IE8 burn-in: Mass Hysteria?

[HONEYBOY]

Originally Posted by -X-[ FuZe ]-X-

I'm sure you can interpret a simple frequency response graph...



Look at that huge bass hump on the IE8. In the way it curves, yes it follows the Sennheiser's sound signature but in volume intensity it's no where near it.

I know am getting overbearing with this now but If I were to judge the IE8s based on that graph I'd have never bought them. I now have them and they're my best pair of IEMs yet. Yes, IE8 has an upper bass hump when you seal them in but when I wear them with small tips and partial sealing it becomes rather bass lite having less bass than a SE530. I can safely say that

[zardos]

Originally Posted by ppau0822

cant really be psychological as i didn't really listen to them that much, just the songs that i chose to, for this purpose.

It still can be psychological because you read many comments about IE8 stating there is a burn in effect. Therefor you also hear it because you want to be part of the group of 'experienced' and 'mindful' IE8 users.

[A_Dying_Wren]

Originally Posted by zardos

It still can be psychological because you read many comments about IE8 stating there is a burn in effect. Therefor you also hear it because you want to be part of the group of 'experienced' and 'mindful' IE8 users.

Well, its not always the case. I'm a relative newbie to the hi-fi world and even I have my opinions of various earphones like the TF 10s and the Atrio M5s which vastly differ from most of the "experienced" and "mindful" hi-fiers have reported; and I don't feel a need to be part of that group and settle with something I think is subpar.

Isn't there more metrics to a earphone than frequency response btw? Can't something be said for the tightness of the the notes or the soundstage presented?

[winwin]

I believe that burn-in is real. I remember my ex500 and sr60i when I first tried them,it's muddy and frequencies are overlapping with each other. After a lot of burn in, clarity crept in and bass seems more present and less muddy.

[david1978jp]

I don't know about IE8. I bought another Denon D5000 two weeks ago as a gift, out of curiosity, I compared it to my 3 years old Denon D5000. They sound like totally two different headphones !!! I know, I know, someone will tell me, new stocks are made in another country, not as same as before...

[Beyerfan70]

It's all in your head!
There is no such thing as burn in,never has,never will be.
Its just you getting used to them.
As far as the Ie8 goes ive had mine now for a good while and they sound the same now as they did from day one.
Same as all my dynamic iems and full size cans,same sound now as they were out the box!

[scrane]

I was surprised at the response from Headroom saying there was no difference they could measure between pre and post burn in ie8s. They did not specify that the initial readings were from a brand new set of ie8s, though it would be hard to imagine more of a bass hump than that graphed. They also did not mention specifically square wave response comparisons pre and post.
I am not convinced there is no audible difference between pre and post burn in with the ie8s. Our ears are sensitive to many things beyond just frequency response.
The obvious next step would be a blind tests using brand new and a "broken in" sets of ie8s under somewhat controlled conditions.
I personally started burning in my ie8s from the moment I got them, with intermittent listening periods. I can't say for sure if they improved over that period, but I will say I like them more now than ever before. (I also like my wife now more than ever before, but she has more than 200 hours on her.)
I work in an industry that uses many micro electronic transducers. Linear motors, piezo drivers, &etc in a very precisely controlled environment (semiconductor manufacturing). If we had to worry about "burn in" in our components we would be in big trouble. Therefore I have always been suspicious of the burn in phenomenon, but I am also aware that many thoughtful, intellegent people believe in it and hear the difference.
So, now we have a dilemma. Is it true or not? Or is it important? We hear what we want to hear. Our hearing changes. Our taste in music changes. Our politics, values and expectations change. Let's approach this as an interesting philosophical question, sit back, plug in, and go aaaah.
Sandy.

[dwizard]

I've been lurking Head-Fi for a few years now and it always makes me smile when people say things like:
"... the soundstage improved after X hours..." or "... the bass gets tighter after X hours..." it's not just headphones but amps too.
Burn-in is a myth, we should get MythBusters to test it. If burn-in was real the manufacturers would tell us to burn our headphones in.
What is really happening is that you are getting used to the sound signature after X hours.

