and layering, and more balanced bass, and listened to everything again. Having just gotten the APS re-cabled RS-1 and also re-cabled my Edition 9, it is an eye opener into hearing that the ALO modded HFI-780 are darker and bassier and less open at quiet volumes than I remember with the first part of the review (they do open up at higher volumes but louder make my sinus headache worse). Right now I am preferring the RS-1 and Edition 9 vs my 780's with 666 hours on them (don't laugh, that's how many hours they have ).

All Amps were reviewed as before, using only their USB DAC as source, via Macbook. The D2 was also tested with new opamps, with a LM6172 replacing the LT1364, and a THS4032 replacing the NE5532.

I used the same music as in the first test, but had to add a few more items: "Handel Messiah" conductor Christopher Hogwood, William Orbit "The Best of Strange Cargo", James Asher "Shaman Drums", Guinea Pig "Cool Cats", Jack Johnson. I also threw in various pop artists from my kid's music in 128kbps to test with poor sources.

The 2MOVE sounded closer to the Predator than the PICO, but with a little more treble extension and what I would call a slight midbass hump that I did not hear in the Predator other amps. The 2MOVE was what I would call warm and mellow - but not dark as it had a little bit more treble up top, in between the Predqtor and PICO (like the D2). The Predator seems to have a little better bass presence, especially helpful with the RS-1 which I feel are usually a little bass shy with bowls. The Predator's high end was also more suited to the RS-1 and HFI-780's which already have a strong treble presence. Bass and treble were not overpowering with any of the amps with the RS-1.

The 2MOVE was more forward and up front than the Predator or Pico, which didn't help the soundstage with Handel's Messiah when listening via the RS-1. The 2MOVE still has excellent ambience and detail of the large venue, but you are definitely closer to the choir. The Predator's bigger soundstage was itself beaten by the Pico by a small margin, which produced a more 3D Cathedral space. With one small studio recording (Tsuyoshi Yamamoto on FIM XRCD), I can almost hear the drums and cymbals echo off the walls with the 2MOVE, but that coloration does not appear to be there with any of the other amps.

The 2MOVE with piano and saxophone was sweet and seductive, like the Predator, where you could hear the warmth and the reedyness both at the same time. Where the 2MOVE also excelled was in acoustic music like Jack Johnson, like in "Badfish" on Look at the Love We Found, or "Times Like These" from the "On and On" album.

ALL the amps did electronic music well, like William Orbit, Chris Spheeris, James Asher. And ALL the amps are particularly ruthless with poor quality Mp3, revealing the poor dynamics and compression artifacts. With ALL of the amps I heard a grating quality with my kids' 128kbps pop/hip hop like Plain White T's. The Fray, Cartel, Avril Lavigne, Boys like Girls, Chris Brown, Wyclef Jean, Rihanna, Fergie, etc, which rubbed me the wrong way.

Back to the good stuff. What surprised me was listening to Diana Krall - the PICO just sounds more natural and transparent with songs from "Girl in the Other Room". This album gets included every time I do a review because it is mastered with some sibilance or harsh highs still remaining, so it makes a good test album to see how the amps or headphones handle it. While the Pico handles this the best, just above the Predator, I thought the 2MOVE was the most irritating of the amps with this partitcular album, and this hurt it's score. However, with the low-bitrate kid's music above, it was no more irritating than any of the other amps.

Now we get to the D2 with rolled opamps, using the LM6172 and THS4032 opamps, which would be about $25-30. The opamp change definitely changes the character if the amp, and it is less "Pico-Like" and more 2MOVE-like, except that it handles the one Diana Krall CD a little better/smoother, and it is slightly less forward, and the midbass hump is less. So, I guess that makes it more predator-like then? The D2 does Saxophones VERY well now vs stock. It is like magic, wave the wand, and the D2 is transmorgrified into something else.

Having picked out the areas where one amp excels over the others, or falls behind the others, it makes it even harder to rank the top 4 amps. The Predator, 2MOVE and modified D2 sound the closest to each other's sound signature or flavor. While the Pico and stock D2 sound the closest to each other's sound signature. A similar sound signature is a "reminds me of" NOT a "sounds just like". That puts the amps in 2 camps, yet makes all the rankings fall between a 9.4/10 and a 10/10, and in my opinion too close to call based on sound alone.

The D2 with rolled opamps I feel is a little better than the 2MOVE, while the 2MOVE is better than the stock D2. So, my ranking has a tie for 3rd, and a tie for 4th...

1. RSA Predator (good bass and soundstage, more body, organic, full)
2. D2 with rolled opamps (LM6172/THS4032 - balanced, not too forward, sweet/magical Saxophone, almost mesmerizing like Predator, almost tied)
3. 2MOVE (sweet mids and saxophone, midbass hmmm, failed the bad mastering diana krall test, great detail and air, too large and heavy)
3. PICO (smooth and transparent without coloration, Great DAC, won the bad mastering Diana Krall test, but nothing special with piano and sax like the others, too neutral as an amp - how is that possible, maybe not because there is something around 2Khz that is not right with RS-1)
4. D1 with rolled opamps (AD743 main/LMH6643 buffer/LTC6241HV DAC - powerful, punchy, energetic, alive)
4. D2 stock (thin in the middle, neutral with good bass,)
5. Lyrix (good frequency balance, lacking details and air vs the others)
6. D1 stock opamps (put AD823/NE5532/AD8616 back in right before I shipped it back for the 2-3db channel imbalance, too edgy and bright and distant)

Originally Posted by Raw notes jotted down while listening:

Predator - ALO 780 = less treble extension, best bass
Predator - RS-1
Handel mellow, good soundstage
Yamamoto piano good
Diana Krall voice smoother than 2move
Jazz at Pawn - smooth, natural live
William Orbit - punchy

2MOVE - ALO 780 like Predator with more treble, mid bass hump
2MOVE RS-1
Handel mellow forward
Yamamoto good piano
Diana Krall good bass, voice grating
Jazz at Pawn sax sweet
William Orbit - punchy

PICO - ALO 780 clean bass, transparent
PICO RS-1
Handel more 3D soundstage, clear airy
Yamamoto bright piano, wrong
Diana Krall best voice
Jazz at Pawn - saxaphone thin
William Orbit - punchy

D2 modded - ALO 780 like MOVE but not as bright & less midbass hump
D2 modded RS-1
Handel open slt more highs, violins closer than singer?
Yamamoto less bright vs pico
Diana Krall not bad at all
Jazz at Pawn - sax sweet/magical
William Orbit - punchy

[HeadphoneAddict]

I will never spend 9-10 hours with headphones on my head again - my ears are killing me, as the grado rub the ears wrong, and the 780 clamp too much. Ouch, I am tender. I'll have to stick with the STAX Lambda Signature and Edition 9 for the next couple of days, or my Livewires customs.

[shinew]

ouch, 9 hours is long time to be on headphones, i can't stand my hd600 on for more than 2-3hrs. I can listen to er4 all day though

seems to me the 2move offers the best bang for the buck. I wonder if i should buy a predator to compare it w/ my 2move and keep the one i like the most...

BTW, which track & timing of the Diana Krall - The Gril in the Other Room are you refering to? I would like to check it out with my 2move. thanks.

[MONVMENTVM]

Wow nice review again.

Did the D2 with the rolled opamps have time to burn in or are these fresh?

[jamato8]

Great job! thank you. The music and contrasts you indicate help. Amazing how far amps have come.

[Skylab]

Nice job Larry! This really is a great, helpful review.

[tako_tsubo]

Great information Larry! But 10 hours? give your ears a rest...sit in a tub of hot water in silence for awhile

[mchang]

Originally Posted by Manny Calavera

I think many of the peeps jumping on the other bandwagon are not getting thier moneys worth,imho.

Sigh. Why does your "success" have to come at the expense of other's "failures?"

[mchang]

Very good write-up. I enjoyed the comparisons with the different albums/genres and the notes provided. Go rest those ears!

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict

UPDATE #5, 3/26/08 1:00AM - 2MOVE and MODIFIED D2 UPDATE

[onlychild]

Thanks for taking the time to do these reviews for us Larry.

[pfillion]

Great review Larry ! (You convinced me to send my RS-1 to Apuresound.. )

BTW, I have received my Predator this morning ! Ordered Tuesday and received today

[TheMarchingMule]

Originally Posted by pfillion

Great review Larry ! (You convinced me to send my RS-1 to Apuresound.. )

BTW, I have received my Predator this morning ! Ordered Tuesday and received today

I'm really thinking of getting my RS-2 re-cabled because the cheap cable is starting to bug me...

And holy cow, that is a super fast shipping time. All the better for you though, eh?

[pfillion]

hehe

I'll post some pictures tonight, the amp is soooo beautiful and small

Originally Posted by TheMarchingMule

I'm really thinking of getting my RS-2 re-cabled because the cheap cable is starting to bug me...

And holy cow, that is a super fast shipping time. All the better for you though, eh?