It's easy to prove or disprove burn-in with modern technology but can you find a credible test proving it's true with google?

Now there may be a little burn-in required for speakers because the large speaker diaphragm has to loosen but this happens within minutes by the speaker test phase before they even leave the manufacturers.

[Rip N' Burn]

[QUOTE=dwizard;5918140]If burn-in was real the manufacturers would tell us to burn our headphones in.
What is really happening is that you are getting used to the sound signature after X hours.
/QUOTE]

There is a tag on the Maximo iM-590's that says:
"For best performance: (1) "Burn In" the earphones first by playing music at moderately high volume for 8-10 hours....."

Review: Maximo iM-590 headphones

Here is a link to where 'Break-in/Burn-in" was performed for a certain amount of hours and shows differences in results with different parameters.

How the Audax AP100Z0 loudspeaker drivers were broken-in and the T/S parameters measured.

Before and after break-in summary
Fs Vas Qms Qes Qts Le L1 R1
Before 92.5 2.18 2.93 0.95 0.71 0.16 0.29 14.1
After 79.6 2.85 2.63 0.81 0.62 0.16 0.30 14.2
Change 14% 24% 10% 15% 13% 0% 3% 1%

[Cahayahati3105]

for my IE8 and yuin PK1, they have much improvement on the sound quality after burning in a few hours...

[dosley01]

Oh no!, here we go again. Deja Vu
I though this topic was beaten to death in the last thread....

[Bilavideo]

The only burn-in that makes any sense to me is something analogous to repeatedly washing your Levi's - back when Levi's were initially sold as lead pants. Some things in life come stiff, and for valid reasons. You have to work them in a bit to loosen them up. It's not unreasonable to expect as much with a cone's suspension. Of course, this may just be hi-fi geeks imagining better sound through repeated use. If there's reason to think that a speaker might sound better after a little use, there's also reason to wonder what kind of reliability a speaker would have if its suspension could be loosened up so easily.

[PhilS]

Originally Posted by dosley01

I though this topic was beaten to death in the last thread....

No, you're wrong. It was beaten to death three years ago (at least). Since then, the topic has been cut up into little pieces, burned, rolled over by a steam roller, rung through a shredder, dynamited, and had acid poured on it. It is not dead. It will never die.

[Ed Seedhouse]

Originally Posted by PhilS

No, you're wrong. It was beaten to death three years ago (at least).

More like thirty years, if you ask me.

Since then, the topic has been cut up into little pieces, burned, rolled over by a steam roller, rung through a shredder, dynamited, and had acid poured on it. It is not dead. It will never die.

You are right, of course.

Well, humans as a species only learned to gain useful knowledge by systematically discerning between real evidence and non evidence around three or four hundred years ago. Our schools teach nothing of it even today. Our "science" education concentrates on what scientists have discovered instead of how it was discovered, which is the really important part.

It is hardly surprising that most people take advantage of technology but know virtually nothing of how it comes about, nor that what little they do know is often largely wrong. So of course beliefs that rest on little or no actual evidence are still widespread among us. I place headphone "burn in" in that category and occasionally try to help by chiming in on what I regard as the rational side.

But given the general situation in society today we can expect little success in the near term, and such things to continue without end until we start to educate ourselves and our children about what is, and is not, actually evidence.

Fortunately for society as a whole enough of us have become educated to allow actual progress to happen despite the obstacles. Whether that will be enough to allow us to survive in the face of widespread irrationality will be, in my estimation, a near thing. But then I am old and cynical.

[scrane]

Originally Posted by dosley01

Oh no!, here we go again. Deja Vu
I though this topic was beaten to death in the last thread....

I only started this thread because Headroom provided some real evidence that burn in does not occur in the ie8. I am not sure if any real evidence has ever been provided one way or the other. Sorry to waste your time.