[HeadphoneAddict]

Here are my opamp rolling notes that I took as I rolled them in my D2 on 3/22 and 3/23 and listened. I posted these in the D2 viper thread 3am 3/23/08. Since that time I put about 20-30 hours on the new opamps: http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/iba...ml#post3983621

[quote=HeadphoneAddict]
1) I am first listening to the ISL55002 in main (replaced the 1364) and and THS4032 in the second spot (replaced NE5532). This is really nice with the ALO modded 780's (in same room as sleeping wife, so no open phones).

It is not what I expected, but rather with strong bass, smooth highs that are less accentuated than stock when teamed with the 780, and it's very transparent. Pianos and snares are crisp and attack and decay is good. Drums sound good, and bass guitar is tight. Saxophone are nice but maybe a liittle of the warmth is missing on those. Diana Krall's voice in "Temptation" does not have sibilance, and that is my test track for sssssibilance. I have no trouble hearing the knocking artifacts from the piano in "Departure Bay", from pedals and such. Next, the 6172 x 2.

2) Immediately I hear the sound is more forward with the LM6172 x 2, and some of the background is pushed out of the way to make the singer come forward. It is a more intimate warm mellow sound, reminiscent of the first time I heard the Meier Headsix.

The sound of the piano pedals is more of a booming low frequency background noise, makes me want to look up an look for where it coming from. Saxaphones seem to be lacking a little bit of the reedyness, but they are warmer.

Playback volume seems lower too. YIKES!!! I just flipped to high gain since the volume was low, and lost the left channel! And it's not the headphones or macbook. This is gonna suck - unplugging it and turning it off didn't bring the left channel back, and all I did was flip the gain switch just now.

Arghhhh!!!

3) Can't believe I am continuing this after my scare. Turning off, unplugging, and removing and replacing the the opamps with stock ones got me both channels back. It sounded good enough that I almost quit right there. But, I wouldn't be a HeadphoneAddict if I didn't keep going.

I think that one LM6172 (soic on browndog) plus stock NE5532 offers more volume than two 6172, and offers a less closed in sound, while still being a little intimate. This still tames the treble for me.

I immediately swapped the 1364 back in, and I moved back from 1st row to 3rd row, with a slight jump in highs and less warmth. The two 6172 has me ON the stage, but I like one LM6172 + NE5532 better than two 6172.

Leaving the NE5532 I then swapped in the THS4032 in the main, and the intimacy dropped more, and the venue opened up without boosting the treble much.

Then the ISL55002 went in, and the treble came back up, soundstage remained wide open and not forward, and it reminded me of the 1364.

The 6172 went back in, and I still liked it more (although all of them sound good). Next I will try replacing the NE5532.

4) I put the DIP 6172 back in place of NE5532, while the SOIC/browndog 6172 was still in main, and left channel is gone again.

I put NE5532 back in and I have both channels.

So, I swapped the DIP version to the main, and moved the SOIC/browndog to the second IC = same missing lt channel. Then I pulled the SOIC from the secondary IC, put the NE5532 back in, both channels are back.

So, either 6172 works in main, but I can't use both or I lose left channel. Wierd.

So, I kept the DIP 6172 in LR, and pulled the NE5532 to install the THS4032. WOW! This combo works for me better than ISL55002 as the main opamp with the THS4032, which is more distant in the mids. But, the bass kinda big when using these HFI-780, but tolerable (any more bass and I'd be worried). With this cpmbo, the saxophone regains that magic, with a combination of BOTH warmth and reedyness. LIVE NIGHT CLUB JAZZ MUSIC SOUNDS LIVE. I am having difficulty changing this or stopping the music. "Help, I'm listening to music and I can't get up"!

You have to try the LM6172 in place of the 1364 and the THS4032 in place of the NE5532. I am leaving this alone for now. And still listening. Can't... pull... myself... away...

5) Then the D2 battery ran out. So, I set it aside to charge, and started playing with my 3G nano and Headsix, changing it to low gain for my livewires. Another Wow. I am still listening to that setup 2 hours later!

[HeadphoneAddict]

I had a question about how many opamps go in the amp why more than one. From my limited knowledge, in 4-channel amps there is also an opamp in the ground channel = 2 total opamps. This is not 4 audio channels like quadrophonic, but 2 main and 2 ground channels.

See the post above:

I mentioned the LM6172 replaces the LT1364 (near the tip of the battery and by the 3.5mm jacks. I stated the THS4032 replaces the NE5532, which is closer to the tail end of the amp, to the side the battery. You just observe the orientation of pin 1 before you remove them, but if I recall pin one is closest to the 3.5mm jacks on the 1364, and closest to the battery on the 5532.

If the chips you selected are SOIC (SOIC = solder on integrated circuit) and need to go on a single browndog DIP adapter (DIP = dual insertion process). HiFlight sells these pre-soldered for people, so PM him if you are not competant.